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Original poster

taking children out of school for holidays is ILLEGAL

588 replies

zippitippitoes · 08/03/2006 10:03

interesting news report here \link{http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,2-2075270,00.html\ High Court Ruling}

so will anybody still be taking those unauthorised breaks and days off?

Will schools get tougher

and does your school say no at the moment?

OP posts:

FrannyandZooey · 09/03/2006 11:40

So those of you who think people should either put up with it or go elsewhere, what would you do if there were policies or laws made in this country or in your local area that you vigorously disagreed with? Put up with it? Complain and agitate in the hope that something was done? Or leave the country? Bit drastic, isn't it? Are you very opposed to negotiation and debate in all areas of life or just education?

harpsichordcarrier · 09/03/2006 11:41

[quite so enid, and they can feel free to moan about it and try and lobby for change. I certainly wouldn't suggesat that they should put up with it or leave the school.
I don't think any leader is infalllible and leadership should always be open to challenge and debate in a democracy

Enid · 09/03/2006 11:41

it works both ways

complaints and parent power made the holiday think illegal in the first place

harpsichordcarrier · 09/03/2006 11:42

[hi franny could you take over I have to do the school run ]

Enid · 09/03/2006 11:42

thing not think

FrannyandZooey · 09/03/2006 11:42

soapbox · 09/03/2006 11:42

Well you can decide whether you dislike it enough to move schools or not!

What is not appropriate is for the school to adopt different policies for different people, or to adopt policies that only the minority of parents want!

By its very nature, in catering for large numbers of people, a school will not be able to cater to everyone's specific needs. Your role as a parent is to decide whether overall it does or doesn;t!

Frankly, if people base their choice of school, or to home educate on whether they can get cheap holidays or not, I think they are barking mad! There are far more important aspects of schooling I would wish to decide on than that! However that is just my view:)

harpsichordcarrier · 09/03/2006 11:43

is that right enid? parent pressure? I rather thought it was in response to the publication of stats for absences in the league tables

soapbox · 09/03/2006 11:44

No F&Z - you can complain and agitate all you like - but as long as you are there you should abide by the rules!

Really all this judgement has done is enshrined in law that the school has the right to enforce its policy on holidays in term time, whatever that might be, and that parents who do not conform with these policies can be prosecuted!

FrannyandZooey · 09/03/2006 11:45

I think it is worrying how many people adapt an attitude of unthinking obedience where schools are concerned. Schools and teachers are there for our benefit, they are not above criticism, we have a say in how they should be run, and we have a duty, never mind a right, to speak out if we think they are getting it wrong.

Bugsy2 · 09/03/2006 11:46

In certain areas of my life I am very non-conformist & I actively campaign for things that I think are wrong or dislike. I will write to my MP, local council, Secretary of State. Get petitions signed against mobile phone masts close to schools.
If I was worried about my school's attitude to bullying I would go to PTA meetings, talk to the head, get a petition from other parents if necessary.
But on the issue of taking children out of school for holidays, I think that the ruling sent out the right message to parents & LEAs and headteachers.
So, just because we don't agree on this issue HC, doesn't make me some conforming toady who blandly plods along accepting all the rules without question!!!

harpsichordcarrier · 09/03/2006 11:46

soapbox it isn't about cheap hols. it is something more fundamental than that
[I just lurked on that thread frannyf but don't have time for all I have to say

Kelly1978 · 09/03/2006 11:47

I don't understand this at all. People talk about the benefits of holiday, great - so do that in holiday time! I consider education far to valuable to take them on holiday in term time. It's all very well moaning about the costs and lack of holiday time - but that's why u arrange it well in advance!

harpsichordcarrier · 09/03/2006 11:47

I am sure you are a non conformist bugsy about issues you agree with
just because you don't agree in this case doesn't make you a brave warrior and someone else an irresponsible law breaker
btw this is entirely hypothetical or me. am not an evil law breaker
well not on this issue.

FrannyandZooey · 09/03/2006 11:48

{manfully struggles against overpowering desire to mention Nazi Germany in relation to Soapbox's belief that rules should always be followed....]

Phew, I think I got away with it.

prettybird · 09/03/2006 11:49

Interestingly - last night at ds' school board meeting (which I am on), we were asked to comment on the proposed holidays for 07/08 and 08/09. The head teacher said that the number of holidays in the summer term made things really awkward for the teachers: back from the Spring Break mid APril, long weekend at the beginning of May, extra long weekend at the end of May, finish at the end of June. Makes it very difficult for them to get into anything.

We suggested instead that they should can the extra long weekend at the end of Amy and instead add it to the mid term break in February, so that the kids got a full week then.

I did declare my own interest in this (as I iwill continue to take ds out of school at this time to make it up to a week) - but it was actaully agreed as a good thing for everyone - school and parents, especially at a dreich and dismal time of year.

It'll not change anything anyway - the City Council will inevitably not change the holiday as it would be deemed to be unacceptable with it being the Queen's Birthday Bank Holiday weekend: so much for "consultation" and doign waht the school and parents think best.

soapbox · 09/03/2006 11:50

Of course you are right F&Z, lobby away! But until the policy of the school has been changed (if you are lucky) then I believe it is important to stick to the rules as they are set out!

It is no different to many aspects of life! I can't book an appointment for my knee operation that fits in with my timetable - I get it when the NHS decides it will do it.

At work, which your darlings will all have to cope with one day, you don't just barge in and say when you are turning up, when you aren;t or when you will get something done! You abide by the policies set by the employer or out you go!

Life is ruthless in many ways - and learning to live with that is important for our children to grasp!

harpsichordcarrier · 09/03/2006 11:50

today's pop question: which is more objectionable:
"one should always follow all rules."
OR
"one should always follow all the rules I agree with, but not those I don't agree with."
discuss

beatie · 09/03/2006 11:51

I don't think being opposed to unneccesary term-time absences means someone is a sheep who doesn't question the performance of the teachers and 'educational' policies of the school.

But allowing your child to not turn up at school and do something more fun instead puts two fingers up to the school from the offset and IMO shows lack of support and respect for the school.

Urgh - not very eloquently out but one hqanded typing with baby on knee :)

Enid · 09/03/2006 11:51

yeah! What beatie just said.

soapbox · 09/03/2006 11:53

Well Harpsi - what is it about?

I think this thread comes right back to the core of much of societies ills!

Everyone banging on about their rights without due regard to their obligations and responsibilties to communities and society as a whole!

soapbox · 09/03/2006 11:53

F&Z - really beneath contempt!

harpsichordcarrier · 09/03/2006 11:53

Enid you are such a camp follower
if my "darlings" (wtf???) ask me - do you always follow all the rules mummy
I will say no, I don't.
life is complicated.
you have your principles and you stick with them
you listen to your conscience and do what you think is right.
sometimes my employer asked me to do things that I didn't agree with.
I didn't do them.

GDG · 09/03/2006 11:55

harpsichordcarrier · 09/03/2006 11:55

I have never mentioned my rights, iirc.
I think it is up for debate, that's all. and to say - these are the rules, put up or ship out is an intellectually and morally barren non argument. imho

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