Are GCSEs changing for current Year 9?

[nomorehollyoaks]

My DS is in Year 9 and about to choose his options. I understand he has been told that the way GCSE results will be assessed is changing. Two key themes that I have gathered from what he has told me are (a) that in future GCSE results will be aggregated to produce a points score; and (b) that the results for a student's best 8 GCSEs will be particularly key. We have an options meeting at the school coming up soon, but in advance of that I'd be grateful for any information about how the system will work. In particular, is it correct that the best 8 GCSE results will be particularly key in some way? And if there is going to be some kind of new points system, how will that work?

TIA

Initially just English and Maths. The rest to follow.

100% exam.

Very different topics to study, dictated by government not those who know children (they have never been in a bottom set year ten in an average school for sure!)

The 8 grades do not mean anything to him just to the school - they are to be judged on the 8 top grades.

There will be numbered levels not grades with a grade 9 being an A*+ and a higher "acceptable" pass mark somewhere between a C and a B - whatever that number will be.

That's my understanding and I have to teach it next year!

Yes, we've been told that current Y9s will do new-style GCSEs in English and Maths (graded 1-9) and old-style GCSEs in everything else. The other subjects are moving to the new style in the following years, so eventually all GCSEs will be 1-9.

A smaller % of children are expected to get the top grade (9) than currently get an A*. In fact there will be some formula applied to ensure this is the case.

English and maths will be 1-9 not A* to G, yep. It's a right mess for this lot, to be honest.

Thank you for helpful replies. So my son will end up with number grades for English and maths and letter grades for any other GCSEs ?! Any idea where this notion of total number of points comes from? My son has some idea of an "old" system based on a bar chart and a new system for which the metaphor is that it is like a bucket that you have to try to fill up with the required number of points

I think the worst thing about this change, is the proposed limit on A*s.

3% is the current intention. Absurd!

The best 8 and the points score are to do with the new league tables for secondary schools. This is actually being introduced for the current Y10s. See attached link for further info www.aqa.org.uk/supporting-education/policy/gcse-and-a-level-changes/performance-tables.
Pupils will still receive their grades in each GCSE subject as stated above.

That limit on A*s is probably a normalising/standardising of the curve, it's the system I grew up & I read was normal in England for CSE-O-levels until early 1970s. Otherwise you have to expect rising grades each year because that's what human beings do, get better & better at the same things. Only rising grades each year gets interpreted badly by newspapers, so return to the quota-type system so that each group is judged relative to whole cohort (with 700,000 kids in each yr, can't expect to see any yr that much brighter or dimmer than previous or future). I think quota system makes some sense.

DD is in yr8 & will do a mix of old & new style GCSEs.

I think the "best 8" is an excellent idea. It should kill the habit of encouraging bright kids to do vast numbers of extra GCSEs in order to haul the school's "average points per pupil" metric up a bit stone dead.

The proposed changes, in addition to previous changes that limit the number of retakes/early taking of GCSEs, will mean that it is easier for holders of GCSEs to be used as a tool of comparison between candidates. Similarly, the cap on achievement of top grades will make those top grades meaningful.

The changes will bring English public examinations more into line with international/global standards. There is nothing untoward about them.

I don't have an issue with caps on A*s (well I do a bit but understand the reasoning). It's the 3 % number which I think is absurd.

If that figure is rolled out across all subjects, the numbers of A*s in some subjects will plummet.

Seems unfair on the cohort.

I thought there weren't going to be any more A* grades, but 9 grades instead?

The new system will not be comparable with the old and no comparisons should be attempted.

I think it's highly unlikely that the world will, en masse, recalibrate their thinking and expectations.

For a few years people will convert to old money and by then the government will lower that cap!

For one thing, they'll realise that the sheer number of remarks in the UK will make their cap unworkable.

And keep in mind the number of students taking IGCSEs.

Seems to me that everyone will manage. People who need to understand the precise equivalence (like admissions officers) will soon learn to understand 9s vs. A*s vs. whatever because it's their job. People who just need a rough idea of how good a grade was (vast majority of employers) will only know what they need to know.

I agree the change is overall waste of time.

It's worth bearing in mind that IGCSEs probably won't count in performance tables in a couple of years, so many state schools won't really be able to offer them. See here: www.bbc.co.uk/news/education-28108153

I don't know of any plans to look at a total points score (and I work in the industry - can't really be more specific!).

The 'bucket' thing is how some people are explaining the new performance measures - known as 'Progress 8' and 'Attainment 8'. Qualifications are split in to sections - so English and Maths in the first 'bucket', then the eBacc qualifications in the second 'bucket' (so Science, languages, Geog/Hist, Computer Science) and then a range of others (eg the creative subjects) in the third 'bucket'. So, in the 8 that count, students have to take English Lang (extra 'weighting' if they take Lit as well), Maths, etc etc. You can't make up the 8 just from 'soft' subjects.

This school has explained it really clearly: www.oasisacademyjohnwilliams.org/sites/default/files/files/P8%20Fact%20sheet%20for%20OAJW%20-%2031032014.pdf

Sure, but independent schools use them and will probably continue until they've at least assessed what sort of problesm the new system brings with it.

My experience is that people adapt to new examinations remarkably quickly. A bit like when lots of countries changed currency for the Euro.

Double weighting mathematics sounds like a very good idea! I don't know why the better of two English grades should be double weighted - single weighting of each of Lang and Lit would be perfectly straightforward.

I was second year of new current GCSEs and it know looks like dd will be second year of the new GCSEs (she's year 8)

The new GCSEs were a mess when they were first taught - teachers unclear on expectations, Noone really 100% on anything related to them, grades much reduced when compared to subsequent years not long after, very few resources for home use were out there in time, and everyone compared them to the old exams.

Really not very impressed that dd will be one of the first guinea pig years just like I was.

And no doubt in another 20 years they will come up with another whole new system to mess the following generation about.

Thank you for the replies. Is it expected that these new "Progress 8"/"Attainment 8" measures will be used by universities when assessing candidates? To be blunt, I am not too bothered about how my son's school performs in the league tables for the year in which my son does his GCSEs. However, I am concerned about my son making a choice of GCSEs that is "tactically" wrong due to us not understanding how the system works. I understand that my son will have a choice of four options. Maths, English (lang and lit), RE and (at least) double science will all be compulsory at GCSE. If he wants to do triple science, that will use up one option. In terms of how he performs relative to his peer group, my son's best subjects are French and German, and he is minded to pick both as options. So if he does triple science and keeps doing both MFLs, that will leave just one option. Is it really important for him to pick as that option the subject in which he thinks he can get the highest grade? (When I say "important" I mean in terms of maximising his chances in the university admissions process.) Or is it OK to pick one option based on enjoyment of the subject, even if he would be more likely to get a better grade in a different subject?

My son is a good "all rounder", but doesn't really know what subjects he will want to do at A-level, let alone at university assuming he does actually decide he wants to go to university. Obviously, I appreciate that hard work is key in all subjects(!) but I am concerned that my son doesn't make unwise choices based on lack of understanding of the system.

Universities, colleges, employers etc will NOT use Progress 8 - they are a school league table measure the same as % 5 A*-C grades is a league table measure.

As far as options are concerned a reasonably able child should have 10 subjects to include 2 x English, Maths, double or triple science, a language, a humanity and something creative - these would be a good broad range suitable for any future. Some may not want to do a language or a humanity or a creative subject and that would also be fine as long as they realised that might slightly limit their A level choices. Though if you're no good at Languages and don't take any at GCSE I doubt you'd want to suddenly do one at A level!