Church attendance and Covid

[User647647]

Hello,

I was just reading that churches will be allowed a specific number of people during service. I read 30, but I’m guessing it will depend on the size of the actual church.

I was wondering if faith secondary schools will be relaxing their rules about church attendance for Year 7 admissions or what their plan (if any) might be.

Has anyone heard anything?

Thanks!

30 is for wedding and funerals. There is no limit to how many people can attend a service as long as social distancing (2m) is observed. If this is about attestance of church attendance, most churches have continued with zoom or other online services, so each minister can attest whether an applicant for a CofE school has been a regular member of their congregation or not.

Oh, I didn’t realise the number limit was for those services.

I’d better check out what my local churches are doing in terms of making a note of online attendance.

I think the priest/vicar has to sign a form to say they know who you are and how regularly you attend church. So if you haven't been attending, and the priest/vicR doesn't know who you are it might be a bit embarrassing to ask them to sign the form now, but if it's a large church and and new priest/vicar you might be in luck.

Whole idea of the policy is it’s for children who are brought up in faith.......

It won't make any difference to anything for us.

Those who have attended longest and been involved in the life of their faith are usually placed higher than new attendees.
Anyone moving home can get a statement off the previous parish or other 're attendance.
Depending on the church and the faith leader their statement will be graded.
We would accept if the faith leader said a person attended zoom meetings, delivered food parcels or supported someone by shopping. Even though many have not been able to physically attend they have supported their congregation in many ways as evidence of their faith.

@User647647

Oh, I didn’t realise the number limit was for those services.

I’d better check out what my local churches are doing in terms of making a note of online attendance.

If you attend church, then what is there to check out? You will already know the arrangements your parish has in place for worship. You surely aren't suggesting that you intend to pretend to a faith you do not have simply to get your church into a faith school? That would be dishonest and hypocritical, wouldn't it?

Delivering food parcels would be evidence of works, not faith, to be pedantic...

Leaving aside general concerns about the criteria for admissions to faith schools, under these circumstances it would surely be discriminatory against children of parents who are shielding or vulnerable to insist they physically attend public worship?

weary they will have already missed the boat for 2021 admissions policy changes - the deadline is 18 months before the change to have consulted, applied and changed it. However they could apply for a change on the grounds of exceptional circumstance, which the DfE is likely to consider valid in the current climate. They can do this for 2021 and have a fair amount of time to do so, under the exception criteria.

Our church is going on the previous months before cv.

@cabbageking

It won't make any difference to anything for us.

Those who have attended longest and been involved in the life of their faith are usually placed higher than new attendees.
Anyone moving home can get a statement off the previous parish or other 're attendance.
Depending on the church and the faith leader their statement will be graded.
We would accept if the faith leader said a person attended zoom meetings, delivered food parcels or supported someone by shopping. Even though many have not been able to physically attend they have supported their congregation in many ways as evidence of their faith.

Sounds like your school is operating illegal admissions policies (or the church is failing to follow the school's policies, which amounts to the same thing).

The faith criteria must be objective. Grading statements of attendance based on the church and the faith leader is not objective. "Usually" putting those who have attended longest higher than new attendees is not objective. And taking into account practical or financial support for the church is clearly contrary to the Admissions Code.

Ours have a policy of attendance for 2 years, that is objective. Contribution of money would be outrageous criteria

These are faith school and this falls within the supporting evidence criterion which is additional to the admissions code and is legal
Not every one applies for a faith position.

I never mentioned financial support?

How is attending a publicly advertised zoom meeting not a public act of worship?

These are faith school and this falls within the supporting evidence criterion which is additional to the admissions code and is legal

No, they are not legal as London Oratory found out when the Schools Adjudicator banned them from using this kind of admission criteria and the courts upheld the Adjudicator's decision.

"Involvement in the life of faith" either involves subjective judgement which is not allowed, or it involves practical support for the church which is also not allowed as an admission critierion. "Usually" placing people who have attended longest higher than new attendees suggests subjective judgement is being used which is not allowed. Grading a statement depending on the church and faith leader involved is clearly a subjective judgement which is not allowed.

The "supporting evidence" criterion is not "additional to the Admissions Code". It is additional to the LA's admission form but it is still subject to the Admissions Code. Compliance with the Code is compulsory. You cannot dodge round it by claiming that part of the process is outside the Code. It isn't.

@Moondust001
If you attend church, then what is there to check out? You will already know the arrangements your parish has in place for worship. You surely aren't suggesting that you intend to pretend to a faith you do not have simply to get your church into a faith school? That would be dishonest and hypocritical, wouldn't it?

I haven’t physically attended church since March and the church website doesn’t mention anything about attendance records. They stream the service, you just follow a link and I’m guessing it would be hard for them to know and keep records of who attended and who didn’t.

So, unless I actually ask, I won’t find out. I will email them soon.

I fail to see how what I’ve said has anything to do with pretending I have a faith you seem to imply I don’t have.

I've never heard of church attendance being monitored for high school admissions, or actually primary school, our children go to a very small catholic school and baptism is required and church attendance for first holy communion is compulsory and the priest is very strict about that but church attendance was never talked about for admissions to that or the feeder high school.

All the churches I'm involved with have been having Facebook Live or YouTube services, not zoom. Can't check attendance/participation with those!

In my catholic school you enter the church, write your child’s name on a piece of paper and put it inside a box.
I thought that’s how it happened everywhere.
We attend the service and leave without talking to the priest, so that must be the only way to check attendance and then sign off the paper required by secondary schools.
At least that is my (obviously little) understanding of the process.