tell me about a 'privileged' education

[Frostycake]

If you attended a grammar or private school or if you teach in one (or taught in one), tell me what I may have missed by having a comprehensive education in the 1980s.

I sometimes see glimpses of the education I could have had if circumstances had been different for my parents (the recent TV series on Harrow, meeting and working with people who went to Oxford, Cambridge, Malvern College etc.) and I often wonder what it is I missed out on apart from the obvious opportunities and overflowing confidence and maturity this type of education seems to instill in pupils.

Come and talk to me about the detail as I'm bursting with curiosity.

£200 sounds like a pretty decent daily rate to me. Supply teachers don't even earn that.

DD attends a non-selective independent school in the HC and TBH there are very few trades people amongst the parents.

Bankers, lawyers, doctors, scientists, CEOs etc. Plasterers? None that I can think of.

Word, perhaps if my PGCE was from Cambridge I'd stand a better chance of getting a job at a decent independent school. Easier said than done, it's not as if I haven't tried.

pickled I suspect it's not your qualification that are the problem but your lack of recent employment.

It's very difficult to get back into the work place if you've been out of it for a prolonged period.

If it were me, I'd work backwards. Get some supply work. Get a job in a state school. From there apply to an independent school.

I'm intrigued by the "non-selective" private school, Word. We are on the fringes of London near several local private schools. They are all less selective than the top London day schools, but they are still somewhat selective. They have entrance exams and turn away DC every year.

Do you mean non-selective compared to a place like Westminster? Or completely Non-selective: no exam, no interview, no school report, etc?

Have recent teaching experience/tutoring experience/governor experience/university experience.

…marking experience.

spring I mean no academic selection.

There is an entrance exam but no girl ever fails it. It's used for setting purposes etc.

The selection is done by interview and school reports to choose the sort of girl who will thrive (as much as these things can do that).

The spread of ability is in line with national averages.

So you can get in no matter how low your ability. And girls of low ability do get in every year. What matters is that the HT thinks said girl will thrive in the environment on offer.

Word . I bet girls who are not 'their' type fail all the time. The entrance exam is a nice way to say to girls 'who they don't want' sorry you have failed whereas any girl who is from the right type of background is excepted even if the score 10%.

There is no such thing as a 'non selective' private school, because even if the school was totally academically non selective, who is going to pay the fees !.

London/SE is different from the rest of the country. there are plenty of private schools here who take all comers if they can pay fees, lots of them. I could name at least 5. When my daughter might not have got into the seniors of her school (although in the end she did pass) she sat for 5 other schools and I am sure at least one or two of those would have had just about anyone who could pay fees. I certainly agree that unless it is a private school which has moved to being blind as to ability to pay (tends to be a very few selective ones - Manchester Grammar is moving that way) then there is selection in terms of can the parent raise £10k a year or whatever.

Nor is background an issue at all in these non selective independents. They are full of all kinds of people.

There are entrance exams at these places but no one fails one. I suppose if a down's child sat they might fail but other than that they woudl get in. Even places like Millfield which are about 800th in the country for exam results and are good for less bright children who are sporty are not very academically selective if at all. In fact some of the boarding schools are so short of pupils as most parents want day schools they will take most people who apply and can afford the fees although they then have the issue of whether they want the school to become 50%+ Chinese.

Oh sure smoke the first selection process is can you pay the fees .

This excludes most folk.

I was speaking strictly about academic selection.

"I suppose if a down's child sat they might fail but other than that they woudl get in."

Plus ca change.......

Sorry, feel I've derailed the thread a bit.

I'm just thinking that there are schools in my area which are somewhat selective. They'd like to be super selective, but they just don't have the applicant numbers to be so. Their lack of selectivity is a sign of their lack of popularity/success.

Now, getting to know Word through these threads over the last year, I just don't see her choosing a school that isn't successful, at least on its own terms. So this is a school that chooses not to be academically selective. A beast I've never encountered in my neck of the woods! Barring private religious high schools who are their to serve their religious community.

their = there

I don't know if it's auto correct or me! This is happening a lot to me lately. Really irritating when I post and spot it.

Here are some it is not too hard to get in - www.royalmasonic.herts.sch.uk/ and www.aldenham.com/.
If your parents can afford fees and you might well not get into the more academic local schools like Haberdashers etc you might go to one of those two - in fact I could do a list of about 15 local private schools in order of which are the hardest to get in and get the best A level results down to those nearer the bottom. Most parents know which are easiest and which not in their area. Even in Newcastle where I am from and even 30 years ago that was so from my brother's school Newcastle Royal Grammar (which used to be direct grant) to the easier to get into ones. It would be the same in Manchester - Manchester grammar downwards. Same in Leeds -The Leeds Grammar school (state) down to a variety of Leeds private schools which are easier to get into and get worse A level results but might well suit a lot of children and are going to be your only choice if you cannot pass to the most academic in your area.

However outside City areas you are more likely to have one private school only or none. Depends where you live.

I don't actually think any of these schools chooses not to be academically selective. They take children who largely have not got into the harder to get into privates and a few children whose parents do not want a high achieving academic school for some reason. That does not make them bad schools at all - just not very academically selective or not so at all.

"Here are some it is not too hard to get in"

Unless you're a "down's child" presumably?

Some of the best provisions for children with special needs is in the private sector. There are schools specifically for children with dyslexia and many other things. However, you are right that those two schools I mentioned probably do not take children with down's syndrome which my sister had (although she died before school age).

And sex too - I specially chose single sex schools for all 5 children as that was my preference so if you are of the other sex you would not get into those either. It's all about choice and them ore women earn the more choices they have in life which is why it's sensible to encourage your daughters to work hard at school and get a high paid job and never give up full time work.

Having just looked at Royal Masonic School on DFE Performance tables, it looks pretty selective to me !. An average A level points (B grade) total of 243 Points is equal to all but the top 20 grammar schools in the country .

It has to be academically 'selective' to get those results.....

spring we have so many highly selective schools in this neck of the woods, DD's school sells itself in an entirely different USP IYSWI.

To be fair, it wasn't my choice. I wanted DD to attend one of those selective schools, or a grammar at a push. But DD was sold on her school the second she walked in. And I was over ruled.

I've come to see how incredibly successful it is though. How it does something quite extraordinary with a mixed ability cohort.

smoke you'd be surprised at how good the results are for many private schools that don't select academically (or at least not in any meaningful way).

DD's school punches way above its weight. For DD's of low/middle ability its worth selling a kidney for.

Any selective school does better that any non selective school. Whatever the selection criteria. And that includes money.

I have an idea , how about starting A fee paying 'Secondary Modern' where all the kids go who have failed their 11+ Plus exams......

"I have an idea , how about starting A fee paying 'Secondary Modern' where all the kids go who have failed their 11+ Plus exams......"

They exist especially in Kent!

I'm not too bothered about selectivity. A school that works hard to do the best for each child is most important in my opinion, I would choose that over league table results for DS. If they have intelligent children entering in the first place then you would expect/hope that school would get good results- is it necessarily the teaching standard that makes the difference. There are value added scores available and Ofsted reports that can help guide you in choice though as well.

A fee paying secondary modern would do significantly better than a state one. Because it would be selective.