Impact of abolition of public schools

[daffodilbrain]

Labour want all public schools abolished - hypothetically how much pressure would this put on the state- could we afford an extra 7% in the system. Can a government really abolish them if so how? Make them
Illegal? Remove their charitable
Status and probably make them even more elite?

If you can afford thousands of pounds a year, you’re hardly scrimping.

Anyway, it’s a structural and cultural problem. At the end of the day, we have schools churning out racists who then end up in positions of power.

That needs tackling!

Can you imagine telling a teacher they have to accept a pay cut , as they have list their job and need to go to a school that pays less.

Labour have plans to increase teachers’ salaries

How do we tackle institutions which continue to embed racist views in government?

The abolition of private schools won’t solve the inequality of education. The proposal came from the Battersea branch of the Labour Party where we have excellent state schools as well as private. Putting Thomas’s, Newton, Eton House (not related to that Eton) Parkgate, Hornsby House and Emanuel into the state sector isn’t suddenly going to improve standards in Battersea; the massive upheaval will lead to a drop across all schools. I’m only using Battersea as an example as it’s where the idea came from.
The real problem isn’t here it’s in town like Blackpool, or Stoke or my home town where the GCSE pass rate is a staggeringly low 29%. Redistribution of assets (chucking money at the problem) doesn’t work. My old state school was torn down and rebuilt, new staff, totally restructured. The appalling pass rate of 29% hasn’t changed! Of course it’s in an area where they abolished grammar schools... I believe we should have a diversity of education, actually more than we have now. Really wish my home town had a grammar school system I hated being stuck in a school where most kids didn’t want to learn and if you did you were bullied for it. I’m not saying bullying doesn’t happen in grammar but there is a culture of learning that you don’t have in a non selective school. I just don’t believe in a one size fits all of state only education. It’s totalitarian. And I really don’t think Battersea will have a Labour MP next time!

Again people are assuming this is a policy in isolation.

Instead of reading headlines, go and read the whole policy.

Abolition

*a useful word i learned to spell for free at a bog standard state comp btw

I can't see it ever happening frankly.
And the details hasn't been thought about.
How will labour get the assets off these schools? They are not up for sale. Compulsory purchase? Many have buildings and land that's worth millions. Would the government then look after these building, many are costly to maintain and repair. What would they do with the land they don't want sell it off for housing? Could they do that?
If all independent schools were turned into state schools who gets places at these schools? Those living close by? Or would it be some sort of place lottery.
What about the boarding schools? Would they have to become day schools?
If they are super selective would they stay super selective?
What about class size? Many state the small classes are the attraction would they have to take 30 pupils in a class?
Or the extra curriculular stuff again what many parents pay for and its parents fees that pay for it would the government pay instead?
I agree thats its unfair that a small group ion hick;dren recipe so much but the solution is to address this by looking at the state system, Many MC parents I suspect wouldn't pay if the state system is better, many on here say their local state schools are dire etc.
Those cheerfully stumping up £40+k per child per annum to send their DC's to Eton Harrow et al (and lets be realistic thats who these plans are really aimed it) won't send their child to a state school. Schools like Eton Harrow et al will relocate outside of the UK taking their pupils with them and perpetuate the elitism that so many despise.
The solution is simple provide a better state education, stop fiddling with exams the curriculum etc attract back the vast majority because the vast majority point attend these elite schools.

"At the end of the day, we have schools churning out racists who then end up in positions of power."
Iggy you're only talking about a minuscule number. The overwhelming vast majority of pupils leaving even schools like Eton are not "racists" or "end up in positions of power" they go off and get normal job and lead normal lives. They maybe very wealthy but that's family wealth not wealth created by the school.

sexist! Racist! Oh for FUCK's sake. This is absurd. The arguments people grasp to to justify privilege are mind boggling.

ion hick;dren recipe = children!

My state school churned our racists! Racism isn’t an institutional problem that only lives in private schools. It’s an ignorance that runs across society. If you’re a Labour supporter I can see how you would think it was a private school problem - antisemitism is rife in both.

point = don't I'm doing well this morning.
My DS attended an elite schools he's neither sexist or racist neither are his friends. I've worked in well known boarding schools neither are the vast majority pf the pupils I've met.
Of course there will be some who are but this also applies to the state sector. I think your find that sexist racist behaviour/attitudes are learnt at home.

Well, what about all the soon to be unemployed private school teachers. they can bring their expertise to the state sector

Or follow their pupils out of the UK.

As for churning out racist comment. Will Labour be abolishing islamic schools or American schools or French schools.

we have schools churning out racists who then end up in positions of power.

Which schools did the anti-semites in the Labour Party go to?

@Blankscreen why on earth should I pay for my DCs education, and ALSO pay tax on it? My DH and I already pay a shed-load of tax. We don't utilise state schools so are less of a burden on the government. Why should we pay even more tax? No, we can't afford an extra 10% on the fees, so our kids would end up in the state system, and place more of a burden on it. Who gains from that? I think you'll find that the vast majority of kids in private education (the majority of which are NOT at places like Eton and don't have money to burn) will be pushed out by this approach, creating a net deficit for education, not a gain.

"(the majority of which are NOT at places like Eton and don't have money to burn) will be pushed out by this approach, creating a net deficit for education, not a gain"
This is the most sensible thing written on here around this debate. The super rich will carry on educating their children in elite schools.

prh47bridge originally there were 7 but by the 1930's there were 24 public schools.

Holland and Germany don’t have private schools and do very well

Nonsense. There is a thriving private education sector in Germany. Never heard of Schloss Salem? And it would be bigger if most German regions did not still have grammar schools which cream off intelligent, largely middle class children at 10.

And the very wealthy from Germany send their DC's to UK boarding schools. In fact IME many European elite send their DCs to UK boarding schools.
The knock on effect on the local economies might be interesting. We have a very big well known full boarding school 30ish miles up the road they are the biggest employers in that area. Boarding schools have a large infra structure and provide employments for a wide variety of occupations from the unskilled; cleaners etc, the trades; plumbers etc through to professionals including local GPs (whose services the school will pay for). Local shops thrive on parents visiting their DC's at the weekend or after a match.
As any systems theorist will tell you change one thing and you maybe inadvertently change others things too.

Which schools did the anti-semites in the Labour Party go to

I didn’t say it was just Tories did I 🤷🏻‍♀️

dolphin50 you said this Holland and Germany dont have private schools and do very well. on another thread too and it's nonsense, as a quick google would should you. Germany not only has private schools but the right to establish private schools is written into the Constitution (Basic Law) as a human right. Do you mean that both countries offer considerable state subsidy to private schools?

Iggly on another thread I invited you to engage with some background info on SN provision and potential impact of this approach on kids with SN. You didn’t bother even responding so please don’t lecture people now about understanding the detail.
The ECHR issue was looked at way back when labour last went mad. Suffice to say there are substantial problems with simply abolishing non state educational provision. Labour will not try this unless they are even stupider than they currently appear to be.

Or unless they want to spend a hell of a lot of taxpayers money fighting legal challenges. Which of course, being so terribly caring and all, they won’t want to do.

Iggly your posts come across as very naive. Many independent schools are privately owned businesses. Their assets are privately owned. It would not be a simple gradual transition! It would be a raid and a fucking abomination. Give me strength.
All the other logical points I'd make have been made succinctly by other posters so ill leave it there. Except to say if Corbyn wants to abolish private education then presumably he'll have to also abolish private healthcare which is also presumably 'not fair'. Two final nails in the coffin of public services of the UK.