6th form Teacher

[zafira63]

Is there any teachers on here that are a 6th form teacher that could possibly help me with me a question please ;)

Good Morning and the debut continues ;),
I said to my daughter last night that you was a teacher, My daughter isn't being mentored it is were they go in the morning before lessons from 8.30 till 9 so in fact it should really be up to them if they choose to go in at that time or not for that half a hour as long as they are there before 9 to start there lessons then it shouldn't matter! And the school is a academy. And i have raised it with a head of department on the phone were i was told they had better things to do with there day than discuss what and were there staff is! i took it further to the head of school and the teacher in question was made to phone and apologise to me, Now i am not saying all teachers are the same maybe you have just started as a teacher maybe you have been doing it for years and know how to get the best out of your pupils i don't know all i do know is my daughter is a hard working student that is never behind on her work and works very very hard i wouldn't have it any other way and to be honest i don't think she would a student who isn't motivated to do well in life don't take there own time to learn another language from a private tutor, i am just saying that if she isn't behind on her work she doesn't disrupt classes and is never late with homework is not a child doesn't want to learn. she isn't in a group of what is called (The cool girls) up there she is just a hard working young adult trying to get good A levels to go to uni to have a good start in live surely that should be the only thing that matters. and if your pupils are texting you and asking questions and you don't mind then i would say you are clearly a teacher that needs to maybe do motivating classes for other teachers because the ones my daughter has do not have the same attitude as you, But then again like i have said to my daughter if that is the job she chooses to do then being responsible for other children's further is what in the future she will get paid for and she should want to help and be proud that her pupils are that keen that they are asking, I mean you don't go into being a fireman and not expecting to get burned etc all jobs have there own downside that can lead into there own lives but we get paid for that and it is a job we choose to do other wise people should choose a job that don't involve other peoples lives and future.

Actually, a lot of important information, assemblies and pastoral care goes on between registration and first lessons in schools so it is important to be in school at the time that school starts.
School isn't just about the lessons there is other stuff going on as well. I am confused as you appeared to suggest earlier that she was involved with mentoring. Is it just form time? I often have important things to do with my form in that time.
Can I just repeat what I, and other people have said, working into the early hours is not normal (unless it's the day before coursework is due in - or maybe that's just my school!). If she is having to do that she MUST speak to school about it. Maybe they can help her at lunchtime?

By the way, teachers aren't actually paid to let our students control our time 24/7 - I'm just a bit of a mug working in a very academic school, who spends too much time on things.
If your daughter's periods are so bad she needs time off school you MUST go to the doctor. There are medications available to help. I wish I had gone before my A Levels instead of completely bombing out on my best subject and missing out on my first choice university place.

Also Morning Noblegiraffe,

As to your question about being taken seriously i am the mother of the pupil being taught at a school were teachers are being paid to teach and if i have a concern then it is my right as a parent to voice it and theres as a paid teacher to listen it shouldn't be a issue on what the problem is about it should be a issue about trying to solve it! All i know is as a parent i will always be there for my children no matter what age they are no matter what in life they are worried about if it needs me to help them through it then i will do that until my last breath as i am sure any good loving parent would, just because i am not a teacher and maybe don't have as many qualification as one it certainly doe's not mean that my views and concerns shouldn't be taken seriously!!

Zafira, is your dd planning to go to university after she leaves 6th form?

If your daughter is in 6th Form though, it's time for her to take some responsibility.
For example, if she thinks she should be allowed to drink Oasis, then she should take it to the student council (one of those things that happens between the time of school starting and lessons starting) and they can pass on their concerns.
I'm sorry that one of the teachers at the school was rude to you, but that is unusual and we are just human. It is our job to teach. It is not our job to be at the beckon call of 100+ parents and their individual demands - it would not leave us any time to teach. Sorry if it seems harsh but you seem to be equally angry about everything. The ban on juice which is sticky if spilt is minor (IMO) the real issue is that your daughter is making herself ill keeping up with her workload. I may be an awful person but if she was up until 1am I would still send her in. It was always the rule when I was a teenager.

But Zafira, your concerns appear to be that the school is taking attendance and punctuality seriously, and that they shouldn't be. That's not going to get you anywhere.
Similarly, that students should be allowed to drink what they like in lessons - not going to get you anywhere. As mentioned above, eating and drinking sticky drinks around books isn't a great idea.

If you want a college, take your DD out and send her to the college. Trying to get the sixth form to fundamentally change the way it runs because you wish she were at the college isn't going to work.

I think reality is you you are cross your child has been critisised. Maybe she isn't perfect! Why are you letting her have time of for period pain. Employers won't. If they are such a problem get back to your gp. Maybe she is a young carer for her brother but again employers will still expect her on time.
You need to start supporting the school

"All i know is as a parent i will always be there for my children no matter what age they are no matter what in life they are worried about if it needs me to help them through it then i will do that until my last breath as i am sure any good loving parent would,"

I hope you do realise that if she goes to university her tutors will not be allowed to discuss her studies with you because of confidentiality issues. You won't be able to help her, she will have to help herself.

I would say (as the mother of a daughter the same age and with some similar problems) that your most important job just now is to teach your daughter how to be independent and sort herself out.

This means taking her complaints to the legitimate channels (student council etc), working with her tutors to find good study techniques (if she is up until the small hours she is doing it WRONG), showing a professional attitude about attendance.

These people will be writing her reference. If they tell the truth- that she can't be bothered to turn up on time if she doesn't think anything important is going on- then that will not make a good impression on a future employer/university who may be thinking about taking her on.

There is very harsh competition out there these days. There will be plenty of other students who get 3-4 A*s but who will also get glowing references about their attitude and problem solving skills. Does she want to be outcompeted by them?

Hello OP

I no longer teach but did so a while ago and I have ds1 and 2 who both attended 6th form school/college, in recent years.

I can assure you that whatever further ed your dd chooses, her attendance will be closely monitored, as with all students.
At college I regularly spoke to parents about attendance, punctuality, progression and we had parents evenings.
We also had Ofsted inspections.

The only difference as I could see was the students were allowed to call me by Christian name and not Mrs x.

In terms of sticky drinks and use of mobile phones it was a constant battle, but I'm not sure if that was due to the college in which I taught or is typical across the board.

At university attendance will be chased up. And, just as at school, it won't be for dd to decide what's worth attending and what isn't.

I have every right to voice my views and to be honest i wasn't expecting anything different from the views of teachers and i respect that, But on the other hand just because you are teachers and in a job of power it doesn't mean that all your views and rules are right sometimes they need to be reviewed and looked at. I now as a parent i am banging my head against a brick wall but i will continue to fight for what i feel is right with or without the support of the school and staff, I wish i had sent her to college because they are treated as young adults and not as children when and if it suits them because on one hand teachers want them to be young adults and take responsibility for there actions and them on the other hand they say they are not responsible enough to decide what drink they can have that seem selective to me or am i wrong on that as well! And yes the attendance was the issue as well but like i said if my daughter is doing her work to better standards than most there and above why do teachers feel the need to talk to her like a child! I mean they either want her to be a adult or a child don't be selective to when and if it suits, And no Mary 21 i don't think my child is perfect and thats rude to say i think she is i just know she is not a naught girl she is a very good one maybe that is what teachers don't like because they are used to naughty children and parents that don't have a view.

zafira, I am not a teacher. I am however a university lecturer and have some idea of the qualities we are looking for in a student.

"And yes the attendance was the issue as well but like i said if my daughter is doing her work to better standards than most there and above why do teachers feel the need to talk to her like a child! I mean they either want her to be a adult or a child don't be selective to when and if it suits, "

I think a reasonable response to that might be that if your dd wants to be treated as an adult she has to behave like an adult. That means sorting out her own problems and accepting general rules, in the spirit of an adult accepting workplace rules. Not running to mummy every time she comes up against something she doesn't immediately understand the purpose of.

Restrictions on sticky drinks in areas where there are books or other vulnerable material are very common: how would she cope with a university library or a lab? They wouldn't tell her that she is old enough to make her own rules- if there is a no drinks rule and she breaks it she will be banned from the library, which could mean failing her exams.

What we are trying to say is: she is shortly about to enter a world with heavy competition. Do you want to teach her the attitudes that will help her to get along and make a good impression, or is it more important for you to be stuck in this good child/naughty child thinking?

How well she is doing at school is a separate issue to her attendance.
She could be doing MUCH better if her attendance was better. She will be missing out on things.
At university they are even stricter on this and will throw you out for non-attendance. Asking her to attend and following it up, is NOT treating her like a child. Asking her to follow the rules of her work place is also NOT treating her like a child.
What did you want us to say? That our students are allowed to do what they want? Well, that's just not true. Also, year 12s are not adults in any legal sense anyway. They are children still. We expect them to be more mature than Year 7s and that's why I would expect a Year 12 who disagreed with the rules to be able to articulate why in the appropriate forum themselves. I wouldn't expect a parent to come in demanding their child be allowed to break the rules on what to drink.
Yes, you are entitled to your opinion, but you asked for ours.
Even if you ignore everything else I say can you PLEASE ask your daughter to speak to her teachers about working more efficiently - she should NOT be working to the early hours of the morning on a regular basis. It is not normal.

I realise the drink issue is just an example not the crux of the issue but are you saying the is told she cannot drink a fruit drink anywhere on site or that she cannot drink it in the classroom? If you mean anywhere then maybe that's a bit much unless they have a huge wasp problem but if you just mean in class then isn't that simply common sense?

I'm a teacher, I'm also an adult. There is a sign up in the staff room saying 'no food or drinks around the computers please'

Is this treating me like a child? Should I throw my toys out of the pram and go to the head demanding my rights to decide where to snack?

Or should I realise that it is probably a sensible rule brought about by the need to keep keyboards crumb-free and avoid spilling things on electronic equipment and just abide by it?

You seem determined to think that anything that hinders your daughter from simply doing as she pleases is treating her like a child. It's not. And it's nothing that she won't face in the workplace either.

If she has really bad periods every month she needs to go to the GP. Mine were ruining my life (as it has an impact on everything if for 2 days out of 28 you are incapacitated: that averages to a day every fortnight). They would be able to offer her either the pill, something like methanamic (sp?) acid or a referral to investigate.

She and you choose to do her A-levels at this school, she has to follow the rules.

From what I can see your dd is doing 5 as levels plus an additional course in French outside of school hours.

Quite clearly your dd needs to decide which courses she can and cannot continue with as the workload is having an impact on her health and therefore her attendance. If your dd only has to do 4, I would encourage her to consider which 4 are best suited to the career she wishes to peruse, complete the AS year and start looking for colleges where they can offer her French as well, so she is not having to take on additional tuition outside of college hours as this will naturally impact on the time she should be allocating to studying her subject - homework if you like.

Yes she may feel she is a year behind having to start as levels again. But far better that than for her to end up with poor reports and grades at the end of her current course, and then having to start over again to get to where she wants to.

The issue of what your dd has to drink is completely irrelevant. At the end of the day she is in a school environment and will have to be seen to be setting an example to younger pupils.

I'd also encourage your dd to attend from the start of school. That extra half an hour could be good time to get a little work done in the library rather than cramming it all in after school and after French tuition. That alone is an extra 21/2 hours a week!

The point is, sixth form isn't compulsory. They don't have to keep her there. Sixth form students have a duty to attend and follow the rules, or they risk being asked to leave. Is a bottle of Oasis and a bad period worth that?

you are doing your daughter no favours by encouraging excess absence and excusing lateness.

I can't believe what I am reading! You are extremely lucky that your daughter is not in the year below where you could face legal action for not ensuring that your daughter attended school. You claim that she is an adult and yet here you are complaining on her behalf. If she has medical problems, she needs to address these. Opting out is not an option - she has to adhere to the rules set by the organisation as she would if she were in the workplace. She cannot pick and choose. It is no argument to say that everybody breaks the rules.

You want us to agree with you and sympathise - it is clear that most posters do not share your views. We have tried to offer suggestions and advice, yet you continue to blame the school. You need to take a more objective view on this.

As for Oasis - are you serious? I disapprove entirely of Coca-Cola, which makes this product. Do you know what is in Oasis? I'd like to see you defend the following - I got this from the Coca-Cola website.

'Water, sugar, fruit juices from concentrates 5% (apple, strawberry, redcurrant, cherry), citric acid, natural berry flavourings with other natural flavourings, fruit and vegetable concentrates (blueberry, blackcurrant, carrot, apple, hibiscus), stabiliser (E452), acidity regulator (E331), preservatives (E202, E211), sweeteners (aspartame, acesulfame-K). Contains a source of phenylalanine.'

Some of these ingredients were, until a few months ago, banned in other European countries because early studies indicated a potential link to various cancers. At the very least your daughter is gaining no benefit from drinking this. You are irresponsible to insist that the school allow her to consume such a product. I hold a senior position at a top school in the country and I have instructed my staff that such oroducts should be confiscated until such times as the parent comes in to collect it. They are not permitted on the premises.

I wonder how your complaints would be dealt with if you were to report them to the local authority? You would get short shrift, I am sure.

Why don't you email Michael Gove with your issues and complaints about attendance and the rest? Why not suggest that sixth-formers should be allowed to do as they please and consume as much Oasis and cola as they choose? What do you think the response would be?

Or you could just accept that until your daughter goes into the workplace, she will have to follow the rules, get to school on time and do what is expected of her. When she starts work, she will realise that she will still have to follow these rules or she will have no job.

As you stated most posts are against me well to be honest i am not surprised are you your mostly teachers!! And as for my daughters work place when she leaves that is not a teachers concern it is hers yours as teachers is to do the job you get paid to do and teach her the subject you are trained in! as a parent it is my job to help her into life and deal with it as she progresses into adult hood and if i decide to let her drink something that affects her that is my voice not anybody else's your teachers health care workers. I think most of you are rude and should learn how to approach different situations on things you don't agree with i could state what has a haircut got to do with learning but teachers feel the need to tell others how to have that as well, I have known top doctors with red hair and piercing and tattoos would you not let them treat you because they don't look right i think not! i don't want any sympathy that is a rude thing to say i have just had a text from my older daughter who's best friend has just been told that there is no more they can do for her at 23 should i not try and be hopeful that there is something should i not be there for my daughter should her place of work not be understanding as this young girl has been part of our family from a child i think most of you think you are all right in your views should i not be give the courtesy to feel the same about mine, As long as my daughter is getting her grades is arriving at lessons not disturbing classes and having homework and all her essays in on time then the other petty little things you all need to complain about in life are unimportant don't you think, One of you stated when i was a child i had to do it!! that is a statement most older adults live by or your talking to me in a aggressive manner when in fact that isn't the case the case is you don't like my views so i will pull that card. You all need to realise not all mothers can be treated with no respect and talked down to just by reading most these comments its clear you think your are more important and your views are more important as well. I will continue to support my children on there journey through life in school jobs and when ever they need me and if you as teachers and parents think that is wrong then i feel sorry for each and every one of you, because my daughter is a manager of saga and she was told at school she would be nothing! and my youngest will go on to be a teacher in france and it won't be because she couldn't drink a drink and it won't be because her hair wasn't right and it won't be because she didnt agree with everything a teacher said it will be because she has worked hard and studied well and got taught a lot of what she needed out of school because that couldn't provide for her in it!! maybe she needs to be naughty and disruptive and then she can be treated to days out and bowling and cinemas and Mcdonalds because thats what most school feel the need to do is it a importance thing for you all that the more naughty a child is the better they get treated maybe that needs to be looked into but of course not silly me a naughty child is one you can all control with treats maybe thats another issue you could deal with!!

I am not a teacher, I skimmed through your OP and realised that your DD has a medical problem similar to one I struggled with for years before realising the GP could help.

And it is not the fault of commentators here that your DD didn't choose a sixth form capable of meeting her needs, or is stretching herself to breaking point. Neither of these is a good idea.

Finally the children who are given the "treats" are rarely those who succeed in later life, your daughter doing well at school and managing her workload well will give its own rewards.

I'm not getting the impression that most on here are teachers, Zafira, so why the rant?

She's missed some time at school. It happens. DS has had spells of lousy attendance for health reasons, and it's hard to catch up. Not sure why you are angry with the school about that, though, or about the drinks?

it is probably a sensible rule brought about by the need to keep keyboards crumb-free and avoid spilling things on electronic equipment
How true

or even 'very' carefully

You asked our opinion. You specifically asked for the opinion of teachers. You got it. Schools need people to obey the rules. As do workplaces. I obey the rules of my work place and no longer have the nose stud and purple hair I had as a university student.
Are you seriously suggesting that you will go and complain to your children's bosses about the rules of their workplace!
I'm sorry to hear about your other daughter's friend, but in the nicest possible way, that has nothing to do with your daughter not arriving in school on time.
If your daughter hopes to teach in a 'state' school in France, I wish her all the luck in the world. It is exceptionally difficult to pass the entrance examination for teaching there.
As for us ganging up on you because we're all teachers. Rubbish. We teach in very different establishments with different attitudes to a variety of things. I often have differing opinions to teachers on here. Many would not approve of the type of school I teach in.
May I ask why your daughter attends a school that cannot offer a subject she wants to study (I would have thought the majority of schools offer French at A Level), colleges tend to be able to offer a wider variety of courses, why did she not choose to go to a college?

Wow. Now that you've had your rant, I hope you re-read some of the advice that people have kindly offered you, and perhaps take some of it.