What to do with a disappointed father on his daughter's GCSE results

[DeiseGirl66]

My husband left school in the 80s with just three O Levels, despite being very bright. He blames his poor attitude to school on his lack of academic success (the classic, chippy working class boy), but also believes that his teachers and parents could have done so much more to push him to meet his potential. He went on to achieve an honours degree in his early thirties, but feels that his early underachievement has held him back throughout his career. He therefore had very high hopes for our DD, who completed her GCSES this year. Bright, creative, with a naturally enquiring mind, she breezed through the Key Stage 2 SATS and by the end of Year 9 was predicted to achieve a cluster of As and As in Year 11. My husband's aspirations for her extended beyond even Oxbridge - he believed that scholarships to Yale or Harvard were within her grasp. These expectations were not entirely misplaced. At the age of three she wanted to be a palaeontologist and she achieved a score of 135 in a non-verbal IQ test at the age of 11. But having always found learning so easy, she took her foot off the peddle a little bit in the final months leading up to the exams, especially in the non-science subjects. Today's GCSE results were therefore a reality check for both father and daughter. One A in Additional Science, 4 As in maths, core science, Italian and Religion, and Bs in the two English papers, History, Drama and ICT, might be considered a very solid set of results and are enough to get her into the Sixth Form of her choice. She appears to be delighted with her results and is staying out with friends tonight to celebrate. But my husband has been brooding on the Bs in English and History and the lack of an A in maths all day, and his disappointment has tarnished any sense of celebration or achievement that we might have enjoyed in the family home. Writing this, I can only feel sad that so much expectation is being placed now on pupils to achieve As and As, not just with my husband and daughter but from society in general, that anything less seems inadequate. Can a 16 year old child's future aspirations really be dashed at this stage, just because of these results? How do I manage my husband's disappointment, which I believe is a projection of his own sense of failure?

Your DH really has to stop investing so much in the Oxbridge/Yale/Harvard route. Your DD may not choose to try for them, and may not get in if she does. It would be totally wrong for her to be treated as having failed if she opts for another university. In fact, if your DD has had trouble in disciplining herself to work, I suspect the Oxbridge model would be totally wrong for her and she may need something a little more structured.

Has she ever said that she wants to go to Oxbridge/Harvard? Maybe it's her way of saying she doesn't?

OP bright children in my opinion find GCSE's boring, and they are not used to having to work hard to achieve what others achieve only with significant graft, my DS did very little for his (fortunately he did well). I'm hoping that next year will be better, now they are (hopefully) studying subjects they're interested and chosen, combined with the fact that in most schools they're treated more like adults, the relationship between them and the staff changes for the better and that this will inspire my DS to actually do some work.
I don't really see the point in nagging they are getting to old to nag, they need to really work it out for themselves that the time has come to actually do some work, the more you nag I suspect the more turned off this age group become. You say your "trust is broken" but she hasn't done that badly hopefully she's realised that she needs to buck her ideas up if she wants to go to a top Uni of course if that's what she wants to do. I agree with LaVolvan maybe she doesn't want this, maybe she has other plans she worries about telling you.

He can't relive his life through your DD.

I had a very difficult childhood and did badly at school because of it.

I have tried very hard to steer a middle course between giving my DC the best opportunities I can, but allowing them to make their own choices.
There have been some disappointments/bad decisions, but they are individuals with their own hopes and dreams. They have to live their lives when I am gone.

I have to come to terms with the fact that I have had to make the best of my own circumstances. It isn't up to my DC to make up for what I didn't have/do.

OP. Your DH needs to come to terms with his own life chances and achievements. Your DD has done really well, he should be proud, not disappointed.

I think i understand how he feels, he is disappointed that she didnt continue to put the work in. My dd got 7Bs, 2as and a D* BTEC plus one C. She did the bare minimum of work, so if there is anything I am disappointed in it is that. However that has been ongoing since year 7, i think i gave up trying about year 9. I never pushed her at primary either, to the irritation of all the teachers.

He needs to make sure that she understands that it is her lack of effort that is what he is disappointed about, not the results themselves, which are fine.

I find it amusing that she wanted to be a paleolontologist at the age of 3, sounds like she tuned into pleasing Daddy from an early age.

I'm another one who has a very clear memory of my mother's first reaction to my results being, "Why is that one a B?" and totally ignoring all the rest of the As (She remained supportive, and at my MSc graduation sighed, "I do hope you're not going to do a PhD.") We did not have a very good relationship, partly because I realised then that whatever I did wasn't going to be good enough for her, so what was the point in trying to do anything? My father was proud of me, though, and fortunately, I didn't want to let him down. But 26 years on and after her death, I still feel a bit bitter that she couldn't ever be pleased for me, and other posts in this thread show me that I'm not the only one for whom such reactions really can make an impact on people, even decades after they have ceased to be in the slightest bit relevant. Don't make her feel like a failure, because she really isn't.

The results may not have been as good as your daughter could have done, but they're still pretty good results and should be fine to get her into 6th form. What they might teach her is that she will need to do work - I learnt that at A-level, and didn't get the results expected then, as I thought I could get by on less work than really was needed. It was probably more important learning than anything I actually studied for the exams. GCSEs are a better time to learn that than at A-levels. So it's fine to have a conversation (maybe at the start of term) to point out that she knows she can do well, and that she should realise she needs to work hard to achieve her best - but don't do it in terms of, "Your GCSEs were a bit of a let-down really." If she hasn't worked out for herself she could have done even better with a bit more work, then telling her she's a disappointment isn't likely to get her to accept that.

Please try and get your husband to understand that neither he nor your daughter can change the results now. She's still done very well - there will be other parents envying you for having offspring doing so well. He also needs to know that being negative about good results really can affect 16yos. Fair enough if he's disappointed - feelings are feelings, so acknowledge it, but nothing will be gained by hanging on to the feelings, nor with sharing it with your daughter, and could possibly be bad for their relationship.

How do you now ensure she knuckles down?

My guess is that we have to make them want to study, just like we didn't force feed them something they didn't like to eat, we made them want to eat it. We paved the way with enthusiasm, encouragement and rewards. Perhaps the same tactics still apply.

You need two things - loads of hard work and a high IQ. I don't think she put in the hours. I have a high IQ - supposedly (158) and got the best exam results in the school and university prizes but that only because I worked very very hard indeed. It doesn't matter what she gets if she can however achieve what she is after.
Those results would bit be good at academic selective private schools. At my daughter's old school almost 99% got A* and A at GCSE but that is a school you pay for and it is only for very bright girls. Loads of children from state comps who work very hard to well.

Do you think if you had earned enough to pay school fees to a similar such school this girl would be looking at better results now? If so are there lessons to be learned about what careers some women pick which mean their pay will always be low? Can we change that with the next generation of girls?

Of course her hopes aren't dashed. Those are very good results. Unis care much, much about A levels anyway.

OP just out of interest what grades did your DD get in course work eg. English Lit and History and what were her mock results? I'm just asking as trying to understand how much of a surprise these grades were to your DH.

Are her A level choices the subjects she got As in.

If you are part of a high achieving cohort, you may well have friends who don't need to put work in beyond class work and compulsory homework to achieve excellent grades. This can mean that you need to work harder than them, but they can distract you from doing that. I know I did this to friends at secondary school. I was able to do much of my homework whilst on the phone to friends. It turned out that they weren't able to do the same, though they did then put in the time to do their homework, so didnt underperform. I have a friend with a photographic memory, I did have to put in more effort than her for similar results.

Also children generally hit a point when things don't come easily any more, but when this happens varies. For some children this might be in reception, for others it might be university. If you are unlucky, this point coincides with taking important exams and you don't really see it coming. If you are lucky, something else prompts you to put in the effort to overcome the surprising challenge without ever having to perform poorly to learn a lesson. I learnt to revise towards the end of my GCSEs as I scared my DM by not revising for my mock exams. I revised for the real things to placate her and it became a habit. I was lucky that I didn't have to perform poorly to learn that lesson.

Chickenfajitasandnachos (great name by the way) - OP just out of interest what grades did your DD get in course work eg. English Lit and History and what were her mock results? I'm just asking as trying to understand how much of a surprise these grades were to your DH.

In answer to your question, I dug out Dd's mock results from January. I've put her actual results in brackets to compare:

English Language A* (actual B)
English Literature A* (actual B)
Maths A (actual A)
Science Core A (actual A)
Additional Science A (actual A*)
Italian A* (actual A)
Drama A* (actual B)
Religious Education A* (actual A)
History B (actual B)

So back in January she was on course for 5 A*s, 3 As and 1 B, which by any measure would have been an outstanding result and much more reflective of her ability. Can you see now why we're both so disappointed? It justifies my suspicion that she took her foot off the pedal and started to coast during the Spring term. (Actually comparing these two sets of results and what might have been is making me feel ill!)

In fact schools usually are a big stingy on mock marks to make children pull their finger out if it's a good school.

Anyway she can get on with A levels and will probably be find. She needs an aim whether that's to read medicine at Cambridge or whatever her aims are. Once you have your aim you can work back from there.

Oh I definitely see your disappointment. Do you think it could have been stress of the exams that caused her to under achieve? Was her drama coursework etc A*s? I only ask because my DS apart from the Italian did exactly the same options as your DD and we got a good indication of his results from coursework.

So she got three as predicted and 1 better, two slightly worse, and three respectable, but a couple of grades down from predictions, none of which is exactly a disgrace. You don't say what type of school she is at. It sounds to me as much about the prestige of the school as it does about your DD fulfilling herself. She's done OK, she's happy - all of those grades would enable her to take A levels in the subject, and if she knows she didn't fully apply herself, she also knows she's got a bit more in the tank when it comes to A level.

You yourself say you partied at university and only got a pass degree. Would you rather that she had got the predicted A*/As, good A levels, and then partied at uni and did the same as you, or worse, and dropped out?

For what it's worth my niece took her foot of the pedal for A levels, after being a straight A/A* pupil. She missed her grades but was very very lucky and they let her in. It was the wake up call that she needed because it made her knuckle down from the off.

Was she stressed? I don't think so. She's generally very cheerful and laid back and takes things in her stride. She certainly didn't seem stressed at the time - no obvious signs like nail biting, moodiness, sleeping or eating problems. If anything she seemed a little too relaxed and maybe thought she'd done enough because of her good Mock results, which as I said were a more accurate reflection of her capabilities. I remember getting a bit of a jolt when my mock Leaving Cert results were poorer than expected and I upped my game significantly for the actual exams, so doing well before her GCSE mocks may have had the opposite effect. But it is a lesson for A levels, that she'll have to sustain her work level to the finish line, to avoid this happening again.

For her A levels she's playing to her strengths - Maths, Biology, Chemistry and then a more difficult choice between Psychology or Italian - we're waiting on her Sixth Form to confirm which of these they can accommodate. She was going to do Drama as her fourth choice but we've knocked this on the head. Her new school has an excellent drama club which she can join as an extra curricular activity.

Crumbs - being a parent is an emotional roller coaster, isn't it?

OP there is nothing wrong with the mocks, they are hardly off, yet your response is that it's making you feel ill!

This is just as much about you as it is about her father. You both need to calm down and let her flourish in her own way, which might not be to reach academic perfection at the expense of everything else. Accept her and encourage her in these last two years you have together, let her be her own person.

If her coursework for some of the A predicted subjects was A or A but she ended up with a B then her performance in the actual exams must have been about a C which seems low for a potential A* student. Or was it the other way round and her course work was around a C?

Just shed tears for a boy who has reportedly killed himself over disappointing GCSE results. How low must he have felt.

Goodness, your daughter is the only one managing this sensibly.

She works hard mostly, she sleeps in on holidays, face times her friends, plays guitar. Great! There's a well balanced young person. It all bodes well for a healthy, balanced and, more importantly, anxiety-free life.

I would say you have done a very good job in raising her and she will probably go on to enjoy all aspects of her life. This is worth so, so much more than a clutch of top grades.

Twiggytape and Treadheavily, your words are so true. As I type this, she is bursting her socks off laughing in her bedroom downstairs - oblivious to her Worry-Guts Mum upstairs in the loft - with her two best friends who are on a Doctor Who sleepover! It's 1.20am and Doctor Who is long over. Maybe I should tell them to say goodnight! Maybe this is what being sixteen is all about?

He needs to learn than not everything is about him.

What does she want to do with her life? How does she feel that she did? What did she find difficult, what is she pleased with?

IQ tests are bollocks, particularly when done years before. It's irrelevant, forget that. Don't hold her to some standard you've set for her in your mind. Listen to her and how she feels and what her aspirations are.

And ttell your husband to shut the hell up before he does her some real damage.