B & C A level grades were ‘RG’ worthy in 80s? What’s changed

[Peverellshire]

Why are required A level grades so high now? Is it easier to get an A or A star now compared to early to mid 80s? Well A star wasn’t a ‘thing’ back then but…

In past B,C,C and certainly A,B,B enough to get on relatively prestigious courses at top universities, so what’s changed?

Huge more numbers applying for University and grade inflation.

It's called grade inflation.

I did Scottish Highers which are the Uni entry level exams here, to get onto the course I wanted to do I needed BBBB (most people sit 5, they were only interested in the best 4). That was to start uni in 1990. Now the same course requires AAAAA.

I actually ended up with AABB in my Highers (failed Higher Maths completely) and had unconditional offers from St Andrews, Edinburgh and Glasgow. Wouldn't even bother applying these days.

grade inflation

I wonder about this too...every teacher I know says there isn't grade inflation and kids work harder and teachers are better now...but in the 1980's the standard offer for medicine was BBB...the less prestigious schools offered BBC.
I got ABC and got in to my RG medical school no problem.
My DD and her peers have offers like A*AA to study degrees like psychology.
Something has changed...

This.
Plus lots and lots more degree courses being introduced. The idea that everyone should have the choice of going to university. Student Finance system meaning more students= more money.

I am the proud owner of BBCC. Those were the highest results in my 6th form and the degree I did, was, at the time, considered to be the 4th most prestigious of its kind in Europe.

My niece has 4 A* and looks at me like I'm a thicko.

What is grade inflation, like clothes size inflation where in reality it’s the same but vanity changes?

Is it only grade inflation? I hear As are difficult to obtain? Is an grade A in Maths now the equivalent of a grade C in 1986?

We hear A levels are very tough now (?)

We were talking about this yesterday. It's partly the A star grade which has effectively pushed grades up - so an old B would now be an A. But probably grade inflation too. Especially for science courses I think, loads of really clever people would get eg B,C,D and get a place at a top university.

How many, approx, get an A & B now as per early to mid 80s?

Yes to no grade inflation comment. I hear this all the time now. Speak to any 50 something doctor he’ll joke he’d never have gone to Uni now or had required grades. Did they work less hard? Less competition?

Larger population all trying to get places, as there are next to no jobs with progress/training from A level now.

Increased demand, it's not possible to increase supply and still keep what made particular universities more attractive, a great marketing campaign where half of mumsnet thinks attending anywhere else is abject parental failure - so they can set far higher requirements.

My AABB at A level was considered amazing. I was able to apply pretty much everywhere with that, including Cambridge (completely fluffed the interview). Got an offer from Imperial College for example...

My brother went to Durham with AAC.

Our exams definitely weren't easy... my brother had the disadvantage of being the first year with that AS/A2 system (I was the third year).

Agreed. I needed BBB to get into Birmingham to do Russian and didn't get it and was very upset.
Now most of Ds1's peers were only separated by those that got AAA and those that got 3 x A*.

I can answer on maths GCSE's as just checked when my DS1 got his....

In "my day" around 10% of people got an A

Now around 10% get a 9.... so an old GCSE A - circa 1989-1992 is equivalent to a 9 today. (9 is supposed to be A*, 8 is A and 7 is A, 6 is B ish etc)

I'm not sure of the situation now but in the 1980s only a certain percentage of grades were given out so in theory if everyone score over 90% in an A Level then only (I can't remember the exact method / numbers) 10% of candidates would get an A, then the next 20% would get a B and so on.

The converse was true, if every student got less than 50% the top 10% would get an A. This was also true for O Levels.

When GCSEs came in 'grade boundaries' came in so if you got 90% you got an A (then A*).

I'm not up with the latest developments.

Stars giving bold 😬

(9 is supposed to be A star star, 8 is A star and 7 is A, 6 is B ish etc)

So if you compare, a star now, is A of old. A now is b of old.

so on that basis, a star, a, a entry is the same as a, b, b back In the day. You then add in grade inflation and kids achieving they need to control the amount who get places to the top . If they kept it at abb so many more would be eligible and it would become much more complex to manage.

I got into an RG university in the late 90’s, let alone 80’s, on BCC. Science subject so not one of the super popular/oversubscribed ones though.

In the past only a small fixed proportion of pupils got an A, then a B, etc. so even if your year did better in exams than last years cohort, the same proportion got As. This has now changed, there is no limits.

That's not correct for this year. The exam boards have said in 2023 they will give out the same number of Astars, A, B and 9, 8, 7 as in 2019. What is not clear this year is the grade boundaries so it's difficult for schools to predict where the boundaries will lie for each grade.

A mixture - grade inflation, more competition, students having to pay for their degrees so taking studying for A levels a lot more seriously than we did. Teaching and career guidance have also improved, as have learning materials and alternative sources of learning (when my DD doesn’t understand something she’s taught in class she watches a YouTube video to help her), and rightly or wrongly more pupils are pushed down an academic path and ‘prepared’ for university - expectations are different. When I was at uni only 10-15% of 18 year olds went, now it’s closer to 50%. I don't think that’s wrong. 30-40 years ago, for example, you didn’t necessarily need a degree to do nursing or pharmacy, you could go down the direct training route and learn on the job, but advances in medicine and care as well as demand, have significantly changed those roles so that comprehensive higher education is necessary now.

I got offered BBC to read English at Exeter in 1985! It's definitely at least AAA now.

But due to a star not being in place in the 80s, that is rhe equivalent of aab now.

My dd is doing GCSEs right now. What strikes me is the amount of help they get. Study skills and study groups as well as so many online study resources. We had lessons and nothing else. If you were very lucky you might be able to ask a very quick question at the end of a lesson. I'm sure that helps improve grades for some.

Yes I suppose so.