Boy who urged the killing of a teacher returns to the same school

[Blandmum]

I saw this in the Times Ed today. I can't find an on line link.

A boy at Gleed Boys School in Spalding set up a website in Bebo that urged fellow pupils to 'kill' a teacher. He also encouraged them to post abusive comments about this young female member of staff.

The Head permanently excluded the boy, but this has been over turned by the governors. The head has to take the boy back into the school. The teacher is off sick, with stress.

Nice.

No=one has posted your name on the internet. Not one has asked how many people want to kill you or hate you.

" isn't it easy to type something and suddenly be bullying someone"?

given the context of this thread that is irony at its finest.

Thank you martianbishop. As you rightly say, no one has done what this boy did. And NJ35, you may feel you've been banging your head against a brick wall, but I can assure you, so do many others on this thread. You haven't responded to the many people who have tried to explain how terrible the repercussions of this kind of behaviour can be. I just hope no one ever does something as bad to your son as he did to that teacher.

NJ35 tbh I think some of us feel we are banging our heads trying to get a proper account of the events leading up your DS's suspension from you. All we have to go on is the published story. You have several times been invited to give a factual account of what really happened. You have ignored direct questions such as "what actually happened?"

At any time on this thread, you've been free to post a full description of the events leading up to your DS's suspension, including the 2 years of "problems" as you describe them, which would give a full and clear picture of events as you see them. This would have fully clarified your reasons for believing that the overturning of the suspension of your DS was justified.

You've repeatedly failed to take the opportunity to do that. You can't then blame people for coming to their own conclusions, as to why that might be.

Post 68

My previous point about rubbish and good teachers was probably too short. What I really meant was this:

I am not a teacher, but I do work with people as we all do. I will relay what I thought with reference to my work invironment. If there was a supervisor in my work place who was making an employees life difficult for whatever reason, and the employee had made complaints to the management. The management would be expected to resolve the situation. If the situation was not resolved and the employee did something that was inapropiate, then previous complaints would be taken into consideration during any disciplinary action against the employee. Now management would often side with the supervisor. If for example the employee was dismissed, and they appealed which is their right, another manager may decide that based on the facts the employee did not deserver the dismissal and may reinstate them. Who would be the victim in such a situation. Would the company be at fault for not dealing with the poor professionalism of the supervisor, or the employee for acting out of frustration in a situation. Maybe NJ doesn't want to relay back the events leading up to the exclusion, to avoid any further deformation of character. She should be admired for not being bitter, and slating the teacher, IF at any point the teacher had behaved as the supervisor had in the situation above.

eoj.... this is really missing the point. Any employee who posted on the internet asking other people to sign up to say that they 'hate' another employee, and 'want them dead' would, I'm sure, be subject to a police investigation and presumably face dismissal.

I believe NJ is being sensible not relaying her specific details of the events. Imagine, that she did, we all know she is the mother of the child. If the teacher, or anyone else read this thread who is involved in the case, they would know exactly who posted it. If she misquotes, or the teacher disagrees with anything she says then it would not help her case whatsoever. Maybe her hands are tied.

What case? She hasn't got a case, she's won.

[puzzled]

Also I think your scenario sounds reasonable eoj, but as we don't know the facts around this case, it's unfair to assume that it was a similar scenario in this school business.

yes the employee would probably be dismissed. And the supervisor never faces consequences of thier actions, gets away scot free. I am not saying this is what happened in this case, however. It is just my nature to have people question their opinions hard enough to be unsure when all facts are not present. All too often we see and read things, that are edited, etc and we quickly form opinions. I think the more fully informed one is on a subject the more justified they are to form opinions.

All to often we read newspapers, and see the tv, which is all edited, and we form opinions. For example, the newspapers follow a story of a crime, and it is edited by humans. The humans who edit, often have an opnion, and have great oportunity to manipulate the public to their beliefs. Then when the criminal appears to get a leanient sentance, or even get off, those with the newspaper editors opinion are up in arms. 'Its an outrage' I hear them cry. Well, it is not an outrage, because the 12 people of the jury and the judge are the ones that are better qualified to decide on the case, not those who read the newspaper. Just be objective long enough, to know you don't know.

I think that this is an outrage because this 14 year old (NB 14 year old not 8 year old) set up a website (NB, not shouted something in the middle of a temper tantrum) that threatened and ridiculed his teacher.

And I think that it crap. Utterly crap. Yes, he is 14, be he knew it would hurt and wound, which is why he did it.

And now he should deal with the consequences.

I'm sick to death of people justifying the shit behaviour that I have to deal with every day. he should suck it is, change school, change his behaviour and thank his lucky stars that the teacher didn't press charges.

But eoj, the one person on this thread who claims to know, refuses to share the information with the rest of us.

And we all know of cases where governors make decisions which are not supported by teachers and/ or headteachers and /or unions.

The unions think it's outrageous too, to the extent that there is talk of strike action about it.

And presumably, they do know.

and will have met the boy in question, and taught him, which is more than any of us have done.

My point exactly. The only way to form a justified opinion is to know ALL the facts. If NJ even attempted to do this, she would need to offer up exact conversations, dates, times etc etc etc. Any post where she attempted this, would of course be edited. By her. Therefore, she could present the facts in such a way the she would have oportunity to manipulate you, the reader. Would this be fair and just to the formation of your opinions?

NJ has probably spent many hours in meetings going over this case. How could you expect her to present the events, on an internet thread, to such detail you would have everything required to make informed descision. I for 1, would certainly give up reading such a document due to the size it would need to be, and would probably give up and move on.

The unions probably have more facts than we do, but they were not in the meeting where governors turned over heads decision. They too have edited versions of events, most likely edited to the favour of the teacher.

and will have met the boy.

and if he is a positive a student as his mother affirms, will have a positive attitude to him.

and yet the majority vote that they will not teach him.

To those of you who do not belong to teaching unions, NO teacher would even consider taking action if they did not feel it was absolutely vital to do so. In addition, the procedures laid down by legislation are lengthy, so, if teachers are in the process of getting results of ballots at this stage they must have ben initiated well before any media coverage. So any suggestion that comments made in the press will have had any bearing on what teachers do at this school is unfounded.

Teachers at the school, if they are reading this, cannot respond and NJ won't so I don't know what else can be said.

Oh please.

People give brief resumes of events all the time on this website. You either believe them or you don't, you don't need every if and but.

It's not so insurmountably difficult as you are proposing.

I think we should all speak in eprime english. (look up 'eprime english' on google)

It is english without the use of the verbs 'is', 'are', 'to be' etc.

Often used by scientists when describing the outcome of experiments.

So when offering up your opinion you would substitute.

'The boy is wrong and should be punished'

with

'Based on the evidence offered, I am inclinded to form the opinion that the boy deserves punishment'

Using this type of language you will always be more accurate, and less likely to be proven wrong later down the line. This whole situation would've been avoided, and the boy would probably written on bebo the following:

'based on the way i have percieved the proffesional manner of my teacher, i have allowed myself to be entrenched with very negative feelings of hatred towards her on this occasion'

Going off topic a little now, but my principal of knowing that you don't know, and knowing it enough to be totally objective is an effective way to live.

Quote
Teachers at the school, if they are reading this, cannot respond and NJ won't so I don't know what else can be said.
Unquote

Absolutely correct! probably summed up my posts without all the white noise.

Oh for gods sake. By her own admission, the mother of the boy said that he wrote 'Do ya hate her?' 'Wanna kill her?' about the teacher concerned. If I had been the teacher concerned, I doubt that I would have taken it as a serious threat to my life. But it WOULD make me distressed, demoralised, undermined and would seriously affect my ability to carry out my job. And what's more, if I did that to anyone else I would expect to be out of a job, and investigated and probably warned or even charged by the police. The boy should NOT be allowed back to the school. He should thank his lucky stars he isn't in deeper shit and think very carefully before doing anything so vicious again.

again i state this is a 14 year old child!!!!!!!
there is no question that he did wrong and if what has been written is correct, neither he nor his mother have disputed this. all they are asking for is a chance to prove that he has realised the error of his way and make amends.
some people here have claimed that at 14 he would be fully aware of the consequences of his actions but i really must insist that we take a honest hard look at how we thought at 14. i very much doubt that this boy put any more thought into the web page then we would have done 20years ago when we wrote our feeling re our teachers on the back of toilet doors! the only thing that has changed is the medium used! i would suggest that he probably only thought that his peers would see it and really didn't contemplate the far reaching effects it would have on the member of staff, exactly the same as the toilet door scenario.

The only thing that's changed is the medium used!!!! Well, yes, exactly, and as everyone knows, 14 years olds as much as anyone, the internet has a potentially HUGE audience and can inflict untold damage. Yes, I think we all agree that we hope the boy realises he has done wrong. That unfortunately doesnt undo the damage.

im sorry i didn't realise that i was talking to the one and only perfect person in the world who has never done anything wrong and wasn't at all remorseful for any thing said or done to another human being!!!!!!!!!!!
i know i have done and said things i regret mostly actually when i was a teenager!!!
thankfully the people i was surrounded by were willing to take my apoligies and give me not only another chance but probably two or three!!

Have now re read whole thread and several issues jump out.

nj35,I was prepared to give benefit of doubt BUT:

You have NOT given answers that many were seeking on this thread to a number of questions.

I go back to my relative.As a teacher,with a good discipline record,they were still threatened by knives,chairs thrown at them,physical violence during their teaching career.

I suppose cyber bullying,whilst not physical type of threat,still harms emotionally.

Teachers DO NOT have recourse to many discipline methods, as has been stated on this thread.I believe that even giving a detention meant a letter home to parents giving them 24 hours to inform them that this was required

My relative states they were threatened with the line "I'll say you hit me" by pupils.

Teachers do a very difficult demanding job,with many constraints,endless paperwork and not much credit.

Robyn 1972,maybe the fact that so many teachers have felt the need to comment upon this thread shows you the deep concern about the conditions many have to face on a daily basis.It is not so much the thread itself but a deeper underlying problem that is facing the profession,in being able to discipline effectively and have respect.

im sorry if anyone here feels that i don't value and respect the teaching profession nothing could be further from the truth! until i left to have my child i also worked in a classroom. i am fully aware of the harassment the teachers get and was myself stabbed it the hand with a sharp pencil by one unruly pupil. all this said i still stand by my previous comments.