Cant get DC into a faith school

[angelfireabbey]

I know this is possibly the wrong place because it seems the whole of MN is atheist or totally secular. However, there is a lot of discussion by MNers here about getting intofaith schools ( often without any faith because they are good schools).

I am a little bit fed up with it. I take my faith seriously. I take my DC to church and we believe. I wanted my DC to have a faith education. There are only two faith schools where I live. They are oversubscribed by parents who seem to have suddenly aquired a need to attend church to get a vicars signiture.

I had my pastors signiture but we didnt get a place. So instead my DC is stuck in a state school where the teachers and other children laugh and say that they have " imaginary friends" ( or simply they are nutters!) and that they believe in fairly stories etc. Sound familiar MN parents? ( I bet you wouldnt say it if someone were of say Jewish or Muslim faith though would you?). It is offensive you know.

They have an atheist teacher who clearly knows next to nothing about Christianity.

I would settle for any faith school although there are no others ( of any faith ) within 40 miles of us.

So how do I get into one? I have asked my church community. I know they are doing their best and we are praying hard but I am sure some savvy non religious types must know more here. So I am asking.
I see thread on thread where parents are scamming the system.So how does a genuine person get in?

Thanks.

rabbit
The lads on the plane were not British. They ranged in age from about 16 to 21 - there were no supervisors with them. I do not know why they were coming to London - or why they had been in New York.

But their arrogance towards all who were not of their group was a real shock.
I've met adults from the same group who have been charming and friendly.

These young men brought their religious group into disrepute IMHO and that of everybody else on the plane, esp the crew

Posonwoodlife - ALL independent schools are different. That is why they are called independent schools. You cannot generalise one with another , even when both are at the "top" ( as measured by whatever criteria you wish). You should know that if your DC went to an independent school.

Trouble is, wazzup- you are being so cryptic that discussion is impossible!

I agree abut the poppy thing- but as you say, that's most certainly not confined to schools. As soon as mine reach secondary, they have the choice to wear white, red, none, or, as I do, white and red together.

BTW
At DCs school RE is optional at GCSE - because the school take the entirely sensible view that they will get better results out of kids who want to be in that exam - about half the year group take it and get excellent results

the other half of the year group enjoy the subjects they take

all pupils still attend "PD days" where ethics and the like are covered.

I am not being any more cryptic than TalkinPeace is.

I am very aware of that liberal agenda you mentioned earlier and of how we need to be very careful when discussing comparative relgion and other faiths.

Now, if I were the kind of person ( I am not) I might say how disgusting it is of Rabbit to promote the White Poppy in this the 100 anniversary year of WW1, especially so, given how many ofthosemen and women whoare represented by the Red Poppy fought for the freedoms experienced by Rabbit which allow her and her DC to wear a white poppy.

Such arethe sensitivities here. Maybe it is best this discussion were closed now?

Wuzzup
I am only being cryptic about the exact group that the boys were in because I'm actually very surprised that nobody has guessed.
It shows that several religious minorities are badly behaved when out in a group.

You on the other hand said up thread that you are agnostic, when you are clearly not.

BTW I stopped wearing a poppy after Bliar ordered the invasion of Iraq.

"Now, if I were the kind of person ( I am not) I might say how disgusting it is of Rabbit to promote the White Poppy in this the 100 anniversary year of WW1, especially so, given how many ofthosemen and women whoare represented by the Red Poppy fought for the freedoms experienced by Rabbit which allow her and her DC to wear a white poppy."

You could say that, but it would mean that you completely misunderstood the history and meaning of the White Poppy. But you wouldn't be alone. People who aren't interested in exploring and understanding other people's points of view often get things wrong.

You're doing it again, aren't you, wuzzup?

Twice in your post you state that students find studying more than one religion "confusing".

You've made it clear from your previous posts that you find it confusing, but why do you think bright, interested teenagers would have the same problem? I just ask DS, who did his GSCE RE in June, what he thought of your comment.

Let's just say he disagreed with your assessment of students' critical faculties. Strongly.

You on the other hand said up thread that you are agnostic, when you are clearly not

You are wrong. Please do not presume to tell me what I believe in or do not. I neither believe nor disbelive in the existence of God. I think it is something I cannot know. ( that is what an agnostic is)

SuburbanRhonda my DD (Yr9) certainly doesn't find studying more than one religion confusing. She's working on the concept of marriage across all the faiths and none and is finding it fascinating. The level of discussion in the group is very high. There's a lot of disagreement, but it's civilised and respectful disagreement. There's definitely no 'liberal agenda' .

I am very at the way some people seem to belittle the ability of our young people to handle interfaith discourse and study different faiths and cultures. I find it very disrespectful to think of young people that way.

DD is in a state comprehensive, by the way.

You could say that, but it would mean that you completely misunderstood the history and meaning of the White Poppy

No I have not misunderstood it Hakluyt, I simply am not buying the liberal agenda to which it belongs.

Next you will be telling me it is also acceptable to read out in the list of remembrance of war dead the names of Adolf Eichmann, Joseph Goebbels, Hermann Goering, Reinhard Heydrich, Heinrich Himmler, Adolf Hitler, Rudolf Hoess, Josef Mengele, etc. After all they too died in the second world war conflict.

No doubt you might say that??? But I would not personally consider it respectful to all those who gave their lives fighting against facism.

There is a time and a place and November 11th is not it - for either the White Poppy or the list of SS officers and political leaders associated with World War2.

Have a White Poppy Day by all means but not at the same time as Red Poppy Day.

But that you can contemplate it being acceptable shows how far removed from understanding what the conflict was about suggests you have failed to understand something very fundamental there Hakluyt.

Agreed, pointy. DS was also in a state comprehensive. It's reassuring but not at all surprising to hear that your DD's class is having such informative and intelligent debates in their lessons.

The thing is, I can easily ignore comments from people like wuzzup about young people's analytical skills when debating life issues.

What's worrying is the attitude of people who prevent their own children from learning about other religions and beliefs by not allowing them to be exposed to them. It's frightening that someone might think that's a good way to prepare young people for life in the real world.

I am only being cryptic about the exact group that the boys were in because I'm actually very surprised that nobody has guessed.
It shows that several religious minorities are badly behaved when out in a group

I think it is far more likely that many have guessed who the group might be but do not want to suggest it. There are some with a bigger reputation than others.

It is a shame when we have to recognise that fear is playing such a big part in what we can openly discuss.

Let's just say he disagreed with your assessment of students' critical faculties.

Maybe his critical facultiesare not as good as you and he would like to think? Maybe he has just learned what he has to think and say to pass the exam and hasnt really thought about it?

Maybe his critical facultiesare not as good as you and he would like to think? Maybe he has just learned what he has to think and say to pass the exam and hasnt really thought about it?

And maybe he is an intelligent young man who has done well in the state system, just as countless other young people do.

And maybe he is an intelligent young man who has done well in the state system, just as countless other young people do

Maybe the key is in the term intelligent? My own DC are on scholarships and are very intelligent but I do not try to use them as an example when I kknow that the majority of pupils are not of their ability level.

That is disengenuous.

Wuzzup
I am not afraid to discuss any group.
That particular group are pretty unlikely to be on MN after all, and they have form for behaving badly on planes.
The biggest problem with the UK Haredi is that unless their daddies can get them jobs in Hatton Garden New York's Haredi have a penchant for camera shops they end up living on benefits because their education system has not prepared them for modern life.

Which brings us neatly full circle.

Maybe his critical facultiesare not as good as you and he would like to think? Maybe he has just learned what he has to think and say to pass the exam and hasnt really thought about it?

My own DC are on scholarships and are very intelligent

wuzzup, you are priceless.

Wazzup, given your frankly bizarre comments about the white poppy, Eichmann and Hitler, I'm not sure I would look to you for an analysis of the critical thinking skills of others. I don't wear a white poppy but it's not difficult to consider the post-war context of the red poppy and understand why the white poppy arose alongside it.

You may also wish to check out the words of the former Bishop of Salisbury, among others, on the subject.

I find others' views refreshing - even yours - as they allow me to challenge my own assumption. But to suggest the white poppy is akin to glorifying Nazism is a wee bit risible.

Congratulations on your intelligent DC, wuzzup. There are lots of equally intelligent young people in the state system though.

"Next you will be telling me it is also acceptable to read out in the list of remembrance of war dead the names of Adolf Eichmann, Joseph Goebbels, Hermann Goering, Reinhard Heydrich, Heinrich Himmler, Adolf Hitler, Rudolf Hoess, Josef Mengele, etc. After all they too died in the second world war conflict."

Because that would be exactly the same as wearing a generations old symbol of the desire for peace............

When I was a university lecturer, there were some social groups who were well known for poor behaviour particularly toward women but when complaints were brought it was dismissed as "culture" and we (as lecturers) were subjected to a series of CPD's on culture and diversity!

But it has always been so. It has always been too that there is a "received wisdom" concerning what viewpoint can be held.This is true in history as it is in RE and PHSME. An example without giving anything much away. My DC's last school did a series of lessons on people of faith. They decided to start with someone local ( but historical) and work out toward the world. They got the pupils to look at the life and faith of this person ....... they presented them as a person of faith and a good person doing good deeds.

My DC came home with this as homework one weekend. The name was mentioned to my father who suddenly said "what are you doing studying traitors and terrorists" and he gave a very different history of this person who he had in fact met many years before (dad was in the armed forces at the time).

I looked the person up and sure enough there was a time ( in my dads remembrance) when this person had been considered at the least a trouble maker and actually was found guilty. But they were being presented quite differently to my DC and the received wisdom of "society" today is quite different. But looking at what they did, it could be said they were a traitor. In a university as part of a lecture and seminar it might well be given an airing and any argument made accepted as reasonable even if a minority view. However, had my DC said that at school it would have not been received well. I told them not to say what granddad said.

But the same is true of many figures. History and modern society re writes them from what they were to what they are presented. I am sure you can think of many, as can I. It is this kind of agenda I dislike in schools. It pervades faiths, historical people and changes whole rafts of values.

What worries me so is that so many people just accept what they are told by media, politics or school, and do not look beyond to see if another persons view might just be valid.

Wuzzup
and do not look beyond to see if another persons view might just be valid.
and some people send their children to a school where they only learn about one Faith rather than many

FWIW the Haredi lads on the plane were not just sexist : they looked right through everybody who was not in their group - we did not exist as equals - they treated the male cabin crew as servants in a singularly grating manner.
There was one girl with them ( clearly the sister of one of the boys ) she sat there chewing gum and reading magazines but was at least polite. However she did not seem to notice the rudeness.

They are welcome to their faith, but it should not impinge on others.
A basic part of understanding the viewpoint of others that they failed.

The person you describe sounds very like