How important are Year 6 SATs?

[catsarenice]

DS is in yr 6 and SATs are obviously approaching. The school are going on and on about them so much and I know that they are important for their data. How important are they for the children? Every secondary school we looked at said they will look at the results but do CATs (think that's what they're called) within the first couple of weeks of term to determine what sets they will be in anyway.

I thought they didn't really matter for the child. However DS went to high school in September and has been set target levels based on his SATS scores and I think this will be used to measure his progress for the next 5 years. English and Maths levels were based on the corresponding SATS scores and all the other subjects based on these 2 combined and all lumped together in one level.

Each half term, we get a report where he is graded against these levels. Obviously, he isn't going to perform well in all 9 subjects (for example, music and art are really not his bag) so it does seem unfair to expect him to achieve the same level for all subjects 🤔

Anyway, in response to your question, yes they may be important.

noblegiraffe
love your knowledge! It makes me feel so sad that these are used in this way

What happens if your child misses the SATS - how does the government measure progress for those children?

Neither of my two did SATS.

DD's targets are based in Year 9 cats which are quite ridiculous (she has asd & a spiky profile). We all ignore the targets although they were adjusted on her last report.

Ds's targets were guessed at by his current school.

I'd like to think the schools will encourage every child to do their best - a very sad state of affairs if those achieving the lowest scores at ks2 are left to achieve low scores at gcse because the school has technically kept them on the right progress track?!

Then surely it is better to under perform in the sats tests as you'll get more help/interventions whatever your ability?

That isn't how it works. If you under-perform in SATS, your target grades will be lower. Consequently, if you continue to under-perform at secondary, you will be deemed to be fulfilling expectations, and no intervention will be offered.

In contrast, if you do well in SATS, your targets will be high and expectations will also be high. If you don't seem to be meeting those expectations, additional support may be offered.

Take my dd, for example.She did exceptionally well in KS2 SATS, and is therefore targeted to get a 9 in every subject at GCSE - including non-academic subjects like PE and art. She continues to perform very well in the academic subjects, so there are no issues there, but she is currently deemed to be underperforming in art and PE, because she is distinctly average in these areas. The point is, she is offered intervention and support in these areas because she is expected to do better, whereas other "average" kids are not given support because they are performing as expected.

Oops - I see you already answered this

My child's school has the lowest SAT results in my county and I'm getting a bit stressed about him joining secondary school, being in bottom set for everything and having really low targets because he had some poor teaching in year 5 and year 6 and never getting any help to catch up because he is on target.

I should add that I think the current system is bonkers, but it is what it is!

Not doing sats but doing cats helped my dd. She is bright & was doing well at her private primary but her English results were only just above average.

Her spiky cats profile & other factors led her secondary to believe she was massively underachieving in English. She turned out to have aspergers, interventions were put in place & she's now predicted English GCSE Grades 7/8 (& told to aspire to a 9)

As a primary school teacher I always felt SATS were purely to judge primary schools. However, as pp have said, when my oldest went through GCSEs is saw children receive interventions and extra support based on their KS2 Sats, in the favour of those who had done well at KS2.

I completely agree with others regarding target setting for GCSES. However I would disagree with others who have said it influences sets in secondary schools. I know for a fact that at least three secondary schools in our area don't use them for that purpose. Initially, they set children based on information from the primary schools and then test them in the first half term of year 7.

Just to add, the school I work at (I'm a TA) and my dd's school try their very best to play down SATs while doing their best to prepare them. DD's school has changed in this respect as they used to push the dcs a bit but our headmaster clearly feels recent changes to the curriculum and SATs are ridiculous. I think it's a sign of a good school that they tell the kids not to worry and actively try to reduce their stress.

However I would disagree with others who have said it influences sets in secondary schools.

You can't disagree with fact - and it's simple fact that some schools do this. My son's school set them immediately they arrived in September Y7.

My DCs secondary school didn't use them to set, but that didn't mean they weren't important. When they had a group of kids who they felt were borderline for GCSE grades they prioritised support for those who had higher KS2 Sat scores, they didn't want these children 'underperforming'
at GCSE.

I wasn't going to send my DC to the Easter SAT sessions run by the school but I think I've changed my mind reading this thread.

I wanted to keep things low key for her, if she hadn't learnt it by Easter she wasnt going to. Also she would probably need a break from school.

Now I'm thinking if it's important to her future I should take all the help I can get. Even though it's putting a lot of pressure on the children, and the poor teachers who loose a week of their holiday.

I suppose I don't have to decide for a while, she's Y4, but it's given me cause for thought.

I agree with a pp- whether you like it or not, secondary schools do use the scores to determine the child's expected path to GCSE.

As I understand it, secondary schools are measured on how they manage children to their 'expected' grades. So if every child in a year reaches the grades they were predicted too from their SATS, the school would be classed as 100% successful.

Word of warning though - I have seen children really suffer mentally due to the pressure of unachievable target grades - the children who have targets of all 9s, for example are highly likely not to meet this. They may feel like they’re failing, letting their teachers down and so on, when it is in fact the system that is at fault.

*So if every child in a year reaches the grades they were predicted too from their SATS, the school would be classed as 100% successful.^

Not any more, that school would be classed as ‘average’.
However, pupils are not judged against ‘expected’ progress or grades, they are judged against how every other student in the country with the same SATs scores as them actually performed at GCSE. If they get the same as the national average their progress 8 score is 0. They have to do better than their peers to be ‘successful.’

I think it depends on the secondary school. Certainly many do their own testing at the beginning of Yr7, but they also use the SATS data.

SATS shouldn't be something stressful for children. Don't encourage your children to cram for them or worry about how they do. Just send them off with a good breakfast of the day of the tests and hope they do their best.

1950s if I could do that I'd be happy! The cramming and pressure is all coming from school!

Mine do the homework only in year 6, no tutoring or practise at home. The school does a decent job of preparing them and I feel that dd1's targets are right for her. Challenging enough that she needs to put the work in to achieve them, but not completely unrealistic. Where they are too high in some subjects they are subjects she will drop at options.

I do disagree Feenie that every school uses them because I know exactly how three different schools in our area do it as I know staff in all the schools. All of those schools do their own testing and assessment and don't feel the SATs tell them very much.

I think you probably need to read your post again. I agree that you can only comment on the schools you know, not every school. Even the schools you do know can 'feel' what they like - they'll still have to meet the same targets as everyone else.

I agree that SATs shouldn't be stressful for children. The pressure isn't coming from home. DD and get friends are already worried about them and they're two years away. The pressure must be coming from the school.

I wouldn't have thought to send my DD to craning sessions . However the school run them every Easter for a week. I'm now worried that if she doesn't go she will be disadvantaged. She won't have the camaraderie, the missing links ironed out, the knowledge of how to sit exams given. If the school need to do it at Easter it's obviously not something they're doing during lesson times.

So while if like to wash my hands of it all, take done time off work and take her to Grannie's for that holiday in now in a quandary!

And them as Noble says there is the worry of you're child actually highly in maths and English and having to live up to those marks in art and Pe.

If the child doesn't sit KS2 SATs then the secondary school will come up with their own targets for them

DDs high school uses the national average for these students. Its really not an issue for these students if they miss them.

They also do their own testing in the 1st term and generally ignore all the predicted grades churned out by primary schools. SATs are purely for the measurement of teaching within primary schools and have very little bearing on high schools, at least they have very little influence around here.

There is a huge amount of movement throughout the first year at high school and Ive had dc go from bottom sets as predicted by SATs results up to the top band and top set on the SATs dc moved down to middle bands within the first year.

High schools generally try not to let a childs grade in SATs at 10/11 years of age affect their potential at GCSE. If a child is passing everything with flying colours having been placed in a middle/bottom band the high school will, in my experience, move them up. The same if they're struggling in a higher band they will move them down and offer more support.

SATs are purely for the measurement of teaching within primary schools and have very little bearing on high schools

Except that they are judged purely on whether they've met the targets generated by those SAT results or not.