Buckinghamshire or Hertfordshire?

[StrawberriesSW1]

Hi there,

We're looking to move from Central London to Hertfordshire or Buckinghamshire and need further info about education provision in these areas. We wish to move just this once and don't want to have to move again. So for DD and DS 2 and 3, Primary till A - Levels. Also, with the way the economy is, we would like to have the option open for DC to be able to return home and still have their career options if needed. (I understand some on MN do not encourage planning ahead for the family in this way but this is our preference so please no comments about it being unnecessary to plan as we're doing. We've learnt from many around us who's children are back home after uni or after their wedding to save for a deposit etc and moving is expensive).

We liked Brookmans Park, Potters Bar, Welham Green and Cuffley in Hertfordshire for good connection to the city different stations in the city, connectivity to Finsbury Park and then South of the River. So this will be handy for work etc for us (we mostly wfh at the moment but both intend to change jobs soon) and also future proof for if in 20yrs wages don't rise as fast as rents or property prices in London. So connectivity works but we're not as confident about the options for education. The primary school offerings in these areas appear poor and it appears DAO is the only secondary school with a long standing good reputation (hopefully it will remain so). Our preference is for a sec school with some form of academic selection.

Buckinghamshire however, has lovely primary and and well regarded secondary schools. The issue is the lack of connectivity to London. Amersham seems to be the only area with options for two lines ie train and tube but the connection is quite restrictive till you get to Maryleborne which isn't really useful for much other than to change to the underground network into central London then change again. Great Missenden seems nice but the train doesn't seem reliable.
In essence the education provision seems suitable but not the connectivity. Am I missing something? I know Cross Rail 2 is being constructed but it's simply whizzing through Bucks and there'll be no new station or improved connectivity? Another puzzle I wonder about.

What other outstanding selective schools I've I missed in Hertfordshire, with good primary provision nearby and which area in Bucks have I missed with good connectivity to London? I appreciate your insight.

Thanks for all your responses. I shall refer to them time and again and hopefully give an update by the end of the year. :)
@m00rfarm My DH likes Marlow but it's too far out. I'm familiar with Hertfordshire as I worked there in the past.
@Wigeon it doesn't have to be 100% selective. A fair percentage of selection is fine.
@TizerorFizz Amersham does seem to be fair in terms of catchment and tube. For some reason I don't care much for Maidenhead even though I lived near there in the past. I do like BP. Quiet and near the M25, easy to go west to Bucks or east to get around. It's the schools I can't seem to find semi/selective state schools in the area (apart from DAO's 65 places).
@Sluj as I'm familiar with SW Hertfordshire I know there're activities in PB, Barnet, Enfield, Mill Hill etc. Not because I looked but I lived in the area some time ago. My hesitation with Bucks might also be cos I haven't lived or worked there.
@Twilightstarbright a friend of mine who lives in PB considered Chancellors for her DS who's at Hockerill but said she wasn't happy with the Maths and Science results so she left him there; boarding. You're right Mount Grace will hopefully improve.
@dig135 I understand those who live in Chorleywood and get the option of DC go for that instead of St CD every time.
@mumsys Harpenden is further than we want to go.

Just one thing, kids in Chorleywood don't get into Challoners unless there's exceptional circumstances. (I went to Challoners from CW but half of the town was in Bucks at that point and the boundary was then revised).

I can think of one girl who went to the girls school from CW but that was over ten years ago. There was also one year where the boys school changed the criteria on second homes and I believe took one or two out of catchment as it caught a few people out.

But you pretty much have zero chance of getting into Challoners from CW.

@dig135 The latest admissions info backs that up. Catchment DC got in. Chorleywood is not catchment. DC Grammar admitted to just over 5 miles within catchment. You cannot afford to be too far away from their front doors if you want these schools. The Amersham School doesn’t take much over 2 miles and John Colet at Wendover can be similar.

There’s also absolutely no need to run from some of the Bucks secondary schools. They get over 1/3 of pupils as higher achievers. They get plenty to university including RG. They are better than many comprehensives.

Little Chalfont (Chalfont & Latimer) has great schools and you can definitely buy a house in walking distance to the station, and is in catchment for both DC schools.

The other plus about Bucks is that the traffic is better, at least in my part. (I'm on the border but in Herts). The traffic around CW and Rickmansworth is dreadful in rush hour and even worse when there's M25 issues.

Whereas I don't seem to have the same problem in LC, Amersham and Wendover. Although I hope HS2 restores the countryside back to how it was as it's quite a mess at the moment.

@dig135
You are correct about HS2. However houses are still pretty expensive near me!

Hi All,

We are house hunting at the moment and ideally want to move outside north london to afford a bit more. We have seen a nice property in Welham green? I am not familiar with this area. Would so appreciate it if anyone knows the area and could share their thoughts. Many thanks

Do you have children?
As a village, it's perfectly nice, quiet and has the little shops and a good dentist!
The school however isn't great. Most WG kids get into Brookmans Park School (in the next village), but in some years secondary has been an issue as WG children who don't go to St Mary's struggle to get into Chancellor’s on catchment/feeder school element.

Thank you so much for your reply. Our son is already in school elsewhere so that is luckily not an issue. Are you local to the area? It would be great to know if there is any antisocial behaviour in the younger years as someone mentioned there may be. And generally what crime levels are like…likely will need to travel home in the evening via the train. Sorry and one last question :) I assume not having good schools in the area may affect property prices if families need to travel elsewhere. Thanks so much again

Yes, I lived in WG for many years, and have moved now.
There is a large traveller community in the area, and I think this clouds people's perceptions of the area. We never experienced any trouble or felt any issues. It's very green, lots of nice walks. I think if you live above the shops, it could be noisy etc, but where we were was open, quiet and felt safe. I would go for a little walk round, go to the bakery, walk up to park and see what you think. The neighbouring village is extremely affluent and WG will always be judged lesser than it, unfortunately. Property prices are stable; ours rose a considerable amount in the years we were there. Again, they are nowhere near the next village though!

Thank you so much, that’s really helpful. We have done a recce of the area but didn’t come across any traveller sites. Can you possibly let me know whereabouts they are? The property we are considering is on Dixons hill towards the end of the village heading away from the train station. Really appreciated.

If you stand at the train station and look down, there are some homes there. As I say, we really didn't feel it or notice it, Dixon Hill is nice, if a little busy. Holloways Lane is considered the most desirable road, and station road has some lovely properties.

Late to the party but what if your kids don't pass the test. Maybe they were clever but not good on the day at the exam. It would mean they go to a second tier school. But if they lived in an area without selective schools, their prospects would likely be better

What's your plan if they failed? Would you move house?

I ask because I'm trying to make a similar decision so am curious

@Wheretolivehelppls then they'll be a a school familiar and equipped to cater for their level of abilities.

@DibbleDooDah Sandringham School for example had it's last admitted distance at 1.4km. That area is still over a mile from the station.

I hear your about motivated parents supporting motivated DC to be motivated students but a friend who has DC at St Clement Danes and Dr Challoners says they can't be compared and Dr Challoners is far better especially with respect to peers who influence positively, forming better habits and cultivating responsibility.

@StrawberriesSW1 In Bucks, many of the “second tier” schools send dc to universities. It’s not a second class education. There’s a huge amount of crossover between lower end of grammars and top end of secondaries. So anyone in a good secondary can achieve well. The secondaries in Bucks frequently have 30% high achieving dc in them and they are well supported by parents. Often these schools are better than many comps elsewhere. So always do your research and live where there are good schools for all. For many parents, Bucks offers great schools but a few should possibly be avoided. Like anywhere else!

Entrance tests to grammar schools are often psychometric tests and similar to dyslexic tests though. Some dyslexic people (like Einstein) are quite bright, but well suited to those tests but do well with bright neurotypical people. If they have learning difficulties that are pronounced at that age, they could be excluded. If you and your partner are fairly neurotypical, this could be a reasonable risk to take

The other concern is that anyone can underperform on one high pressure test on one day and that would shape their future at 11

Can you name some that you consider to be good from personal experience? Thanks

Non grammars. Waddesdon, John Colet, The Misbourne, The Amersham School, Great Marlow School. There are others which are perfectly decent schools too. Obviously I don’t have personal experience of all but I know these are very popular schools well supported by parents. All have far more applicants than places. Have a look at Waddesdon if you want to see a very impressive non grammar. Tiny catchment though!

Wendover or Great Missenden would suit you well and you’d get a house for your budget. The primaries are great and the secondary moderns are good there too as a fall back. Also don’t dismiss the tiny bucks infant schools - a friends DD is part of a class of 9 which is unheard of for state, and they feed into the bigger combined primary schools at age 7

Aylesbury, buckingham, Bedford.

Bedford? That's neither Bucks nor Herts.

@coronafiona I would not suggest Aylesbury! Do you actually know it? Secondary schools, other than the grammars, are not the best.

For clarity; John Colet School is Wendover and The Misbourne School is Great Missenden. I agree that the primary schools are good here but Wendover CofE junior is a bit too religious for some
these days.

Infant schools in Bucks do not routinely have 9 in a class. Infant schools are YR to Y2. Do 9 x 3 is 27 in the school. Not sure any are this small and funding is not generous enough to provide 3 teachers in such a school.

I live near Buckingham, and both DC went to Buckingham School - there’s also the Royal Latin for 11+ passers. There’s also an academy school in Winslow, but I believe they’ve stopped doing 6th form.

I can be at Milton Keynes train station in around 20 minutes for a fast train (around 35 mins) to Euston. There’s lots of lovely villages around here and Buckingham itself is nice if you don’t need city living (MK does have everything but personally I couldn’t live there!).

Same as PP have said re Leighton Buzzard. Fast trains, and on the Bucks borders for grammar schools. Villages like Wing and Stewkley are nice.

Wing has the Cottesloe school that many parents like. If you are not in Bucks, you should not assume you will get into a grammar. Aylesbury is expanding a lot. Buckingham is a bit sleepy with poor transport links. MK is not far but there’s not a decent cinema or much else besides a sports centre.