Should this child be expelled?

[cba]

Sorry if this is long.

There is a long running problem of a boy in our school. He is a year one boy and to date he as been responsible for the following:

1. pushing my ds1 over and kicking him in the face when he tried to get up.

1. pushed a boy down some concrete steps.

1. kicked another boy in the head several times on differect occasions.

1. held a pair of scissors to a girls throat.

1. disrupts class and kicks teacher.

1. pushed ds2 over, he now has a black eye and the school didnt even phone me to let me know.

When this boy kicked my ds1 in the face he got excluded for one afternoon.

I did not find out that this boy had done the eye injury to my ds2 until today when i have had a good chat with him and another boy who was there.

In what circumstances, if any, would a boy of this nature be allowed to stay in a school?

I am going to have serious words with the school on Monday as everyday all you hear is children moaning and being afraid of x.

He is a very volatile boy and I cannot understand why he is allowed to stay in school.

On the other hand I can see by his behaviour that he needs help and do not participate in any school yard gossip.

Please give advice on what to say to school as I dont want to come across as being unreasonable.

This is an independent school so I suspect they do not have to adhere to strict guidlines as state schools do.

Thanks

In that case, that's easy. Just go in and complain. Independent schools do not like unhappy parents. I'd personally only talk about your DC's experiences and the disruption of teaching - two assaults and interrupted lessons sounds enough grounds for concern.

well until you said it was an independant you could quite easily have been speaking abut my son.

he is Autistic.

but you being a parent and not having spoken to me or my son you wouldn't have known that.

it is quite possible that this child has some form of Sn.
yes by all means complain but don't assume that it is all as black and white as you think.
also how do you know about these other incidents that do not involve your son?
you say you dont participate in school yard gossip so how did you find this out?

Does he have famous or influential parents?

Perhaps he does have genuine problems, but if so, it doesn't sound as if he is getting the help he needs.

The mother of the worst bully at ds's primary school was the chair of the governers. He was allowed to get away with the most appalling behaviour.

do you know his mother at all?

i have overheard other mums speaking. I know my sons have had nothing to do with the incidents, neither of my sons are in his class.

I totally understand where you are coming from with regard to your son being autistic. Like i said i am aware things are not black and white so obviously if there are underlying issues then would it not be better for the teachers to say so discreetly?

I do not know his mum at all and havent even seen her. If I did know her I would have probably had a quiet word to see if there was anything i could do.

Do not want to go into school and make matters worse.

I worked with boys like this in a state school. One of them knocked me out, he got sent home that day ( a friday) and was back by monday

if the teacher was found discussing my son with another parent i would go ballistic!

if you are concnerned your son has been hurt then of course discuss it with his teacher. hopefully the teacher will tell you that are aware of these problems and that they have strategies in place to prevent them happening again. ask about what these are and hopefully have your mind put to rest.

over hearing things in a playground really isn't the most reliable source of information though.
My son is often thought to be the cause of all problems at school even when he isn't there.

i was told by a friend who works at his schoolr ecently - Ds was at a hospital visit so not at school. assembly and a child was being disruptive at the back....child at teh front pipes up with "oh that'll be Mamazonjnr"

oh mamazon, that is awful. I trul would like to help the child and am not saying i would like to know if there were issues to cause problems.

If i knew there were stratgies in place then i would feel more comfortable, but at the moment just have ds2 with a black eye, which is the eye he had an operation on two months ago which could cause problems for him

and you are absolutly right in wanting to know what is being dne about this child.

i am more than happy to both apologise for and explain abuot my son to any parent that wished to speak to me about it.

your child has been hurt and you are of course right to question whether this has been dealt with.
i just wanted to show that its not always a clear cut behavioural matter.

i hope you get the answer's you are looking for at school on monday, and that yoru son's eye is ok.

At the end of the day if a child has SN, they need to put things in place to project the other children if that child is volient. Same way the child with SN needs support to protect themselves

of course they do Lisa - but unless you place my child in a cage all day there is always the possibility that he can lash out (seemingly) unprovoked and hurt someone.

That is very true. I worked in an EBD unit and one staff memeber had to go out with the kids at breaktime and lunch time. However, one of the boys i worked with managed to rub another kids face inot the ground and pull out his pants, before i could get there

Its seeems the child in OP has done a lot of things in short space, so it could be no one is helping him

i think if the school couldnot demonstrate to me that they took their duty fo care for my child seriously by communicating to me the strategies in place for this child with regards to class safety = i would formall y complain to the LEA

Mamazon... as far as I'm aware we are not even sure if the child has special needs. In the same way that special needs does NOT means bad behaviour, bad behaviour does NOT necesarily equals to special needs.

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TBH, If another child held some scissors at DS' neck, or kicked him in the face I would be complaining immediatly. The safety and well being of other children deserves to be considered too.

" bad behaviour does NOT necesarily equals to special needs."

I have to disagree. Very few children behave badly without a reason. Just because there are no neurological or physical problems doesn't mean the child does not deserve help. This child clearly need help to learn in a socially acceptable way.

Its hard to judge without knowing more about the boy and the nature of the school. Prehaps the boy has major problems in his life that the school have kept confidental. Maybe they are trying to support the child through a difficult patch in his life.

Private schools can kick out a child for any reason they like. The reasons don't even have to fair. They have far more freedom that state schools to get rid of kids swiftly.

Infact I know a little girl who was kicked out of her private school at the age of five for the crime of not able to read at the end of reception.

It sounds like to me that this child need more support. Prehaps the school needs to employ an extra LSA to look after the boy at diffcult times like lunch time or break.(With the parents paying?)

A good school will only exclude as a last restort. Children who get excluded from school often find themselves without a school for quite a period of time. It is a really damaging to do to a child's self esteem.

This sounds like a boy who terrorised DD & her class in Yr 1. The Boy should have been in reception but was put in with a VERY experienced teacher & more settled pupils as he had already been expelled from 2 schools.

I felt sorry for the kid - transpired his sister had already been removed & placed in care, but this poor wretch was left with a mother who was banned from the playground for physically assaulting another mum (racial motive - poor mum knocked flat after being punched in face for asking said boy to "not call me a black * please".)

But feeling sorry for him did not diminish my fury that my 6 year old was called an F'ing whore etc etc, was kicked & hit & her friend was strangled - took 2 teachers to pry his hands off her throat!

I only got the whole story after complaing to Head when DD refused to go to school. The Head was great and tried everything. If said child sat still for half an hour he was allowed to run in playground for 10 mins, but 2 teachers had to carry him back in each time (1 on arms, 1 on legs). He came in earlier & left before other kids to stop the hitting in the cloakroom, had a 1-1 support etc but it didn't work, and he finally got a place at a very small specialist school.

I hope he survived as DD is now 17.

I would certainly complain and ask the school how they are going to set about keeping the other children safe. This is their responsibility.

The problem with exclusion is- where will the lad actually go? He can't evaporate and cease to exist. In fact, he will either have to go to another school (where he may terrorise somebody else's child) or hang around the streets. The best option might be a special school - if there is one available.

But if he has special needs, then exclusion won't make them go away. And if his problems are in his home life, then exclusion will only mean he gets more of whatever is making him behave this way. It is a difficult one.

I read all the posts about SN with interest and agree.

However, the OP's los have the right to go to school without being physically attacked. They are very young and to have this happen to them out of the blue can be very frightening. School phobia can develop easily from nasty incidents like this if not promptly and firmly addressed, so the OP is right to be concerned.

I would book an appointment with your head to voice your concerns and to hear what they have to say. They should, without breaking confidence, be able to tell you what steps are/are going to be put in place to protect your children. As another pp pointed out, fee paying schools can get rather jittery when parents start to complain.

Clearly you ned to double check the facts etc and ensure that it was this child and that this behaviour was unprovoked.

Assuming that all is as you expect then whether or not the child has SN or not etc is not your issue or concern, or of any relevance - you need to ensure that your own children are safe and that is the school's responsibility, whatever is behind the poor behaviour of the other child.

I would meet the HEAD teacher ASAP and have a bloody rant that such behaviour has occured in the school and expect to be told what actions have been taken and how he can reassure you that it won't happen again.

FFS - scissors at the throat? If an adult did that you would call the police - why should a child be allowed to do that at school?

I would go and talk with the school and express the seriousness of your concerns.

DS1 has had a problem with a child at his school who is in the reception year.
The child seemed to make a beeline for DS1 (and other children) no matter what was in the way - tables chairs people - once he had someone in his sights he didn't stop until he was physically removed from the victim - 90% of the time he managed to draw blood with either his teeth or his nails.

in a half day session (2.5 hours) ha managed to attack (no other word for it) 6 times DS1 3 times and 2 other children.

The teacher is doing her best and the poor mother was distraught - there is a point however that no matter what the problem the child has - I need to protect my DS1 from violent attacks - he had nightmares 3-4 times a night and started wetting the bed.

However - this activity did fast track the child's meeting with a psychiatrist at the local hospital and the mother now has been told he has autism. He has been moved to another school. That is great for DS1 but the lovely mum I am friends with is starting all over again at a new school - the childs behaviour isn't as bad as it was but he is still violent when faced with a group of children his own age.

Anyway the point of all that rambling is that your going into the school to talk to them could help everyone concerned. With a few concerned parents the child may well get the extra support he needs.

Good luck!!

Have you asked the school for a copy of their policy on bullying?

A few questions.

What is the age of the child?

Does the child have special needs?

If the answer to the latter is Yes, the next question is 'What is being done for this child to support him to make sure that he is safe, as well as keeping the rest of the class safe' Because it would look as if the level of supervision and support the child gets is simply not enough to keep everyone safe.

If the answer is No, and there is no reason to suspect that a diagnosis is 'on the way' then the school needs to look at its behaviour policy, and to adress what sems to be gaping holes which are leaving children at risk.

I don't think and this age (Y1) he should be excluded.

Hpwever I would be extremely concerned about this child if my DD were at his school. The incidents you describe are not jst some little one off things to not make a ufss about. These are pretty serious incidents occuring here.

I would want to know:

(a) what are the school doing to help this child modify his behaviour? Is it working? If not, what are they goin to do about it?

(b) what are they doing to protect the other children in the class/school from such incidents in the future?

And I am afraid even if the child does have SN he does need something in place to protect himself and to protect others. If left unchecked then these incidents make increase or get worse, especially as the child gets older and stronger.

I would need to go into school to speak with the class teacher, or the head if I got nowhere after that.

I do think it is a bit of a myth that private schools can easily get rid of pupils they no longer want (if that is indeed the case) The parents still have the right to appeal to the governors. You're talking about parents who have money and perhaps work in law or have friends who work in law. These parents tend not to sit back lightly and allow rejected from private school to be stamped upon their child's file!

It may be harder for independent schools to permanently exclude a child.

However I have seen cases where parents were 'asked' to withdraw a child, before the formal paper work was done, which would have then made it harder for the parents to get the child into the state school of their choice.

Jump before they were pushed as it were