Ok 4 day week threat or possible?

[3asAbird]

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-bristol-39055714

At first I thought nutter seeking publicity about school cuts.

We live in Bristol but heard same from some school in Cheshire / Sussex last 6months

Did wonder is it legal?
Would working parents put up with 4 day week or compulsory parental contribution?

Today a teacher told me due to academies aft an academy can structure their school however they see fit.

So set their own hours
Decide on structure of school day.

I assume if 4 day week they be longer days or kids in neighbouring county or different academy chain be getting more education how the heck is this fair?

I suppose the teachers could just run an after school club for all pupils till 6pm at additional cost to the parents to raise school funds. Then they could do a sponsored car washes on Saturday - followed by a heads shave and fun run on Sunday! They really aren't taking their profession seriously enough!

But if you have schools providing out of hours care on the 4th day which parents have to pay for if they want to go to work then it's essentially forcing parents in to using a fee paying school!

No because that day would be childcare, not school. It wouldn't be run by teachers teaching lessons!

Actually that means parents working 5 days but being paid for 4 - as in 1 days pay goes into school - there's a hot potato

I see what you're saying, that yes, it's not 'school', but parents would still be forced to pay money to the school for day 5 (assuming they worked FT) and their DC wouldn't even be getting taught! And that's in addition to their taxes! Terrible!

A civil servant has already suggested that parents should contribute money to make up the shortfall, so don''t think it is not in the government's contemplation to pay with taxpayers' money only for the bare bones and expect parents to go without or pay from their own purses for anything more than a very basic education with no frills. To vote for a low tax, austerity party and expect anything else is a bit deluded, really. This is a country where you ain't seen nothing yet when it comes to the divide between rich and poor, robust and vulnerable.

And stop expecting free childcare - we don't pay enough tax for all this...

because i dont know any teachers except pe who dont already do about 6 hours work on a sunday.

That's missing the point though.

If you stopped paying me on a Friday-I would need to go and find a paid teaching role elsewhere on a Friday so my salary wouldn't drop. I can't afford to take that hit to our household income.

I would still work at the weekends at home, because, well-schools aren't open then and I wouldn't be able to find a teaching job at the weekend.

I wouldn't just think, 'oh, ok-I'll just earn £400 less a month but will enjoy spending that day planning and assessing!' My thought would be, 'shit-I need to make up that £400 shortfall, I've got to get a one day a week contract or do supply'. I'm presuming that not every school would drop the same day every week!

What would be amazing is drips ing the classes and giving that day over to prep (paid) for the teachers... I think I read some schools in Europe do something similar

But I somehow dont think that's what they were thinking.

This is an ideological assault on the poorest communities from a government who have seemingly made it their raison d'etre to limit the ambitions and aspirations of the poor. It is cynical and cruel and the long-term impact of the cuts to state education will be devastating.

Please take a look at this website- www.schoolcuts.org.uk/#/ Enter your child's school postcode and see the figures for yourself.

rollonthesummer No, we will still work the same hours but spread over 4.5 days, not 5 days. We will start 10 minutes earlier and finish 10 minutes later Mon - Thursday which will allow us to finish at lunchtime on Friday. We could either take our time together as teachers (usually an hour a week at my school) for after school one day, as at present. Or we could opt for every other Friday, or something. That is to be decided.

No extra / reduced pay. No change in contracts or anything.

The reason for it (in Scotland) is that teachers have to be in front of classes for a fixed number of hours (22.5 from memory). However, that number of hours fits more neatly into 33 lessons a week than into any other model. It means that, for example, I am not teaching 15 minutes less in the week than my contract. Over the whole council this adds up. It will make little difference to me in terms of teaching, class sizes etc. We are contracted to work 35 hours and outside the core (class time, plus meetings etc, plus a few other bits) we can do the rest of the work from home.

The workload issues in Scotland are very different.

It will be an issue when it spreads to primary schools where they are going to have to have an after school Friday club or two - or sort something out. However, for me it is great. We live quite remotely so the chance to start the weekend at lunchtime on Fridays means that we can get to a major city by 5pm and then start our weekend away.

Sorry - meant to say that the 33 period model has been tried with 3 long and 2 shorter days but the 4.5 day week seems the most easy to arrange. With much of Scotland very remote, school transport is fairly fixed and ties in with other public transport timetables so it is simpler to just vary things once a week on a Friday.

What is the legal status of the 190 day length of the school year for pupils?

I don't actually think academies have to stick to the 190 days, so I would imagine that can easily be changed for state schools if it 'needed' to be.

If the teachers work the same amount of hours but instead of over 5 days just over 4 days their pay shouldn't be less, it should be the same as the work the same amount of hours.
And for the working parents, at the moment, many working parents pay either before or after school or both. If the school day is longer (the 4 school day) there might not be a need to pay for before/ after school care, but then there'll be the need to pay for "holiday camp" on Friday (of the day with not school). In my view, the cost to parents might be the same.

I'd be very surprised if a 4 day week resulted in teachers being forced to go part time. I would have thought that they would just make up the hours elsewhere: longer days, after school training, training on Fridays, requirements to mark/plan/provide work for Fridays etc.

I don't think that would save any money though, Hosta?

I actually think that all support staff will go before they implement a 4 day week.

Or maybe in bigger schools, they will have one qualified teacher in each year group and have the other classes taught by TAs (under the supervision of that one stressedteacher). That would probably save a fair amount of money.

Canada has a few area's that run a 4 day week, my children went to a school that did a half day on Monday (awkward but that's not the point). it was a condensed day (19 minutes longer each day) nothing really noticable. No teachers contract issues.
savings...not really significant but enough to motivate school boards. online it suggests the most cost saving was from reduced bussing fee's, with ancillary (janitorial, secretarial) savings, minor heating and lighting.

I don't think that would save any money though, Hosta?

Well, I suppose the idea would be not to be running the facilities or some of the support services etc, but no you're right - not as much as cutting the teaching staff's salaries too!