tell me about a 'privileged' education

[Frostycake]

If you attended a grammar or private school or if you teach in one (or taught in one), tell me what I may have missed by having a comprehensive education in the 1980s.

I sometimes see glimpses of the education I could have had if circumstances had been different for my parents (the recent TV series on Harrow, meeting and working with people who went to Oxford, Cambridge, Malvern College etc.) and I often wonder what it is I missed out on apart from the obvious opportunities and overflowing confidence and maturity this type of education seems to instill in pupils.

Come and talk to me about the detail as I'm bursting with curiosity.

I would love to have the option to send DS to private school Jilly, if needed. We are both on very average wages so not quite sure how to do it! At present his future school is one of the ones featured on ch4 documentaries ...

at the idea that anyone can earn enough to pay 4 lots of school fees, and anyone can educate themselves- all they have to do is pop in to the local library...........

You are the reincarnation of Samuel Smiles and I claim my £5.

The theory that bright students would do well wherever they go (state or private) can be tested.

Take super selective private schools and a super selective grammar school. Both will only be accepting and retaining the most able all through to A Level. Compare the results on the DoE tables.

Which school produce consistently better results?

There are plenty of ways to skin cats - promotions at work, your own business, two jobs, scholarships (my 3 sons had or have music scholarships and that is as much about a parent putting in the hours watching practice as anything), one of our sons only paid 15% school fees as his father taughta t the school (a bigger perk than many private schools but still something teacher parents should consider when picking jobs - we knew a couple where one of them was at a prep school as a teacher and their 3 children went virtually free there from age 4 and at 13 the boys went to the father's school where he taught - boarding school - virtually free - the family were also housed in a free school house too).

It is without doubt though that one reason I earn what I do is I am prepared to work harder than most mumsnetters. It is all about leaning in. Obviously if you an IQ of 80 or a disability which means you cannot read or something then you won't be able to earn more but often it's more about simply making a perfectly valid life choice to work in the arts or be at home. We all make choices.

The more interesting issue on the thread is why people might think you need to have that high earning privileged life in the first place. I might earn quite a lot but I definitely do not think you need any of these things to be happy and live a good life. Rest, silence, music, the children, hobbies, walking, being alone are all things that are just as important to me as earnings. I would argue earning quite a bit gives you the chance to balance your life better but many people can argue the opposite case. I always say the most important thing in my life is that I am mentally and physically well and happy. No matter what you earn if you are ill or depressed life is awful. Make sure you always put the latter first.

That's a wee bit snidey, Jilly. The 'working harder than most mumsnetters' bit I mean.

Yeah, well. Many people's cat skin barely covers their living costs, jilly- however they skin it. You child's music teacher in the early days for example. Or the person who looked after them while you were earning the school fees.

Obviously there are many people who work very hard for low pay. I have a house full of workmen at the mo and none of them will ever be able to afford private school, even if they work 24/7.

Though to be fair, I suspect it's not something they lose to much sleep over; more pressing things on their wish list.

There are however, people who do want private school for their DC, but are not prepared to do the necessary. There was a thread not long ago where the OP was desperate for her DC to attend a particular school, yet had been a SAHP for years.

I also know lots of media/arts types who want the trappings of wealth that they grew up with, but also want a career in media/arts . Grown men and women who still haven't put two and two together...

I was just reading that thread thewordfactory because I was trying to find some posts of yours about private school I wanted to re-read. They weren't in that thread though! Although your advice to 'take the precaution of earning a fortune' was

Well DS is only little and who knows if we'll have another so I guess I'll save hard, try for promotion at work (I am main breadwinner) and see how we go...

'people who do want private school for their DC, but are not prepared to do the necessary'

I don't think people want it handed to them on a plate Word, not everyone is blessed with your clarity of thought.

Personally, I'm sure I could think a lot clearer if I was earning enough money to stock up on investment properties.

Jeez if I could afford a well qualified nanny to come and play with my DC in my beautiful/inspirational home, run around the grounds chasing ducks and sending me photos on Skype videos whilst I work in my high powered job the whole SAHm/WOHM might have been more palatable.

For many people, the road to where they are now has had to be constructed from light and shade, glimpses into other worlds, a stitching together of aspirations without a picture of what might be possible.

Some people are doing this from the vantage point of earning a bomb but I'm not one of them.

pickled I come from a background where aspiration consists of getting through the week.

Before I got to university I had never met anyone who had been to private school or grammar school. I rarely met anyone who hadn't attended the same school as me.

I had very little idea what life looked like on the other side of the tracks, let alone how to get it for myself. So I completely understand how that works.

However, I have little patience for people who do know what that life looks like, and what it takes to get it, but won't do the necessary. They want the music but don't wanna pay the piper.

Many a tradesman working on the minimum wage works his way up to owning his own painting and decorating business. I don't accept that workmen at our houses are limited only ever to earning that sum if they want something different.

I am not saying hard work always pays off but it tends to. The only reason I got the best A levels in the school was I worked harder than anyone else. Ditto top of year at university, Ditto working full time ofte 6 days a week for at least 50 weeks a year continuously for the last 30 years and yes without one single break, even between jobs and without even a maternity leave. I do think that is pretty hard work which most women aren't prepared to do. The fact I was wise enough to pick work I enjoy which lots of people are foolish enough not to do also helps.

I think most people man or woman are not prepared for that work rate jilly.

DH and I certainly do not generally work six days a week and we always take plenty of holidays.

I agree about tradesmen. Plenty of private school using, second home owning tradesmen about in SE England!

I guess it depends on the trade and how many people you have working for you.

My plasterer just charged me £200. He worked from 8am to 2pm solidly. And it looked like hard graft to me.

Out of that he had to buy materials, run a van etc. That's not a lot of money, is it?

It rather depends how many 6h shifts @ £200 he does per week, and whether he has a partner also doing 6h shifts @ £200, and any employees.

"I agree about tradesmen. Plenty of private school using, second home owning tradesmen about in SE England!"

That really is utter bollocks!

I don't think you do understand how it works Word. You've had a first class tertiary education that has set you up for life. The same can not be said for all of us. I don't even think I knew about Oxford/Cambridge other than the mention of them on a UCAS form.

I have an OK degree from an OK institution and a few more quals along the way. Like Jilly I took myself off to the library and devoured book after book except I wasn't reading about how to make money, I was reading about psychology. Consequently I have made it through life thus far relatively issue free.

Would I spend all my salary on a place at an independent school for my kids? Yes I would but I haven't managed to nail down that elusive job. Does that mean I'm not doing the necessary?

My reasons for staying at home with my DC are deeply unpopular but they were nothing to do with being work shy and I didn't think for a second that it was going to be an either/or situation in terms of that or a career that pays enough for school fees.

"Ditto working full time ofte 6 days a week for at least 50 weeks a year continuously for the last 30 years and yes without one single break, even between jobs and without even a maternity leave."

Groundhog Day. Did the people who looked after your children earn enough to send their children to private school?
Thought not.

Hakluyt - all over SE England are pockets of massive, City-generated wealth. People who buy large country properties to house their families need and use all sorts of tradesmen to service them. If those tradesmen are canny, they make lots of money!

He seemed very hard working, very efficient but I think most people would struggle to do that kind of manual labour for twelve hours a day, six days a week.

Don't get me wrong, he wasn't complaining. He came to the UK with only four words of English; Coca Cola and fuck off . He's pleased with how his life is going (he described his DD to me as 'my heart') but private school isn't a concern.

Bonsoir sure there are some people making cash out of offering services to the wealthy, particularly in these parts.

My friend makes a tidy profit out of 'dressing homes' for Christmas and wotnot!

But these people tend to be the minority and own the means of production. The majority of workers do it for relatively low wages (certainly not private school terrirtory).

Bonsoir - the 80s called. It's time you were back!

In rural Kent you also find out pretty fast that grammar schools are the school of choice for the DC of NHS consultants and provincial solicitors whereas tradespeople like (non-academic) private school and do what it takes to send their DC. Who are then educated alongside the non-academic offspring of aforementioned consultants and solicitors.

It's the service sector semi-skilled jobs that have such hopeless prospects. Not trades.

pickled I just realised that you're the SAHM poster from the thread I mentioned! Apologies for not spotting you sooner.

Like I said on that thread I admire your chutzpah. You remind me of my Mum. You want the very best fir your DC even though your background has not made that easy.

However, IIRC, you're a teacher. Teachers earn decent money. And there are always ways for teachers to earn more. Plus teachers can get jobs in private schools and get their own DC discounts.

It is so obvious to me (and everyone else on that thread) that this is the way for you to get what you want. But you wanted to be a SAHP. Fair dos. But you can't have it every which way in life.

I wouldn't call dressing homes a trade.

Bespoke kitchens/carpentry is very lucrative. Ditto rebuilding barns and outbuildings in vernacular style.