Boy who urged the killing of a teacher returns to the same school

[Blandmum]

I saw this in the Times Ed today. I can't find an on line link.

A boy at Gleed Boys School in Spalding set up a website in Bebo that urged fellow pupils to 'kill' a teacher. He also encouraged them to post abusive comments about this young female member of staff.

The Head permanently excluded the boy, but this has been over turned by the governors. The head has to take the boy back into the school. The teacher is off sick, with stress.

Nice.

I am also a bit freaked at the comments on this thread that it's perfectly normal to say you want to kill someone. OK, it's not a serious threat. But as a lecturer I think if I were to say to a colleague that I wanted to kill a student they would regard it as extremely unprofessional. If I said it to the wrong colleague I would expect some kind of disciplinary action. And if I posted it on a website I would expect the sack.

So I'm not really sure about the logic of allowing kids to say it about teachers on the internet.

And if a teacher was physically scared by these postings, whether or not that was what was intended, I think it is utterly unreasonable to expect her to have to teach that student again.

The thing is it probably is normal for lots of teenagers nowadays to say that stuff given that they play computer games etc all about death and killing

Personally no child of mine is allowed near that stuff

Kathy, I had an "anonymous" e-mail (untraceable due to poor workplace IT infrastructure back then) sent to me by a student hoping I died. I was six months pregnant at the time.
I knew who had sent it and the student knew I knew.
My workplace took no action because they couldn't prove it.
Until that student left I had to deal with their presence in my workplace most days. The stress was absolutely intolerable
I agree completely with you - in an educational environment, whether pupil or staff, death wishes and threats have no place.

if roles were reversed, and the teacher had posted this about the pupil, she would be sacked on the spot and rightly so. Just because he's 14, doesn't mean he should be allowed to get away with just saying sorry. It's not good enough.

Sometimes sorry just isn't enough is it? And let's face it, this wasn't an isolated moment of madness. The mother herself says that there have been problems with this teacher for 2 years. And now this.

All this teaches the child is that teachers are powerless, they are easy targets, and shout loud enough and you get away with it!

Was it reported to the police Marina?

Yes Cammelia. They were furious with my workplace for not investing enough in IT at that time for the mail to be properly traceable.
They took it far more seriously than work did, I have to say.

That's dreadful Marina. Impressed by the police, though.

Agree

I was distraught when I got in touch with them Kathy
I really, really should have involved the unions with hindsight, I just don't know why I didn't. I'd had a stillbirth the previous year - which the student may well have known about btw - and that whole pregnancy was a nightmare of irrationality.

I wasn't going to return to this thread, because Nj was getting upset.

I have broken my word to make a few points.

The posters on the Times Ed websoie were utterly out of order. I consider such comments are indicating that these people are highly unprofessional, and I would not wish to work with someone like that. As Kathy said, if they posted that about a named individual I would expect them to be sacked.

All too aften I hear parents say 'But X is such a good boy/girl and didn't mean any harm, they were just being stupid' in mitigation for some rule breaking. The last case at out school involved a parent who objected that the child had been excluded for bringing a knife to school and pulling it an another child. The mother felt that exculision was a total over reaction and that we should have realised that her child 'Didn't mean it'.

Sadly we now live in a society where we have to assume that people 'do' mean it, unless we have proof to the contrary. So school do have to take thse things very seriously.

This is not the case of a 6 year old shouting out something in a fit of temper. This is a 14 year old, taking the time to indulge in, at best, cyber bullying, and at worst threatening behaviour. Neither should be tolerated in a school. Teachers and other staff should not have to put up with this sort of behaviour. At all.

I am also facinated that two posters on 2 boards have indicated that the mother of the child in question verbally attacked the teacher a year ago. I realise that they could be one and the same. I do find this interesting, and would be very interested in NJs comments. I am also interested in the poster on the Times ed who indicated that there had been issues in the past. This was also alluded to in the original Times Ed article.

Did the police talk to the student

Marina, what happened to you was vile beyond belief. you must be a very strong person.

No violence, whether word or deed (and that must include bringing offensive weapons to school) can possibly be acceptable

No, as there was no evidence other than a strong, strong hunch it was that person
(Had had vile run-in with them about rule-breaking earlier that day, and I very rarely have that kind of aggro in my job).
They did offer but knowing my work had no concrete evidence for either criminal or civil proceedings it seemed futile

Am not wanting to divert from the discussion of the incident in question but I can personally vouch for the searing terror that this sort of comment, whether meant, or a mistake, or a silly joke or whatever, can inflict on its recipient.
I know some teachers posting on Mn deal with abuse and misbehaviour on a regular basis MB and I think you are all stars to keep on with trying to connect with teenage pupils and make a difference in their lives.

I once worked in an office where, though I didn't know this, I had been given a senior job over an existing staff member. She absolutely HATED me for it, and made it her business to incite hatred for me in her colleagues. Senior management never told me that I had been given what she regarded as 'her' job, so I was oblivious.
I found out she was emailing horrible things about to everyone else in my office. It made me feel sick. And that was just nasty personal stuff.
If, as a teacher, I found out one of my teenage pupils had set up a website about me with 'wanna kill her?' on her, inviting fellow pupils to post abuse, I would find that horrifically scary, undermining and distressing.
I accept that this boy isn't all bad, and that he didn't mean to cause this level of personal distress, but he did and sadly, I think the price must be that he can no longer attend that school, and I think his mother should accept that. At 14 he is old enough to get there on his own, and I don't see why it should affect his siblings.

thank you aloha, you have put my feelings into you so well chosen words!

Post 55 and the TES website as a whole has been reported to the police and the LEA. I believe CYBER BULLYING is a terrible thing and thats what this debate is about? Funny how its different standards for one yet not another?

I don;'t think that there should be double standards, and said so.

I don't think anyone feels that post is appropriate.

I don't have double standards at all. I think teachers should not post horrible, unprofessional things about pupils or parents, and I don't think teenage pupils should create websites to abuse and scare their teachers, even if they didn't fully understand the effects of their actions.

why have you not answered any of the questions put to you NJ 35?

I'm sure most right-minded people agree that cyber bullying, any form of bullying in fact, is wrong. But you seem to be quick to complain when you or your son are on the receiving end, but not so keen to face the concequence when you, or your son are the perpetrators.

Just an observation.

My view is that the boy has relinquished his position at the school through his behaviour that has caused undeniable pain and stress to the teacher involved. In life we have to accept that there are consequences to our actions and sometimes we have to face penalties for those actions.

If I was that teacher, there is no way I would want to teach in the same school as that boy, even if he is contrite and remorseful. I also believe that the governors have a duty of care to the teacher for not only her physical welfare, but her emotional and pyschological welfare also. That should take precedent over this boys position at the school because ultimately, she did nothing wrong - he did.

This boy should learn the lesson that sometimes we have to forfeit our priveleges as punishment for unacceptable behaviour. His place in that school is a privilege, not a right, and imo, even though he is sorry for what he has done, he has forfeited his right to attend that school.

I was bullied at work by a work colleague who managed to turn half a dozen colleagues against me. He even called me a bitch and when I complained to my male boss, he said that I was over-sensitive.The turning point came when I went home one evening and just sat and cried and cried and cried. I resolved then to leave because I could not take it anymore.

Thankfully, I saw a senior post, applied for it and got the job. And guess what? The bully ended up working for me. The best part about it was that I had to decide his pay rise.

I can't abide bullying of any kind and bullies need to face the consequences of their actions.

Those words written on Bebo read, imo, like an incitment to do violence and that simply isn't acceptable even if supposedly meant as a joke. Try making a joke at an airport about a bomb and you'll find yourself in handcuffs before you've had time to draw breath.

I can't really see what punishment has been given to the boy. I'm sure he is sorry - most people are when they've been found wanting, - but that doesn't mean he should escape a penalty.

If he were my child I'd think a fresh start elsewhere would be in everyone's best interest.

That is horrible SM

The difficulty when you are teaching is that the people who may be bullying you are not adults but children (adults in schools bully too, but that is a different topic).

So the teacher feels bullied and also they feel that they are failing in their job, since they are not controling and directing the behaviour of those in their care. So as well as all the other feelings of stress, upset, worry etc thay also feel that they are failures as twachers.

And as some people have done on this thread, many adults tend to assume that if a teacher has the misfortune to be bullied by children, they must be crap teachers and that they almost deserve their fate.

There is also a feeling, again it has been shown by some people posting on this thread, that if the bully is a child, and the victim is an adult, the adult should, in some way put up with it. Now while we need to make allowances for the maturity of our students, I do not feel that this give kids the right to torment and victimise members of staff. We may be teachers , but we are still just humans,. and have the right to feel safe and secure in school.

I well remember a thread on MN years ago when someone posted that when she was in school someone spat in a teachers mug when she left the room. The whole class watched while this woman drank the tea and spit. And the poster felt this was quite a laugh