A Levels v IB

[lilpumpsmum]

DS is in year 10 and it's time we start looking st his options after GCSE.

There are two good colleges/6th forms near us. One offers IB and the other A Level (we are UK based)

I am absolutely clueless as to which is best?
We went to an open Eve to the IB college this week and it all seemed very impressive, but also rather intense. DS is a good student, should get good grades if he manages to stay focussed but he is also a little 'typical ' in his laidback manner.

Does anyone have experience with IB?
Why did you choose the IB route in favour of A level?

I feel so lost!

IB's a lot broader. Does DS have any idea what A levels he would pick if he does those? Does he know what he might be interested in at university?

IB is broader but universities often ask for what are effectively higher grades from IB than they would for a level.

My sister's children followed the IB in Belgium (some years back), then came to uni in the UK. Her comment was that the IB gives breadth, A levels give depth, and her children had to work very hard to catch up.

She considered A levels a superior qualification, which was interesting to hear, when there's so much negativity relating to UK education.

Thanks for the replies - he's a bright lad and doing v well in the sciences. He gave some grunts towards biology but he doesn't have a 'plan' as of yet.

I guess it depends on the individual student but I'm interested in that More and more UCAS applications are coming from IB students (although it is still the minority, it's increasing apparently) so is it moving towards being 'the norm' ??

She considered A levels a superior qualification, which was interesting to hear, when there's so much negativity relating to UK education.

That is interesting, that's the opposite of what the IB college was trying to suggest (obviously, i guess)

Unless you know you want to go into something very specific, like engineering or medicine etc, having breadth is really not a disadvantage. It gives more options at uni and more opportunity to figure out what you like and are good at.

Only the super selective universities will possibly query ib, the structure though is different so isn't right for all.

Our children did both. IB suited our youngest who wasn’t sure what she wanted to study at university. It gave her more options.
Our eldest wanted to do medicine so knew her A level choices were more limited.
I’d say IB was easier with only three subjects at higher. Our daughter did two A levels alongside her IB - although one of those was dance.
Certainly the IB Chemistry wasn’t at such a high level as the A level but it would also be fair to say they each required a different approach. IB was more applied but A level was more knowledge based.

It won't ever be 'the norm' in the U.K. - far far far more students do A levels than IB and I can't see that changing significantly.

If he's a genuine all rounder and very bright it's a good option. If he knows the general direction he wants to take though (you muttered Biology which suggests Maths, Bio and one other A level), A level is probably going to get more achievable offers.

We moved our Year 10 back to the UK to a school that offers A levels from an international school offering IB. From speaking to a variety of sources it really all depends on your child. Mine is very maths and science strong, but doesn't love English or his language he is taking. The thought of having to study both for another two years really put him off. In addition to that, the Maths Higher Level IB has a reputation for being ridiculously hard, compared with Maths A level, so we felt it would be better for him to concentrate on subjects he really loved, with something like the EPQ to act as the extended essay for IB. Consensus among others we have spoken with is that it is quantity of work rather than necessarily difficulty that makes the IB so hard. Next child could probably cope with the IB better as more an all rounder.

Some interesting reading based on research:

www.spectator.co.uk/2018/03/the-international-baccalaureate-vs-a-levels/

www.timeshighereducation.com/student/news/international-baccalaureate-versus-a-levels/

I'd say the obvious different is that you need to be goor all around to succeed at IB. In addition to the 6 subjects (3 at higher and 3 at standard level), students also take Theory of Knowlege, do CAS (creativity, action, service) and write an Extended Essay.

I did both back in the day and found IB a lot more interesting and would really recommend if DS has many interests and enjoys learning and researching.

Thanks for that link JoJo, interesting reading

IB won't become the norm but it is more acceptable now. I know students who have done the IB and gone onto Oxbridge. I think it really depends on the child, their interests and whether they know what career they are interested in.

Most universities say their standard offer for both on their web sites and of course Oxford have many IB students as they tend to be very bright in a number of subjects.

However some schools really pushed it to unsuitable candidates who would be better served doing A levels. If there are areas of the IB you really don’t like then it’s not for you. A levels won’t stop you going anywhere.

Schools and Colleges that run IB have to push it because it’s expensive to run. More teaching per child - more subjects! They need the bums on seats and some schools do persuade some to take it that shouldn’t.

There are far fewer schools offering IB now than 10 years ago but more students taking the exam but it’s less than 5000.

As PPs have suggested IB really suits an allrounder. If your DC has a pronounced strength in say arts or sciences then A levels would be better. I would also be concerned about recommending IB for those wanting to do very maths intensive courses as there seems to be some gap to fill between IB maths and A levels especially if you take further maths (but I wait to be corrected by others who may know better).

@Dancingdreamer All subjects in the IB can be taken at a higher level. Top marks in a higher level is equivalent to an A* at A level. It is a shame not many schools in the UK do the IB. It is a fabulous qualification and it gives European students more flexibility. It is also preferred by US universities (comparing to A Levels). I believe it is compulsory to do two languages, a science, maths, one humanities subject and an art. You also have to do some volunteering or community work. In this age of paying fees, the IB will become more popular because it means you can go and study anywhere in the world. And we are seeing a rise in the number of teens going to the US and Europe for uni.

Well I finally have something sensible to add to these threads because this week I met a student who has done both IB and A-levels. (IB first) - he didn’t get the marks he wanted for the Uni he wanted with IB so he went back to school and did A-levels - in different subjects. In his opinion A-levels are easier.

At IB school that I went to the open evening of, they said they considered IB to be the equivalent of 5 A-levels

HTH.

Our sixth form is really leaning towards IB and the IBCP (careers based program). I think more schools will go this way. I think A levels are far too restrictive and force kids to make life changing decisions at 15/16.

My perception of the IB is that it sorts out the sheep from the goats - or rather, the truly bright all-rounders from the ones who are good at a narrow range of subjects, me included. I did a language and two humanities at A level and got 3 As. But if I had also had to do maths, english and a science to AS-ish level as part of the IB, I would have probably got the equivalent of Ds and Es (better for English). My feeling is always been that those who do the IB are the really bright ones (of course there are loads of bright students doing A level because they are the majority in the UK, but the IB certainly stands out) and as an employer I would always be impressed by a candidate with the IB.

My old school won't let you do A level languages anymore if you want to do eg Spanish it was to be part of the IB.

has to be part of the IB not was.

Probstimeforanewname. I’d have to disagree. Both my girls are very bright allrounders (6As at A level compared to 42 points at IB with 2As at A level). The IB was definitely easier, with more emphasis on coursework and more coaching/less independent study. Three of the subjects are at quite a basic level so it’s not really six subjects just three with a few add ons. Standard maths was no more than GCSE, to be honest. The A levels required harder work and a greater knowledge base. One did Spanish higher and that had a huge oral assessment component but was on a seen topic, coached and had hours of practice with a native speaking Spanish assistant.

A levels rarely test intellect. Infact, there are very few subjects in which you need to be bright to do well in exams. Most exams are about recalling things you've been taught, even maths. I think IBs are superior to A levels simply because they are wide ranging and give an 18 year old the flexibility to do different things later on. The depth of knowledge may not be as high as A Levels but most of my A level knowledge was either not required or that which was required we were taught again to make sure we all knew it. I would rather have the diversity than the depth. Also, there are IB students winning places at Oxbridge and Russell Group universities studying medicine, music etc.

Look into the two types of IB offered
IBCP - is a careers pathway and less intense than IBDP. My ds is currently studying this and doing engineering, physics as higher, Spanish and maths.
He wants to study engineering at uni possibly so this was ideal for him.
A levels wouldn’t have offered him this choice.

MyCruiseCintrol yes I know there is a higher tier in IB. My DD considered this instead of A levels and it is an option for my son. My DD however was aiming for Oxford and the feedback we had was that there was some debate about whether IB higher tier would give her the grounding she needed for a maths based degree at somewhere like Oxbridge. This was around the same time that King’s College School in London stopped their IB only programme because too many of their top pupils were being rejected from the best maths based courses with IB. Things may of course have changed as familiarity with IB has grown in the UK.

The IB was definitely easier, with more emphasis on coursework and more coaching/less independent study

So easier if you are better at coursework than exams, which I wasn't - but I think those who do better at coursework are better placed in the workplace. Exams are more of a memory test. Coursework tests what you can actually do day to day.