Can I ask for help?

[littlelegsmum]

Dd 10 has just received her mock sats results and doesn't seem to have made much progress since y2. The results are:

Y2. Y6.

2c. 3c. Maths
2c. 3b. Reading
2c. 3a. Writing

The school seem more than happy but we feel like we're being fobbed off as the only subjects they're teaching is Maths and English - so its all about sats and getting a better score for the school.

Am I able to ask for help for her or should I just accept the school saying she's ok?

If school keep lying to you and reassuring you, how are you meant to know she's behind?

Most people trust school. You're meant to.

You're not a bad mum. It's not your fault.

But - now you do know / suspect there's a problem you have to do something about it.

The only reason I know you can't trust school is because I made the same mistake you did. I trusted school.

IndigoBellWed 04-Apr-12 16:13:43

Blaming schools and trying to unpick who lied to you first isn't going to help your DD.

It's fairly easy to work out what level your DD is at in reading and maths, as you can buy practice SATs papers and get her to do a test. (Writing is far harder to evaluate)

But - you know she's behind. What you can't decide is what to do about it.

What you need to do is make a plan as to how you are going to help her.

I can't even contact PPS as they're on Easter Holidays too!! :(

DH & I need to sit down, write out lots of lists and work out if she has any underlying conditions - which her school have insisted she doesn't. However, i'm presuming the full assessment will tell us all this.

mrzWed 04-Apr-12 16:15:35

It's very interesting that she has made 2 sub levels progress per year at her previous school

Does this indicate anything to you ? Sorry, if thats an obvious question :O

LeeCoakleyWed 04-Apr-12 16:51:30

You are not a bad mum!

Thank you - I guess I just feel like i've got to fight harder now as i've let things slip for too long.

IndigoBellWed 04-Apr-12 17:00:51

If school keep lying to you and reassuring you, how are you meant to know she's behind?

Most people trust school. You're meant to.

You're not a bad mum. It's not your fault.

But - now you do know / suspect there's a problem you have to do something about it.

The only reason I know you can't trust school is because I made the same mistake you did. I trusted school.

We need to decide where to contact first now ;)

I have now learnt that I need to questions more and not to just accept the answers given to me - if anything, it's made me more strong and to fight for what I think my kids need.

It's expected that a child makes 2 sub levels progress per year in KS2 ...unfortunately children rarely make nice even progress and it's more realistic to spurts one year and less the next type pattern. I'm suspicious of neatness ... I'm less cynical than Indigo because I believe most schools do a good job

Based on that it seems she has progressed. Yet why is she still only on 3b, c & a - oh I'm all confused again lol

I agree with mrz to a degree...kids rarely make even progress...ds1 certainly hasnt!!!

He is only now really making progress in KS2 and has been at this school for nearly 18 months.

I am assuming from what you have said that your dd isnt on SA and hasnt got an IEP? If she is on SA then you need a meeting with school and to decide what inteventions to implement to help her.

There is lots out there that can help x

Mrz - I wish I wasn't cynical about schools.

I wish my experiences were one offs and unusual.

I wish I could trust schools.

I really, really do. Im not a naturally cynical person. And I hate the fact I can't trust school.

I think almost all teachers try really hard. And they all do their best.

But trying hard and doing your best doesn't necessarily mean your best is good enough.

Hi becaroooo

She isn't on anything but I really don't know who can help her in school :(

It does seem like we're going to have to get her the help and support she needs. Which we really don't mind :)

I'm also afraid to say that I wish it was a one off. However there have been some incidents previously which makes me wonder why our kids are just a ££££ rather than a person.

I remember the senco at previous school, at parents evening telling me that dd would never do particularly well but she may get by :( I was so 'scared' to tackle her and didn't want to cause any problems for dd in school.

I've since realised that they only think about the kids that stand out with behaviour etc and it's up to me to take on their duty of care.

littlelegsmum I agree with the others that you are supposed to trust that the school can do its job and educate your child, but tbh most of us, erm, don't [sadly] Just wondering, are you able to say (vaguely or via pm) what area you are in? there's all sorts out there, but also sadly it's fairly regionally biased afaik. Ironically, in my job I do pretty much the things we're describing - IEP interventions and specialist assessment, and gently persuade parents to do more of it at home, which only a few of them do. It's sad that your child doesn't have access to this sort of stuff, as it's simply the guidance and a few pointers that you need :)

So, she saw the senco at the previous school? That may indicate she was on SA at that school IMO. What the senco said to you was dreadful, but sadly I have basically had the same said to me wrt ds1 by his (NQ) Y3 teacher last year How odd then that he has gone up a whole sub level in every area since leaving her class!!!!

There are several things you could try re: literacy and numeracy at home...and beleive me, I have tried 'em all and I would recommend;

Literacy: (workbooks)
Dancing bears - sound foundations
Apples and Pears - sound foundations

Numeracy: (online)
Mathletics
Education City

I wouldnt get a tutor - you dont need any special training to do any of the above and she may be happier doing it with you. However, if she has on older cousin/friend/babysitter that she really likes you could pay that person to do it with her for half an hour per day?

Ds1 made really good progress after only 2 weeks on apples and pears and he is dyslexic.

Dont rely on the school. They wont/cant help her. You can.

Good luck
x

Thank you MrsShrek - I have pm'd you my area. Any pointers so we can help DD would be very appreciated :)

Hi again Becaroooo - Sorry, I should of made it clear, the senco taught her in year 3

It does sound promising that your DS moved up that level and those websites seem to be helping :)

I think i'll get on there today, while DC are out with their Grandad, and put them into a 'favourites' folder for her.

Thank you x

Hi again - will pm back when I get on computer rather than phone! Becaroooo has hit most of the "pointers" stuff in the last post (nice one) - Mathletics, education city, and an absolutely awesome resource esp if you suspect dyslexia or similar, is Nessy. You can get the "bits" separately - I just got the games for my ds1, who is (very) dyslexic, around £17-£18 iirc,(loads cheaper than a tutor!) and also Nessy fingers which is a touch typing tutor programme. Although Nessy is promoted for dyslexic children as it's multisensory, it's fantastic for all children and really accelerates progress

These levels are very similar to my yr6 DS. He supposedly made the required progress in ks1 (level 2) however he has struggled since starting ks2, with the situation becoming worse year on year. I withdrew him from his state school at xmas and moved him to a small indie. He is
currently assessed at level 3's.

I took him to an ed psyc at the end of year 5 where he was found to be dyslexic, his biggest difficulties being his working memory ( e.g he is quite good at maths but forgets what he has learnt very quickly so needs 3/4 times more reinforcement than the average child before it sticks in his brain). His visual proccessing is very poor e.g he needs longer to read and write things from the board and longer to digest information. He also has fine motor skill difficulty. I also took him for an eye test and discovered he needed glasses (schools no longer do eye tests)

Knowing what I know now I can see how easily he dropped behind, if the teachers had had this information he could have been supported better from an earlier age. Sadly ime schools are not good at recognising undiagnosed SEN.

My advice if you can possibly afford it is to get your DD an ed psyc assessment (approx £400) or at the least a dyslexia assessment (approx £200) before she goes to high school. If this is not possible get in touch with the high school senco and make sure they understand your concerns and they may be able to organise assessments when she starts. I'm sure your local Parent Partnership can advise too.

I wish you well getting support for your DD. My DS is making much better progress now he is appropriatly supported which in turn is giving him confidence in his abilities and the quality of his work has improved. Get the right help now and there is light at the end of the tunnel.

Hi MF ;)

We have booked her an appointment for July with a private Educational Psychologist in the hope it will give us an idea on what to tell the High school and see if there are things they need to put in place etc. He has promised to phone me if he gets a (very rare) cancelled appointment :O So i'll keep my fingers crossed.

We've also booked for a private Speech & Language Therapist assessment. Again, for the same reasons as well as hopefully getting her some therapy on how to communicate a little more than 'robotics'

Glad to hear you are making progress and fingers crossed for a quick appt. Hopefully once you have a clearer picture of difficulties things will improve for your DD. I have been told by a few people that secondarys can be better at supporting additional needs than primaries. Let's both hope this is the case.

I'm worried about the whole high school thing. From the area you're in, if she's going to the main recently merged HS for the area, the provision is a big concern. I am currently away from home so only on phone app... but you'll see I'm not far from you thus trying to speak in sort of code til I can pm you back. Is there a particular reason for not getting one of the lea EPs?

TheMF - Oh, I really hope so as i''ve got alot of my hopes on them :)

MrsShrek - I have that exact worry. We just don't know how she'll cope. It's awful really isn't it. It does sound like thats the one she was offered from the local Council. However, DH & I are just not 'convinced' with it, and we've been advised that another High School have a place for her (One of the 2 that's over the big roundabout, near the motorway and further down on left). We've called the school and are awaiting a call back to go with DD and view/ask questions/meet the appropriate people.

Well, her junior school wouldn't refer her as there was more 'needy children' However, I contacted LEA myself in the holidays and they are coming out to see me on Wednesday. So i'm hoping they'll have some more advice for me :)

Byrch bla bla is better Fingers crossed you're seeing someone who will get stuff done From own experience there are some fantastic people on CWDT, LD team and transitions support. Just that the high sch they're going to needs to have the resources and motivation to put it all into practice. And unluckily at one particular school you haven't got a hope

How's the work at home going? Had a chance yet?

It is normal to regress on changing schools

I don't get this bit: "As it's a school that doesn't perfom too well anyway they are going all out to get the best scores so we haven't had a parents evening :O"

Surely a school that isn't doing very well should be doing everything it can to engage parents in a two-way partnership that will help the children achieve the best scores they can. Or at least, that's the strategy my children's school is following, to fight against a culture of unachievement in much of the catchment area. We have three reports per year, each followed by a parents evening. The children are monitored to within an inch of their lives to make sure they are making steady progress.

Even if they aren't offering a parents evening, I think you have every grounds to request an appointment to discuss those results and find out how they propose to make sure your child gets whatever help they need.

Thank for the replies.

Well, yes, I agree it makes no sense at all. They have literally stopped doing anything that isn't being covered by SATS and in the latest newsletter from school, it clearly states this!! :O| - I'm not sure why they won't have time as every other school in the area seems to have them still.

I get the impression that they are not used to parents being as pushy as i've been and the few times i've spoke/or been in and spoke to them, I simply get "compared to the children in her class" rather than "compared to an average 10/11 year old" therefore not getting anywhere.

I am not leaving at that and thanks to all the adice i've recently had from the lovely people of MN, I am going to school armed with questions for them (which I know they'll hate)!

They don't feel she needs anymore help or stands out to her peers. Therefore, DD will not get any help (other than from us now) :(

maybe it's time to suss out the National Averages and be prepared to use them as a stick to beat the school with... the school is clearly underachieving all round. But as all the schools in the area are working in the same catchment, but not all suffering from the same difficulties, your dd's school need to put their standards and expectations up. I'm astounded that the levels you quoted are accepted as 'average' and obviously most of the class are on similar.