Private or state school

[Pomvit]

Eldest due to start high school next year. I’d love for her to go to private school however she wants to go to the local state school
with her friends.

Do I push her to sit the entrance exam so she has options or just accept her decision. I want her to have have the character building and the experiences private education brings that she can’t appreciate at 10yo as part of the decision making process.

I want her to be happy but am I doing her a disservice by letting her make the decision - my gut feels like I should let it be her choice but my head tells me I know best.

Depends on many other factors. Is she bright and motivated, are you supportive and is the state school decent?
if so, she’ll do well there, save your money.

Has she visited both schools?

10 year olds are not equipped to make long term decisions, no it shouldn't be solely her choice.

No one actually gets a choice of secondary school - you get to express preferences, and you see what you get offered.

Where your friends from primary school are going is a very low priority. If they are true friends then the friendship will survive being at a different school (my DC is in y10 now and spends time in school holidays and occasionally at weekends with the one person that was a genuine friend from primary. When you do go into a senior school with some friends from primary, you are in an intake with kids from at least 6 other primaries and the people you know will probably be in different classes and you may hardly see eachother.

Schools are not automatically better for being private. Some private schools don't do a good job for the money they charge. They get decent results by being able to select able kids without any complex issues.

A state school that has lowish overall results may nevertheless be doing brilliantly - it doesn't matter to you if a school has a high proportion of less able pupils who get poor results if they also have an effective streaming system to ensure the able pupils are stretched and achieve their full potential.

Talk to your dd about keeping an open mind and not settling her heart on any one school. Visit lots of schools both state and private, and rank them honestly taking into account all the factors that are important. Put in applications to lots, letting private and state schools all be part of the mix. Emphasise that no choice is being made until next april when you know what the actual options are.

Not quite the same but we had the option for grammar school as DS2 was very academic. We asked him if he'd like to give the 11 plus a go but he decided he didn't. We weren't going to force him to, so he went to the same state secondary as his elder brother had been to, which we knew was good. He's now at Oxford so it didn't seem to do him any harm.

“character building”

Are you sure you want her to have the kind of character private schools build?

@JaukiVexnoydi speaks sense.
My children all go to different High schools. This is because they are all different types of learner. So we choose the best school for them. the one that has actually done the best and has been pushed the most goes to what on paper that's like the worst school. She is flying. We knew it would suit her better than an academic school although she is actually doing better academically now than her siblings at more academically focused schools.

what bullshit, if someone said “are you sure you want her to have the kind of character STATE schools build?” You’d be called a snob, why is it ok to tar a whole school system with the same brush? it’s not.

You need to make the right decision for your child, they can of course voice a preference but you need to do what’s right for them. Don’t forget friends move and they will meet new friends whichever school they go to.

Personally I’d be reluctant to see my child encouraged to develop that kind of empty confidence, lack of empathy with ordinary people, sense of superiority and entitlement one experiences with many of the privately schooled.

Dreadful places.

I think it depends on the individual schools. A poor private school may be much worse than a good state school - and I say that as someone with a DD in a private school. She only took one private school exam and one grammar because they were both schools I thought she would thrive at and I did not think she would enjoy the other private options available. I think most people sit a lot more.

Also think about catchments and distances. Is the state school one she will be realistically offered? Lots of parents seem to 'choose' a state school that they like better but then find out they are too far away and end up with a different option, especially in high population density areas. Look at admissions distances etc if appropriate and find out what you think you would really be offered. This info is usually available on council websites.

The other thing, and the most important, is what kind of child you have. Would she thrive on being at the top and gain confidence? Would she hate being at the bottom or in the middle of a cohort? Would she like a smaller or larger school? Is she the kind of child who likes school and likes learning? How do you think prepping for the exams would sit with her (if the school is fairly selective)? What are her specific interests and aptitudes and how well can each school cater to those? What are the curriculum options (esp for GCSE) at the schools you have in mind (they can differ quite a lot)?

FWIW, DD was pretty scared of not knowing anyone when she started secondary as the only new girl from her primary but in fact found it quite freeing in the end. She would recommend it!

I wouldn't have "character building" an my list of criteria for choosing a school regardless of sector. I would be mildly interested in what posters mean by "the kind of character state schools build" though!

Are they both good schools that offer a wide range of subjects? By definition, private schools offer a wider range of extra curriculars- is there anything your dd wants to do which would be easier if she could do at school rather than as a separate after school activity? What are the kids like from both schools in terms of street behaviour, behaviour at parties and so on? Does your dd make friends easily? What's the commute like? Can you afford the private school easily, including fee increases and extras? Are the kids from both schools mostly local?

Like it or not, during secondary school your child's character will be evolving and the school they are at will contribute its part.

I know what you mean though, the phrase "character building" can cover a multitude of negatives that you don't want for your child. I have to say that when I read private vs state threads and lots of people focus on exam results, that wasn't what I was looking for when we were fortunate to have some choice in our children's schools. It was everything else about finding an environment in which they could flourish as themselves and hopefully grow into confident happy young adults able to interact positively with anyone they meet.

The outcomes haven't 100% matched that yet, but we've been happy with our choices.

Consider thoughtfully the options that are realistically amongst your choices, but yes, do take some control of at least the application process as part of a ongoing conversation with your child about what choice you as a family will make for her.

I was her. I went to the state but both best friends relocated, and the rest were so spread around the school that I never saw them. I was very quickly full of regret wishing I’d sat the entrance for the grammar.

FWIW, my parents wanted me to sit exams for the a state selective school. I refused because none of my friends were going, my parents didn’t push me to apply & I ended up at the local comp. I hated it & bitterly regret not at least trying for the selective school. Ten & eleven year olds are not old enough to make decisions that could affect the rest of their lives. Although it’s tough she will hopefully thank you one day. Good luck.

Explore the broader options both private and states with your DD, visit these schools together if you can. Discuss and guide with your DD with each options, prospectives and possibilities. Narrowing down and imposing choices too early would have missed some good schools.

I'd visit both the schools with her so she can get a feel for both of them.

Just a thought, but some private schools are extremely hard to get in to and people start prepping their DCs long before the start of Year 6 to make sure they will be familiar with the entrance exam. Depending on the area and the school, competition can be just as fierce for a private school who is charging high fees, as it if were a top state (free) grammar.

Explore both options with your daughter but I firmly believe that at 11yrs old they aren't capable of making such decisions so it is ultimately up to you as the parent.
Echo what others have said about looking at entrance requirements to the private options and whether they are selective or non-selective.
We chose private because they secondary options are awful around here and unlike some people I don't believe in making DD's education suffer in order to justify a moral aversion to private education.
No doubt this thread will descend into the usual anti Vs pro private debate but ultimately you do what you feel is right for your child.
Don't listen to the "privately educated children are dreadful" tripe that is sometimes spewed on here. Some people equate private schools with Eton when the reality is that most are local independents with a cross section of economic and socially diverse families. You would never be able to tell at DDs school who is on a bursary and who isn't.

What do you mean by 'character building'?

In terms of social economic mixed state schools are more diverse than private schools except for some grammar schools which have lowest free school meal percentage across all sectors.

Yes there are some mean tested busuries students in private schools, there are usually make up around 10% of the school population , at max 20% for a handful of social aware private schools. Most of privates schools have a vacumn in the medium middle class layer in terms of income distribution and wealth.

Are you sure you want to risk her developing the kind of character State schools build?

Thank you - the state schools where we live are decent education wise - ie they get good results but life’s more than that isn’t it - which is what decision all the more harder.

My view of state school comes from my experience which as a child was positive at the time but looking back as an adult it was absolutely crap in terms of giving kids any inspiration, experience, ambition and drive in life.

I guess what I want for her from the private school and what I mean by character building is all the extra opportunities and experiences and mind set. But I realise as I type this that actually this is what we can give her as parents

It’s also a brand new campus as it’s recently relocated so the resources and facilities are amazing. it’s a selective school so there is an exam and it’s massively oversubscribed because of its recent relocation. It’s not like Eton, we live in Cheshire and whilst there are footballers and the extremely wealthy of alderly edge in the most part it’s a mix of ‘normal’ families too.

thanks for all your feed back it’s definitely food for thought

What kind of character would that be?

I know which school you mean. I know kids who go there and by all accounts it's a fantastic school academically but also great for sport and pastoral care.

There are many state schools in my area (which is probably not too far away from you) that are fantastic but under considerable strain with lack of funds. My kids have been through 2 different state high schools and I've seen with my own eyes the lack of equipment, awful buildings, constant supply teachers, rising class numbers, unsupported SEN issues and low moral and burnout in staff. My kids have done really, really well academically and we've provided all the extra curriculum activities and support schools can't at the moment.

Part of me says don't waste your money when your daughter is going to do well in a state school - it's clear she has your support - and part of me says pay the fees and go. I'm one of those f*cking annoying people who has always been opposed to sending my kids at a private school (I went to highly academic private hot house that you will definitely have heard of) but I've seen the damage this government has done to our state schools and I know the school you're thinking of is great.

Good luck in your decision. I'm wiling to bet once you start touring schools you'll opt for the private.

She is 10 and has no life experience. You're an adult and you do. Your opinion counts a hell of a lot more than hers. Go and visit the schools you're interested in.

No idea but apparently much better than the character someone would develop at Private school according to another poster

I'm an advocate of letting your child choose.