British children are Not the most heavily tested in Europe

[Ouluckyduck]

Where does this myth come from? I have read it so many times on here and other forums. I come from Germany and there children are tested far more often than here, and given grades. They are, however, teacher-assessed. Anybody have any info from other countries to compare?

Will be interested to see the responses but my feeling his this is incorrect too.

It's not an area I know much about but feel that similar is true in France for example?

Some other European countries seem to be quite 'traditional', spelling tests, grammar assessed etc. Polish friends tell me that they were often tested at school, spellings etc, but not sure if this still happens now?

How does Finland, Denmark, Norway etc assess? Do they have a similar system to us? Are there exams at 11? Continuous assessment etc?

I did all my education in Spain, and we had exams at the end of every term and reports went sent home at the end of every term too. The exams were set and marked by the teachers. I know this is the situation still now. My sister is a primary school teacher, she teaches English, and her pupils have exams at the end of every term. Is so normal in Spain to have exams, that the kids have no problems of stress or any thing like in the UK.
As the exams are set by the teachers, there is no way you can do practice exams. You have to study all the contents of your subject, as the form of the exam might change every time.

I thought it referred to "external" assessment so not tests/exams set and marked by teachers. Now that year 9 SATs have gone and year 2 SATs are based on teacher assessment there is much less testing than when the statement was originally made.

DC state primary school does 2 or 3 assessments "week"s each year, those are basically graded into NC levels but we don't always get told what the results are. And take up most of a single week each term, the children quietly doing paper-based exams without support.

Some of those exam periods coincide with statuatory test periods (ie, end of KS1 + KS2 SATs).
They also get weekly spelling tests (10 minute type jobs) from y2 or 3.
Other little tests + competitions on an ad hoc basis, one or 2 a month I guess, as well as times-table challenge (jweekly intra-class maths competition done orally, made it into an all-the-school competition last term).

How does that compare to Germany, elsewhere? Do the Germans attach as much paperwork to each child's records as the Brits manage to?

DC school has very average results, btw.

France. My DD is in the equivalent of Y3. She has a test every single day of the week and end-of-term exams (across the whole year group - not assessed by her own teacher) three times a year.

Gosh, Bonsoir. What sort of tests each day? Do you feel any pressure to make sure she learns for the test or does she study independently? Is she used to it and do you think the system works?

A dictation, set of sums or a grammar exercise (DD is 7). And yes, the onus is on parents to revise with their children and, especially, to review with them any mistakes made during the week and to ensure that gaps in their learning are filled in (school can be counted on not to do this).

Do you think it's effective? It sounds like UK education in pre-war days (which some think worked well in ensuring high standards of spelling, maths, grammar etc).

Cortina, my younger son is in a bilingual French school which principally follows the French curriculum (is under the auspices of and continues into the Lycée) and my elder in an English. The homework level at my younger son's school is triple that of my elder son (who is at a pushy private school and will be going to one of the very top selective preps next year), and the level of the children at the French school are not at the same level as the top academic prep which my elder son will be joining.

argh - pressed post message too soon. I think that the French method is good for hammering in the basics (basic literacy and basic arithmetic), but definitely leaves NO room for individual thought or creativity. Even in terms of maths, arithmetic is important, but the capability for the children in my younger son's French school to quickly solve word problems is definite the weak point (compared to the English system).

I'm not sure that is what's meant tbh
For example my kids do spelling tests every week, do regular mini reading comps etc, all normal everyday tests
But sats are more particular to england/wales I thought?
Or do other european countries do national exams aged 7, 11, 14, which are used to assess teachers, schools and pupils? Plus end of school exams at 16 as well as 18?

Do agree tho that it has improved a lot over last few years - hope it keeps on getting more informal, in the sense that the school results are not plastered all over national papers, admittedly without individual names of pupils

Do other countries send the head to the houses of 7 and 11 year olds to bring them in to school to do their end of term exams, for instance, as happens at our school if you phone in sick on sats day

No pressure or anything!

When I went to school in Sweden we had tests all the time, but they were teacher administered and teacher assessed, so we didn't have to go through that whole experience of all the staff being stressed out over the tests; it was all very low key. And as mercibucket says that kind of low key testing goes on in British schools too; but that's not the testing people are talking about.

merci, I can top your story: when my dd was in Yr 6 she was ill in bed, unable to even sit up or hold a pen because she was in too much pain- they sent a TA round who took her SATS down to dictation. I hardly felt that was in dd's best interests.

Poor dd, cory

DS(10) goes to a state primary in France and has tests few times a week- not sure if every day as Bonsoir's DD...hmm, maybe yes. Then they have 'controls' on every subject three times a year. Homework- not really a lot, maybe a few math problems to solve plus some reading (French or history etc) that doesn't take longer than 15 minutes tbh every day plus bigger projects few times a year.

They have brevet at 14 and bac at 18/19 iirc.

I grew up in Poland and we had loads of tests all the time, in primary and secondary, that were set up and marked by a teacher and homework was marked as well-if you didn't have it, you got an F and that went on your record so then you would get lower mark at the end of term/year. Now I hear that the schools are getting a bit dumbed down, so not sure how hard/strict they are. I left school at 16 and then went on to pass GED and SATs in the States and I didn't have to prepare for them at all and got v.good grades so I guess the overall level of teaching in Polish schools was good (although tbh American SATs were sooo easy ).

Agree with no place for creativity in French schools.

Oh, and to get to secondary school (at 14) in Poland you had to pass exams set by the school you were hoping to go to. Good schools would have v.tough exams and say, 10 candidates for each place, so it was pretty stressful, especially as you only got one chance.

Now the secondary starts at 11 and I think exams are set by the Ministry of Eduction so are uniform for all schools.

Cortina - no, I don't think that it is effective. Testing is not teaching. My personal feeling is that the national savoir-faire in teaching is pretty abysmal in France - hence the large volumes of homework but lower attainment levels that Mominatrix identifies in her posts.

There are national tests (like SATS) at the end of Y3 equivalent and Y6 equivalent in France, and the DCs are re-tested (national standardised tests) at the beginning of Y7 equivalent in their new secondary schools to see where they stand in maths and French. Then there is the pointless brevet at the end of Y10 and bac exams at the end of Y12 and Y13.

doesn't testing in class take away a lot of potential teaching time - and is it worth it (because it forces dc to constantly revise material they would otherwise forget)?

ZZZen - yes, testing eats into teaching time. I do not think it is an efficient way of learning at all!

In India, there are exams at the end of each term, and weekly "pop quizzes" which will mostly be short and sharp stuff, like spelling or multiple choice answers, never essay-type questions.

However, all these are marked by the class teacher, and the students are given grades, not marks.

National exams are at the end of year 10 (15 year old) and year 12 (17 year old). The grades are used to judge the students (not the teacher/school) and as a basis for entry to University.

My god daughter is regularly tested on everything and marked out of 20. And I mean everything- including games. And if she doesn't keep an average of ( I think) 14, she will be kept back a year. This is in Paris.

As I said on another thread, her visits give me a regular reality check about children's stress, rating and homework!

In India do they still expect Y6 aged children to have read most of the children's classics? We often had students from ordinary schools in India arriving at our school and for some reason their literacy was astonishingly good. Could just be my experience of course.

Cortina in my days, yes we were expected to have read classics by Y7. However, things have gone downhill since.

In the mid-90s, the then Government, in all its wisdom, decided that we ought to not learn anything that came from the British and thus acknowledge their colonial influence. It was the silliest thing ever. Street names were changed, airports were renamed. That was borderline reasonable. But then they went and removed most Western authors and poets from the syllabus. Whilst I agree that Indian authors should be studied, it seems perverse to stop children from reading Shakespeare or Byron!

However, several private schools have cropped up in the metropolitan cities and they seem to have a better balance i.e. they read a good selection of authors from the sub-continent and from the West.

Interesting, NanAstley, thanks.

A knowledge of Latin plus all the children's under her belt aged 11 meant my good friend from India could whip my arse in English comprehension! She's now a top journalist. I thought it was wonderful that her school assumed all could absorb the children's classics by the time they were 11 years old - it would be unthinkable in the UK now. It gave her such a head start and a lifelong love of literature.