If you’re charged VAT will you remove your child from their private school? I’m v stressed!

[Liikklu]

We won’t be able to pay the increase. Only hope is asking grandparents for the shortfall which we don’t want to do. Anyone else in a similar boat? Do you think it will literally be a 20% increase on fees or will schools absorb some of it? Our school has said they will address the matter ‘if and when’ it applies.

@Ginfluencr

In the area we lived previously there was a real dearth of secondary schools and the only two options available were pretty terrible (think scanners for knives on the way in).

As our daughter was smart enough to get into a grammar school that was what we went for, if that didn't work we were going to have to move as we couldn't in all conscience send her to any of the ones available locally and feel that we were doing our duty as our parents.

So much glee on this thread at the thought of kids suffering upheaval, it's toxic. You don't have to agree with private ed but clapping your hands and giggling in glee because kids and teenagers richer than yours are going to suffer is a bit sad honestly. They're still children.

I don’t get why people don’t see private schools are a win/win in a utilitarian sense. There is something like 554,316 pupils in private education as of 2023. Average cost per child in the state sector is £7,460 anually. That represents a saving of £4.14 billion to the taxpayer for all those being privately educated that would need to be state educated otherwise. Average cost for a boarder at a UK Private school is £34,790, so even assuming EVERY student was a border (which they aren’t btw I’m being as generous as I can in favour of Starmer’s policy here!) a 20% VAT would yield £3.85 billion to the treasury. That leaves us at a £290,000,000 shortfall. In general we ALL benefit from the existence of private education overall.

Now if you are really wedded to the notion that Private schools are so unfair they shouldn’t exist, more power to you that’s a perfectly morally consistent position to hold (I don’t happen to share it, but I can respect it if someone does). Note I do believe they are unfair, I just view the overall net benefit to society as a whole is greater than the level of inequality it creates. However abolition of the Private sector is not currently on the table, and this half measure does nothing more than drive MORE inequality and not less. What you’d see is a reduction in scholarships and bursaries awarded to poorer families that otherwise would never have the opportunity plus all those in the middle who can just about afford the fees but the VAT hike would destroy their ability to do so. The truly mega rich as usual would absorb the cost or even just send their kids abroad for schooling (thus escaping the whole VAT thing entirely). I do not send my child to a private school either for the record.

Now I say this as someone who is about to likely vote Labour for the first time, as this policy as economically incoherent as it is, and as likely to drive inequality and not shrink it trumps the hell out of the Conservatives National Service policy. I would much rather our young people face a stretched education system than potential Russian bombs and bullets in the future. Plus the Tories have presided over a succession of policies that have damaged and not strengthened our economy there really is no defending them at this point. Plus I believe Starmer is much more moderate than Corbyn ever was, so I’ll hold my nose and give him a shot.

The VAT on school places is a terrible idea. Although I wouldn’t send my child to a private school (I think they create their own issues) I think they can provide a valuable educational resource. As such, I think they should be as affordable yi as many people as possible and shouldn’t charge VAT..

Making them less affordable will increase pressures on the state system. It will push up prices round “good” schools even further, excluding many pupils. Whilst there is inequality in wealth there will always be inequality in education.

The VAT on private schools is purely ideologically driven and is likely to raise nothing and cost a lot more both in funding the extra state places and creating further inequality in the state system as well as pushing up house prices in “decent” areas even further.

This is the problem with most Labour policies. They sound great in the 6th form common room but don’t work in the real world. What worse is this ideology will impact many children and their education.

I fear that you over estimate how informed the average voter is likely to be. Jealously, xenophobia and myopia are alive, thriving and coming to a polling both near you.

We’ll be keeping our kids in their private school regardless, but they are in their last 2/3!years of senior school. If we were starting out we would be looking at other options. I think you have to also look at the possibility of additional increases over time depending on how long your kids have left. We’ve had nearly a 20% increase in fees over the past few years as it is due to energy costs and teacher’s pensions. I doubt this will be the end of the rises.

Quite. People should be careful what they wish for. This move isn’t good for anyone. There will always be inequality in education, this will just put more pressure on the state system and make it even harder to get into a decent state school. It won’t affect us as we can weather the storm and it won’t affect the wealthy either.

Starmer is playing politics of envy. This nasty attack on private schools will not create more equality - as private schools willl continue, it will just flood the state system overnight with families that have really stretched to afford them.

Start researching good local alternatives op, and remember this will rake years to move through the courts, appeals etc. Get everyone you know to vote for the conservatives. Even a hung parliament would make a difference, as the Liberal Democrat’s do NOT support this policy at all.

We just moved from a state primary to a private school. £ 2.5m houses surround our state school, and the percentage of free school meals is 2%. So what you get then is no additional support from the council. Y2 with 30 kids and only one teacher - no money for a TA. No money for the heating bill. The PTA regularly raises £70k+ a year. No support for the children. They need any support - learning or emotional. A constant stream of kids coming and leaving. A lot of behavioural issues. I was a class rep, I was on the PTA, but my child was coming home crying each day as the school was batshit. Unrealistic expectations from a six-year-old - write an essay and read 2 chapter books a week. All of this is because they want to get an outstanding rating. So, no, I couldn’t care less about the VAT and what “inequality” this breeds. I have tried but won’t see my child crushed by “she has to write essays” at six or not meeting the expectations. The whole thing is messed up. Vote as you wish, but the kids in the private schools will go back to the state system and take up more state spaces.

I also imagine university students are up next….
This is a damaging attack on education and children and so pointless! It will achieve absolutely nothing but overcrowded state schools.

I wouldn't stress too much. Nothing has come to fruition yet. The only thing you can do is cross the bridge when you get to it.

Also - for what it's worth, I went to state primary and secondary and then private 6th form. I much preferred state school. I found there was a lot more academic and pastoral support, and I was actually pushed to teach my full potential.

I'm also very much a believer that you get out what you put in. The state school I went to was far from the best. I'd say it was one of the few schools that actually fits the MN stereotype of state secondary schools. It was probably worse to be fair.
Yet the vast majority of my state school friends got high grades, went to very good universities, have well paid careers and were homeowners of houses in good areas by their mid 20s. My state school friends have actually overtaken most of my private school friends career wise.

If it comes to it, state school isn't the worst option in the world as long as children are willing to put the work in.

Oh and before someone inevitably jumps on me this isn't a reverse to slyly brag about myself - I didn't mention myself because I fell pregnant during 6th form so my life took an entirely different path.

Only 27% of uni students are expected to pay for their loans in full. Given the public sector makes up the shortfall I'm not sure that there will be much appetite to lumber everyone with an added tax on tuition costs.

p.s., my older daughter has just finished her Masters degree in Aerospace Engineering, if we hadn't got her into the grammar school and she'd just gone to the local secondary that would not be the case.

We didn't have to pay for her to get there as we were lucky enough to have a Grammar school we could get her in to.

We absolutely would not have been able to pay for a private education otherwise so she would have been a very smart kid left on the periphery wondering what could have been under Labour.

Not every county has good grammar schools. Many simply do not have that option at all. Not all the grammars are good either…

Absolutely. Labour are far more interested in pulling people down to the sane level than raising them up.

My experience precisely. I live in the catchment if one of the best seconds schools in the country and the low level disruption is continual and takes away so much of the learning time. And yet no one seems to be rolling their sleeves up and wading in with a sense of urgency to sort it out. Those who’s job if is to sort it out all seem to be determined to look the other way.

Labour seem hell bent on dragging the whole country down - this is just the start.

They will clobber the professionals next with eye watering taxes which will force a capital flight. Many are moving assets and businesses out already.

Labour seem to be allergic to anything that works, that is successful and ambitious. Unless we are all scrabbling at the bottom hands outstretched they won’t be happy. It’s a particularly toxic culture in the Labour Party of genuinely detesting anyone that is doing well at anything.

This is true, and we ran into this when they changed the rules in the West Midlands just before my youngest took the eleven plus.

She also, like her sister was very smart and we were confident we could get her into the local grammar school. However, just before she took the eleven plus they changed their rules so you had to be within the West Midlands border and we were 500m outside and couldn't afford to move.

We had to send her to the local, pretty bad, secondary school, (there was only really a choice of two she could get into).

She went downhill there but we kept her on the waiting list for the Grammar school, a place came up and she got it as the waiting list was not dependent on catchment area, only on scores (not sure how or why since they'd changed the other criteria, but happy it stayed the same!)

The lack of PRUs and the willingness to use them is the entire reason why mySEN child is at private school. If the state system could provide a peaceful, safe education for my child who is keen to learn. She’d be happy to attend school. They couldn’t. I’d rather send her to a private school than have her refusing to go at all.

I wouldn’t mind so much but it’s not like Starmer is pledging to INVEST in state schools with a funded policy to raise the bar in ALL schools! He just wants to take out the ones that are doing well.

It’s unbelievable to me that anyone would support Labour. Do they not realise their overstretched state school will be at breaking point when it’s forced to accommodate hundreds of unfunded children?

How will exhausted burnt out teachers cope when the classes double and so does the work load? They will be going on strike again, walking out and running thread after thread on here despite supporting this policy in the main from what I can see.

Hi OP,

Our DD is also in private school. Your school is right not to say anything for the time being as we simply don’t know when, how or even if this measure will be implemented. Also, schools will likely not have to up their fees by 20% as they’ll be able to offset part of the VAT as all businesses do.

I wouldn’t worry too much about it, certainly wouldn’t remortgage to pay the fees, and would start looking at state options just to be on the safe side.

All the best!

You do realise this is an anonymous forum, don't you? People are entitled to speak as they find, within MN rules, and this in no way reflects on how they would speak as a teacher.

I’d love to know where all these SEN friendly secondary schools are. I had to move my kid to state school in year 5 to get an EHCP for a place in state secondary as no independent schools would even meet us as he has an ASD diagnosis.

The one school the we had targeted had just changed hands into foreign ownership and would not take any pupils with more than ‘mild dyslexia’. My DS had exceptional CAT4 scores but still nowhere wanted him. We could easily afford the extra 20%

Moving him was fine and he is happy in an ASD hub in a state school. The school isn’t ’high performing’ but the kids are happy enough. People need to suck up the increases and calm down. I will be voting Labour for the first time in 20 years in the hope they will improve funding for SEN children’s education and improving the secondary education system in general.

No, in the same way that car drivers don't get a rebate from bus and rail companies.