School threatening to ban DS from computers because he has been fiddling

[alison222]

Ds has Aspergers. Literally just received the diagnosis. He LOVES computers. they are his big thing at the moment.

He has been fiddling with the set up of the class computer - duplicated all the desck top items, resized the writing and screen etc.

He had also managed to rename some of the teachers documents so she can't find them.

NOw I am annoyed with hem- furious in fact - don't get me wrong as we have had the same issues with our home computer.

BUT surely they can't threaten this?
Actually I know they can't and I am more concerned about them making a threat they can't carry out and also that they have such lax security systems on their computers.

Where do I best go from here without making a huge issue of it?

Yes, they can threaten this.

It is quite common in schools for children to have their rights restricted if they misbehave. For example kids who are caught downloading porn or looking at racist sites. The local council does have filter, but inedivitably some gets through.

Its very easy to restrict a child's login times. As an ICT technician I could set this up in about 5 minutes.

Like you I would question their security. It is very easy to put restrictions on teacher's directories to stop kids doing this.

The school should also back up their data every night so that the teacher can get her documents back.

If he has been dx'd, will they be reviewing his IEP? Could you bring this up as part of this?

I think it would be good to have a chat with his teacher about this - and talk about how he perceives things differntly, how important the computers are to him, and how they can improve security and create boundaries and work with him so he can use the comuters 'safely' and constructively.

It's a bit outrageous that he can access a teachers docs, tbh. They should have that area passworded or restricted.

Alison - you might want to shift this to the SEN board in Education? Or SN? The AS dx is very very relevant to this issue, and you might attract more parents of AS children who realise that it isn't a simple 'discipline' issue.

a clever AS child will be able to hack through passwords etc though. I know a bright 9yo AS boy who is very keen on hacking. It needn't be lax security for an IT whizz child to get into it.

absolutely fennel, there are a couple of very bright AS boys in ds2's year - they spend their entire lives trying to hack into the system, and occasionally (only occasionally) being caught and having their computer priviledges removed. No lack of computer security.

I don't know how secure the school server is so I can't judge. There are levels of security, but is a balance between making a system useable and making it secure. For example it would be silly to insist that five year olds use complex passwords.

The problem with complex passwords is that no one remembers then and then they end up writing them down on pieces of paper. Or you could make the users change their passwords regularly which would make extra work for the ICT technician as the users would keep forgetting them.

It needs to be made clear to the child that breaking into a server (ie. using a tool like back office) is a technical a criminal offence. Adults have been sent to jail for similar offences.

If a child with AS dilieberately broke into the head teachers office and decided to read and tear up all the printed SEN files what would you do with him?

Even if the head teacher had left their office door unlocked, would it make it right for a child to steal something from his room?

However sounds like to me that this little boy is just a typical nine year old boy who has taken advantage of a lack of security rather than a serious hacker. A serious hacker wouldnt get caught.

Hi again.
To put this into context DS is only 6.
What I am most concerned at is a threat wich is unenforceable in real terms. There is a big IT focus in the scholl. Computers are used in teaching and to access lots of the Curriculum, It would not be practical to ban a child from using computers.

How many times have we all been told not to make threats you can't carry through.

I have a meetng with the SENCO and DS's teacher on Friday and I am wondering what to say

well of coures they can threaten this, who's in charge?

I would ask if correct use of computers can be written into his IEP as a target. I would also flag up that he probably needs extra supervision while using the computer.

But, yes they can take away the computer, unless he needs to because he cannot access the work, ie if he couldn't write and use the computer to type.

It's a shame they can't recognise that he is obviously very skilled in this area, and give him a project to do to improve them further.
It seems like the teacher is put out because he is clearly better at IT than her, so has chosen to punish him.
A bad decision I think - this could be his chance to shine.

BLU he doesn't yet have an IEP. We are still waiting for a meeting with the hospital to get the details of their assessment to move forewards. Something else I know nothing about that needs doing.
I have now started another thread in SN

It is possible to ban children from using school ICT facilities. I have known secondary schools carry this out even with GCSE and A Level pupils. There is normally a home school agreement, even at primary level, that the pupils, the school and the parents read and sign where this is laid out.

One way round if for school to have lap top style computers that are only wired up to the network server, where all access to the rest of the settings is not accessible apart from on the server computer, usually by the administrator ot technicians.

If ICT is a major focus, the school needs to look at how they can help your DS access the computers, but in a way where he cannot cause these problems again.

A ban from a computer is normally only temporary, and then under supervision.

Because of your child's age and his DX this muddles things somewhat though. I think the DX is very important here, as it determines why he is doing it, and the way in which it can be sorted.

Because he simply can'yt be allowed to do this again. That much is certain.

But you and the school, and your childm need to work together on the solution IMO.

In the short term your DS will need close supervision with the computer work. If it were my classroom I would have your DS sat next to me or a TA when computer work was taking place. If necessary during tasks before/after computer work I would unplug the mouse/keyboard as it is a very quick and easy solution to stop the meddling. Very quick to put them back in after.

MinxyChicken - the teacher can't be seen to allow a child to cause this amount of probelsm with the class computer. If they allow one child this privlege they have to extend that to all pupils. Imagine the chaos that would ensue.

Well there are several solutions a school might use. They might lend him a very old standalone computer for the ICT lesson and completely deny him use of the network. If necessary the computer could be wiped and the software installed very easily.

Or if his class have ICT once a week on a wednesday afternoon it is very easy to configure it so that he can only log on at these times.

I see no reason why such a threat is unenforcable. Any half decent ICT technican could set up the appriopate settings. The only problem ofcourse is if the ICT technician is complete and utter Cr@p

Good point about unplugging mouse.

I agree he may need to be supervised. I agree the school and I need to find a way to stop this happening again.

The way it was phrased to DS was that if it happened again he would be banned , and when he moved up to year 2 the teacher could decide if he would be able to use the computer again. He read this as a total ban for ever.

It seems that the class computer does not have individual log -ons for puils. The pupils can see other children's work and so they could potentially change it/ rename it etc so this is the worry.

Is this normal security in schools?

I am looking really for constructive suggestions as to how I can avoid a ban (esp givne that teacher is currently using time on computer as reward for good behaviour and work) and how I can get DS to understand that this is not something that can be allowed.

I SO agree with Minxychicken. The school should be proud of him! He's only 6 and he sounds well into computers! They must take his aspergers into consideration and not treat him as if he has been simply naughty. They should bring him on in IT not ban him from it!

In infant age then yes very normal IME to not have individual passwords and log ons.However now the school have had a breach of security with the current system they may wish to think about setting a password system up.

Re "MinxyChicken - the teacher can't be seen to allow a child to cause this amount of probelsm with the class computer. If they allow one child this privlege they have to extend that to all pupils. Imagine the chaos that would ensue".

I'm not suggesting he is allowed free rein over the computers, but it is not beyond the realms of possibility to give him some more challenging work to do around IT.

If he was brilliant at maths, he would be given more challenging work, without every other child in the class being given the same.

DDA (disability discrimination act)

if behaviour resulting from his AS results in action that could limit his chances in education- they can't.

When my ds was in year 1 the teacher said he always had to go on the class computer last 'cos he used to mess it up. Shouldn't chn who have internet access be monitored very closely anyway?

Doesn't sound like a full one permanent ban. More for the last 4 weeks of school for continue problems. Think that is perfectly acceptable TBH.

I know he has his dx but for the sake of the rest of the class management then I am afriad he simply can't be allowed to do this.

However now the teacher is aware of his interest and ICT skills it is something she should, and easily could, tap into - and use it in her dealings with your child - and to pass that info onto his next class teacher.

So they haven't banned him? Just said they will if he does it again. Totally reasonable. Not even a ban for a short perdid of time? Very generous. I'd be thanking them for being so tolerant.

Seriously though

If removing him from the PC's as a result of his AS is avtioned they are vulnerable to a lawsuit

Nothing that results from a childs disability can used against them in a way which limits their rights to education.

I'm not saying thats right or not, but it is the law.

I don't understand why he can do it anyway- there's a simple switch on our old setup which means that the childrens accounts cant be used to change setups.

vulnerable to a lawsuit?
oh come on, that's a bit much isn't it?

am sure it was a throwaway comment by the teacher without her thinking it through properly, don't jump all over the teacher and school. it's the end of a long term, everyone needs a break

lots of good advice here and suggestions, hope your meeting goes well, good luck