There is no such thing as dyslexia.

[VioletBaudelaire]

www.theherald.co.uk/display.var.1430434.0.0.php?utag=40859
I've had my say!

I have been following this thread with interest. As I said previously my DH is quite badly dyslexic, so when DD2 was struggling with literacy we thought it quite likely that she was dyslexic too. However, tests run by the school showed a clear negative, although she was under 7 yrs at the time - so the tests were indicative only. She started out at State primary which failed it's Ofsted, but we thought her first year had gone well. In the second year everything went pear-shaped and she seemed not to make any progress during the first term, so we abruptly moved her to a private school. At that point she was 6 months behind the average for her year, but mercifully her new school gave her lots of extra help, (and we have too), and now she is ahead of the average. Year 3 is selective, so she has had to pass exams, and although she didn't do well in literacy, her "non verbal reasoning" was very good. I am interested that she has the high IQ, poor literacy, but is apparently NOT dyslexic. (I still have my doubts, and if not dyslexic I think she could be dyspraxic, as she is unbelievably clumsy, but I don't know if that would have any bearing on her literacy problems). Sorry this is so long!

sanae - everyone is entitled to their opinion - mine included. I havent read the whole thread, I dont need to in order to simply add my opinion to the OP and last post.

My DP is dyslexic, and passed through many Ed Psychs after finally being diagnosed as dyslexic at secondary school - having been called "stupid" most of the way through primary school (by his teachers).

I simply do not hold much weight to speculative opinions that are based on anecdotal evidence, with absolutely no experience or training in the subject. They are damaging. That is Just My Opinion.

Countto10 - absolutely - well done your mum.

I think it's sad that a child has to have a label to get help.

In an ideal educational system, each child would get individualised help. A child who had severe difficulties with reading but was very bright would probably need different help from a child who had severe difficulties with reading as part of more general learning difficulties. It should just happen without a need to do anything more than describe a child's strong points and weak points.

But the way the system is set up, there has to be a label before the help can be accessed.

I was just wondering - those on this thread with dyslexia or a child with dyslexia - what do you think about labelling a child in this way? Because speaking for myself (I have a label of "disabled") - it's a 2 edged sword. I'd rather not be labelled and just be "me", personally - which I think is a point this prof has made elsewhere.

Like you say - a 2-edged sword. When I was told DD2 was not dyslexic there was a degree of relief in that it seemed to suggest she was just behind and had the capacity to make up the ground and be as hot in literacy as DD1. However, I was also anxious that not being dyslexic could make it harder to get the support she clearly still needs, and might make it harder to get into the selective Junior school......As I said with regard to my DH:- he wears glasses to cope with his sight disability, but wouldn't own to being dyslexic at Uni to his own disadvantage because of misconceptions about the condition. Thank god he was born in the era of computers (with spell checkers etc).

I dont much like labels. But adjective sorts, such as "shy" "introvert" "boisterous" etc....

In most cases - in order to get help or treatment you need a diagnosis of the problem. Dyslexia isnt just a "difficulty", or an innate "inability".

DP, for example, finds that letters 'jump around' on the page making it difficult to read. He also finds that what his hand writes is different to what his brain is telling him.

For some children, wearing red or green tinted glasses almost completely resolves it for them. For others - touch typing (uses a different part of the brain) by-passes the problem.

Dyslexia is not a dirty word, its a very real condition.

But I think you're missing the point somewhat. It isn't a label it's a condition. Dyslexics simply cannot do these things in the same way as everyone else, it's not a case of having difficulty with it - they cannot do it in the same way as you and I. This means they have to develop a new way of learning how to do it or to live with not being able to do it. My mum is never going to be able to learn a 4 digit number so she has a special card that does not require a pin. A lot of dyslexic students find they cannot cope in a pressured environment so get extra time in exams or their writing is so unreadable, they are allowed to do their exam on a computer. It's not about labels or just needing to put someone in a special group. People who suffer with dyslexia are totally different to someone who simply has a genuine difficulty in reading and just needs a bit of extra help.

Sorry said the same thing as vvv!!!

Well, great minds and all that

sarz, you've done very well. Someone I spoke to today was apologising for his poor English in amending a letter I did for him because he was dyslexic. He has too. Their business earns £250k a year and he's obviously bright but he completely failed at school and presumably it wasn't picked up. For my daughter the worst time was jnunior school when spelling and the neatness of your writing mattered so much. Senior school was much better and university is fine. Even this week all her revision is watching the lecture DVDs - all 100% oral. She is so lucky to be on a course with that kind of materials although she's by no means badly dyslexic.

I certainly think taking the 3 children to a psychologist when I think they were 5, 7 and 9 - all on the same day was really helpful, if you can afford it. My sister has an interesting child and he's been assessed privately too. They haven't quite figured him out yet - he's amazing in some ways - he'll tell you at 6 virtually all the stops on the London underground kind of stuff but doesn't seem to be autistic. These conditions are all fascinating.

My ex husband and his colleagues found at school that those children who watch TV all day at 3 and 4 and don't get outside and kick balls and learn about space and distance and jump across trees etc were much more likely to be dyspraxic. I think for some conditions there is a "how you were brought up" element as well as genetic.

I think there's a point where a broad diagnosis is similar to a label because it's too wide to tell you what the individual person needs.

Am happy to be corrected about dyslexia as I don't know much about it and am just thinking about my experience with a "disability" label. "Disabled" tells you that something is not right, but it tells you nothing about what that person needs. I'm sick of being offered wheelchair ramps - they don't do much for my hearing really.

So I'm wondering if "dyslexia" possibly has the same problem - it tells you that someone has trouble reading but doesn't tell you if they need special glasses or a computer or a card without a pin or whatever.

The other worry about labels is that in the real world of adult life and employment there is discrimination and I don't think the law has really caught up with that.

(I know about the "difficulty" thing actually - but I prefer for myself to say that things are difficult rather than impossible - it's a personal thing, but I like to work on the principle that I can do anything, but not necessarily the way other people do it iyswim).

Oh, VVV your comment about adjective sorts really resonates, because people think I'm really shy. I'm not shy in the least - I just can't join in conversations because I can't follow them.

Being a wallflower is not "me" at all. I love chatting and discussing and even arguing. As anyone who has the bad luck to encounter me online knows to their cost.

Well, i think as long as the family and the school/college understand what is required, then thats all thats necessary, surely?

I see the point you are getting at, but, like with autism for example, on those closest or involved really need to know the intricate aspects of the diagnosis.

Its an umbrella term, a generic phrase for everyday folk to get the gist of. If someone has specific learning requirements, each case shoudl be assessed on its own merits, by the relevant body, school, employer, etc the same with any condition/disability or whatever.

LOL, well I am naturally "shy", and also, part of that stems back to my mum being hard of hearing - believe it or not! Its a long story for another time......

But, the thing is, shy is seen as a negative trait which is why i dont like it.

Essentially, there is nothing wrong with being shy - its just a different characteristic. It seems though, that society is obsessed with having extrovert or outgoing personalities, when in fact, maybe on 25% of people are actually like that. A whole 25% of people are shy. Go figure.....

But it is why i refuse to say that DD is shy. I prefer highly sensitive, if anything. The fact that she will sit back and observe her surroundings for much longer than others is no bad thing. It doesnt make it wrong. Just, different.

VVV, so maybe the problem is not the label or diagnosis itself but the way it's perceived?

ie it's useful to have an umbrella term to alert people - but then people have to be careful not to jump to conclusions about an individual when they hear the umbrella term. (In my case because people think "disability" equals "wheelchair").

One problem of the umbrella term system though is who you include. If you include very mildly affected people - who will be more common than strongly affected people - the public perception might shift to thinking this is a mild condition because everyone will know someone who is slightly affected. They might then completely underestimate the problems of a strongly affected person.

But if you don't include the mildly affected people, they won't be able to get help (as the system currently stands).

Possibly.

I would say that autism is a very good example of that.

Couldn't agree more about shyness being seen as negative. My dd1 likes to sit back and observe too, and takes a while to warm up to strangers. I'm not like that, but this is how she is and that is how I am. It mystifies me that people put a value judgement on that.

(Sorry a bit off topic, although I suppose it has relevance when people think a dyslexic child is "thick" .)

from VVVQV.."well I am naturally "shy",

Roll round all over that floor with my insides rupturing and going purple in face with spittle on my chin.....{grin]

or even....

I agree. Lots of people have these conditions mildly, like my daughter with her dyslexia. You almost feel you are doing down people who have it very severely by saying she has it, although she does, without doubt. But it's a bit like 80% of the blind being able to see to some extent (I think that figure is about right) so you use visually impaired I suppose and in a sense even people like me who occasionally need glasses for reading might fall into that category.

Pan, how can you possibly react in such a manner

Can I ask a question? I have a good friend who has just taken his final exams to become a professionally qualified architect (I hope no one recognises either of us when I say this but...) which he's left for years because he has such a problem with reading, and speaking and actually how he forms a sentence. He uses very coherent arguments, and I know what he's trying to say, but he just misses out words, or uses the most tortuous sentence structures ever ( much like this post :-)
Does any of this ring a bell for anyone? He had a g-friend years ago who said she thought he had dyslexia, but he didn't ever do anything about it. I assumed it wasn't dyslexia as it affects how he speaks too.
He is superb at technical drawing and extremely creative, but this is a real problem for him.
I edited his essay as much as I could without actually changing the content (which was pretty much fine I thought)...
Any ideas (if this gets a lot of responses of course I@ll move it to another posting....)

I'm not sure. I don't know enough about it. My daughter specifically finds spelling hard. She is a bit disorganised in terms of tidiness and sometimes won't know the year or month and doesn't quite memorise things as easily or in the same way as other people. Her essays and speech are fine though and verbally she's best of all. So it's not so much words themselves that are the problem and she has a very very wide vocabulary, it's how she visualises them or doesn't in her mind.

An example - 2e just got the Nintendo wii to work off the wireless broadband internet at home, so the children fixed it to show youtube videos on the TV which is fun and we just did a search of "crocodile, buffalo, lion" (very good video) but she couldn't spell "crocodile". Other dyslexics have wider problems and I think coherence which presumably could extend to sentence construction might be part of it.

Sentence construction can be a problem for dyslexics; sequencing problems can mean that they find it hard to get the words out in the right order. Or sometimes they struggle to access the right word at the right time due to their processing difficulties. Conversely, some dyslexics have fantastic verbal skills. I think the differences between dyslexics cause a lot of the problems some people have with viewing it as a condition - it manifests itself in so many different ways, it's no wonder that the professionals can't agree on a definition......

Frances5: I know no one has said that on this thread! its what the guy suggests and its what other people were talking about! I didnt mean it to sound like i was cross with people on the the thread, i was cross with the view that dyslexia=thick whichis a veiw people were discussing.

There's been a letter almost every day in the Times on this. One today I just read says exams should be an objective standard so you don't give John extra time because he's bad at maths, or Julie more help because hre first language is French and therefore giving people like my daughter more time or my son (who types his exams and was amazed today they even gave them spell check which he never had when he typed A levels) is unfair.

Interesting point. We let the blind do exams in braille I think and there are facilities to help those with disabilities do the driving theory test.