How soon might a Labour Government put 20% VAT tax on private school fees?

[jennylamb1]

That really. Given that an election date has been declared for July, how soon might a Labour Government set their first budget?

It’s a spiteful policy aimed directly at children, who by accident of birth are born into families who value education or are wealthy.
My DS was privately educated, for many reasons. We are not super wealthy and if he had had siblings we would have been unable to afford it.
Many of DS’s friends have younger siblings whose parents are facing difficult decisions. They have carefully planned and budgeted for school fees for all their children but with the potential increase they are likely to be forced out into state schools.
Ultimately it’s the disruption to the child’s education that VAT will impact.

Improve how?

if I have to (I don’t) move my kids to state school then I will use the spare money for extra classes, specialist tutors, holiday to interesting places instead of camping every year. what make you think that I will invest my time and effort in the school they attend to see no immediate rewards?

If the current parents, students, teachers of state schools cannot do anything about their school, a few extra parents won’t be able to.

I would be quite happy for private schools for children with additional needs to be exempt from VAT.

I'm not that worried about those kids quite honestly. I'm more worried about the ones who can't afford to feed theirs. Get over yourselves.
Only 6% go to these schools, everyone else survives very well

Sorry not rtft

It won’t happen.

Most people with sen kids can't afford the private schools

Oh well

Near me schools are charging around 30k a year and have been wildly increasing fees each year anyway so I assume they are charging what the market will bear rather than linking to their expenses really. Will be interesting to see if they make any changes to fees.

@GHGN Indeed. Not to mention LEA’s are just not interested. So I totally agree.

Anyone remember Dyson wanted to gift his old state school £6million. He was refuse as they were not allowed to accept!! What a joke.

People can’t see the woods for the trees. Or the best option for the sheer sad spite.

🤷‍♀️ Well done 👏🏻

We've just prepaid ours for the next two years until DS2 finishes school. Not ideal, but felt like a bet worth taking just in case. Is that an option for you/at your school?

As incompetent as Labour are, they’re apparently putting in place retrospective VAT in case people think they can work around by paying in advance.

The petty bitterness is off the scale.

They aren't even in government yet so won't be able to apply their policy to our prepayment but perhaps it will apply if prepaid if/when they are elected. Who knows? We felt like it was a trade worth taking and the school offered us a discount too which was helpful.

Does anyone currently gleeful about the VAT understand the above?

Nah of course not!

Not even mentioned the precedent of Vat on private school education services leaves the door open for VAT on other forms of education.

They aren't even in government yet so won't be able to apply their policy to our prepayment but perhaps it will apply if prepaid if/when they are elected. Who knows? We felt like it was a trade worth taking and the school offered us a discount too which was helpful.

This is not correct. No idea if they will but of course they could make the relevant period the time the service is supplied rather than the time the payment was made - this would be pretty standard for how tax is calculated. Depending on the terms of your prepayment with the school, the school may not be able to recover the payment from you though.

There's a chance it won't happen but until Labour have the full manifesto launch, get into No. 10 and then do their first budget, it could be as late as October, or November for actual implementation.

My children went to state primary school and then to our local grammar school .
Many of their friends at Grammar school were at private prep prior to secondary . Quite a few struggled at Grammar because they were not actually academic ,they had been to prep and tutored for 11+ for at least 18 months prior to exam . My children just had one hour a week tutoring for a couple of terms before the 11+ .
People really need to be careful with their expectations for their children.

Wow not sure what I did to piss you off so much

YOU don't have a clue what MY life is like! Shall I spell it out for you? Paying school fees means this: no holidays UK or abroad, no new clothes, a 22 year old car, a kitchen that's falling to bits, no restaurants or take aways, extremely careful budgeting all the time. My whole life is bloody AUSTERITY! Why is Labour targeting hard working people who have already been taxed on their earnings? I'm not a plutocrat with children at Eton - I work extremely hard in the NHS to send my bright dyslexic DS to a private school because he was written off by his state school. However, if you're a banker you have no need to worry as Labour have stated they will not reinstate the cap on their bonuses (removed by arch-Tory Liz Truss) and they also have no plans to increase corporation tax. I'm astonished by the level of hypocrisy and ignorance here....⁸

In dd2s private school about a quarter of her year are on the SEN register, it’s known as a great place for kids with autism and adhd like dd2. We can easily afford the rise but plenty of her friends won’t be able to. One of them has dyslexia and couldn’t cope in her state school so moved to private. Its a bigger issue than you’d think affecting more children. The parents could potentially apply for an EHCP but that process takes about 3 years because our local authority reject applications and delay the process to avoid paying for these kids.

something I haven’t seen mentioned is that in my area most of the specialist SEN schools are also independent so does this mean that local authorities also have to pay the VAT on kids with an EHCP? I hope the Labour Party are planning on increasing funding for council’s education budgets to fund the extra costs of special schools and to grow them because so many autistic children could not cope in a large 6 to 8 form secondary school they’ll maybe need to build more specialist schools and they’re usually much more costly. One specialist school near me charges the council about £90k a year for a child to go there but I think others are closer to £30k a year. I do wonder if Labour have done any budgeting on how much it’ll cost to support Sen kids.

They've said that they won't charge VAT for children who have an EHCP - but that they want to exempt the child not the school.

As you've said, many children with SEN in private schools don't have one, and there's a long wait even for children with quite obvious needs. A wait which will only get longer now that parents who may not have got one before will need to. And Scotland don't issue them, so no one seems sure what will happen for Scottish children.

@stealthninjamum I'll put bets that a lot of those children who are doing so well with support will be left to fail rather than any help allocated to them.

Thank you, that’s good to know there’ll be no VAT on EHCPs although I hope they have plans on how to support those with SEN who don’t get an EHCP but can’t cope in a big state school.

i also think there’s a whole area to think about around the services that private schools offer like usage of their grounds for clubs. In my area the councils are trying to close swimming pools to save money. Already most lessons are in private schools. And most holiday clubs are in private schools. Will the schools charge VAT on usage of their facilities because that would affect everyone not just private school parents?

@Marjoriefrobisher DS1 was awarded a place at an independent specialist school and was also offered a place at a local independent non-specialist school.

It was not an easy process but a process does exist to place an SN child with an EHCP in independent school where this is parental preference and no state school can meet needs that doesn't involve the parent paying school fees.

The process involved getting independent OT, SALT and EP evidence and a tribunal hearing but the cost to parents was a fraction of just one year's fees. It is not necessary for SN parents to pay school fees where it can be evidenced that they need a small school/small class and needs can't be met in the state sector.

There will undoubtedly be some SN DC who don't have an EHCP or who don't meet the high criteria for placement in independent school whose parents are able to afford private currently with some sacrifices that they deem worthwhile who would find the sacrifices too great or are not able to increase income/decrease outgoings.

Any parent who can evidence need and inability to meet need in the state sector whose child has an EHCP would surely appeal before moving their child (where parents have volunteered to meet fees because state schools have said they can meet need). The fact they are already in independent would allow evidence of improvement in performance/mental health compared to crisis in state sector.

Would you not be able to this?

Yes, some of us teachers remember that. The money for state education was restricted from day 1, like you say. Other positive things, things which raised aspirations and opened up the range of experiences available to the poorest children, disappeared overnight. Nothing changed for privately educated children.

ASAP hopefully. Or just ban them altogether.