Girls - co-ed or single sex secondary?

[Cornygirl]

Just that really!?!

I think you have to look very carefully at what the schools offer in terms of education AND pastoral care, and choose what is best for your child

This ^

As it happens, both my ds, and then both my dds did go to single sex schools, but it wasn't a criteria that I felt was a big influence, either positively or negatively. They went to the schools they did, because, looking at our realistic options, and then taking EVERYTHING into account, they were the best options for each of them at the time we had to state our preference. I don't think it's something you can take in isolation, you have to look at the individual school, and also your own dc to find which you think will be the best option for them

I agree 100% with LittleBoat, and my daughter much prefers her coed to her old girls' school. The girls tend to dress up for the other girls in my experience, and they often learn to see the boys just as other kids- interesting, annoying, and anything in between. There are surprisingly few romances going on (year 9), perhaps because the sexes are thoroughly demystified when you share everyday activities with one another.

My dd chose to go to a single sex school. She thinks now it was the wrong decision and she wouldn't make the same choice if she had her time over again. She feels she had a massive amount of catching up to do when she got to university in dealing with boys.

I went to a single sex school and I expect I'll send my DDs to a single sex secondary (they're going to a co-ed primary). My personal opinion is that girls tend to thrive academically in a single-sex environment and it helps them to foster independent thought and a feminist world view. This is obviously with the massive caveat that all kids are different and will have individual needs that have to come before any principled decisions you might make.

I think it is fair to say that bitchiness exists in girls' schools to a greater degree, and I intend to go out of my way to counter that outside school, making sure my girls have good self-esteem and mix with a wide range of boys and girls outside school hours.

"There is an extremely high achieving girls school near to us but it has a big problem with anorexia, bulimia and self harm."

This is often used. It's a sort of red herring. Sadly, the truth is that adolescent mental health is a major issue across all schools and the whole country.

Every class in every year in every school is likely to have at least one student who will have a serious issue to deal with during their school life.

The real question is how do school deal with it. Some school like to pretend that they don't have a problem - those are the schools to watch out for. The schools that acknowledge the issues and don't hide them are often the ones that have proper pastoral care.

It depends on the child. My daughter is at a girl's school and it is completely wrong for her. She has got too involved with the social/bitchy side of things and has pinballed around friends so much with so much drama along the way. If she put as much effort into her school work she would be doing great as she is bright and the teaching is very good. There are girls there who flourish but unfortunately dd is easily led and too invested in shallow and material lifestyles. We are waiting for a place in a mixed school where I'm hoping there will be some change and she can't wait to get out of the girls school. I wish I'd realised this before but was blinkered by the ofsted grades and smoke and mirrors open days.

Co-ed 100% over.

My dd is at a co-ed school and I haven't come across any of the stereotypes given on here in her education.
The main difficulty with comparing girls and co-ed schools is that many of the all girls schools are either in the independent sector rather than state schools or have other selection criteria other than just being catchment schools. They may also tend to be in more affluent areas.
A generation or so ago many girls schools were grammar schools and so it isn't surprising that perhaps these pupils have gone on to do well in terms of careers etc.
IMO the most important thing is whether a school will suit my dcs not whether they are single-sex or co-ed.

All my girls have gone co-ed and no way no how would I have inflicted single sex on any of them - it's very odd in the modern world.

I have two at all girls, and couldn't fault it. No issues as yet with bitchiness!

MN164 my three eldest DDs got straight A* at a co-ed so the 'could have done better' doesn't wash with me. They also had a completely normal environment in which to achieve, chose subjects with complete freedom. At the local 'academic' all girls private school they leave in droves at sixth form to achieve some semblance of normality. All girls schools are a historical hangover who have to attempt to justify themselves, but no arguments are at all convincing.

Id go for the best school first, assuming that she'd get into both. If both schools are equal, I'd go for single sex, the only reason to weight co-ed over SS would be if she had no or few makes in her life outside of school. I went to a co ed and got distracted and discouraged; there was also low level but constant harassment. Both my DDs went to SS schools.

Males not makes!

The fourth and last DD hasn't yet taken GCSEs, so I can't say if her education will be stunted by co-ed but I doubt it - she's currently achieving 8s and 9s in Y9 so so far so good, touch wood.

Girls at single sex schools are more than twice as likely to choose STEM subjects than at co-ed schools.

IMO the best compromise is a girls' school which has close links with a boys' school.

I went to a girls school and a mixed sixth-form, & I think it worked really well.

I'd second that.

Both children flourished in co-ed. For 6th form, DD went to a boys school that admitted girls for A levels - girls were the minority but DD flourished and girls were actively encouraged by staff to stand up to the boys in discussions.

I love the fact that DC have easygoing friendships with both sexes

New research has actually shown that children are better in a co-ed environment until 13 years of age, single sex until 16 and then brought back into a co-ed environment for their 5th and 6th years.

I hope this is true as it means for once in my life I've made the right decision re my dds education

My DD is at a school which is co-ed from reception to year 6 and in sixth form, but teaches girls and boys separately in years 7 to 11. They share premises, lunchtimes and some extracurricular activities. Best of both worlds to me and she's thriving.

I loved my girls' school. Things I noticed from school/university days are that the girls from co-ed schools who were good at science tended to go on to study medicine, dentistry or vetinary science, while the ones from single-sex schools wete more likely to study pure sciences or engineering.

And as well as not dealing with harassment, in a single-sex schools the girls didn't experience chivalry. They carried their own heavy furniture, put out their own spiders and climbed their own ladders. They were the backstage crew for the school play, and played the drums and bass in the bands the girls formed.

The best thing for me about going to a single sex school was that for most of my teens, I didn't really think of myself as being a girl; I was a normal default human being. I didn't make adjustments to my behaviour around boys because it didn't occur to me that I could or should.

Within two years of leaving school, I found myself letting men carry heavy things for me, censoring my topics of conversation if men were around and doing all sorts of things which are now so automatic I'm not even aware of them but which happen because I no longer treat men and women the same.

Having said all that, my local catchment school is an excellent comprehensive which I am very glad that both my DC can attend. I have a boy and a girl who would miss each other in different schools.

I second that Jasper. Went to all girls, we had great freedom to grow, develope physically and emotionally, compete and be friends. Our bodies were not discussed in terms of bums or boobs but strength, speed, agility etc. I am also not sure why "bitchy" is held up as a concern in these discussions? How very deprecating. People can be bitchy. Not just girls. As for the anorexia, self harm and bulimia? Usually ways to deal with emotion trauma that have little to do with school and lots to do private affairs. We had none in my school for example. I felt I walked out of there a confident young woman ready to take my place in the world. I was very surprised at the sexism I encountered when I left but was strong enough and formed enough to recognize it for what it was. Much use that was however! 😂😅
please excuse typos!

Fantastic, thank you!
I would always base my decision on individual school/child, but wanted the general view too.
In an ideal world I would do this: "New research has actually shown that children are better in a co-ed environment until 13 years of age, single sex until 16 and then brought back into a co-ed environment for their 5th and 6th years."
But am worried about moving them at A Level - isn't that really distracting? Especially going from SS to co-ed?
Choirmum - where is your school and why aren't there more like it, it sounds perfect?!!

I have observed that the girls who would veer to physics, FM and CS are likely to feel a bit isolated when doing those subjects at sixth form since the classes will be very boy heavy and so much time is spent with their A level subject groups. Otherwise I would agree with co-ed schools / college or close links with a boys' school by sixth form as better. In the younger years studious girls may complain that boys can be more disruptive and time wasting in class, others enjoy their humour.

goodbyestranger

Whilst I'm delighted to hear good stories for girls at co-ed schools and agree that this should be the "norm", it isn't and the evidence continues to support this, not just from an academic standpoint but also from a pastoral one.

I want school life and adult life to be free of discrimination and full of equal opportunity and fair reward for merit, but it isn't and single sex schooling clearly helps a small number of girls do better whilst protecting them from harm/issues that as, say an 11 or 13 year old, they are neither mature enough or should be expected to deal with (google sexual harassment stats at school).

Dds are in a single sex school, one is doing science a2s this week with the goal of reading a science subject at university next year. Almost all her friends are doing maths A level. Dd2 is younger but assumes she'll do maths A level too. I agree with them having the opportunity to do techy stuff they do things which boys would gravitate towards & then take ownership of, like making sets for the theatre, running the lighting board etc.