'new' grammar schools in kent...

[oliverreed]

well, not technically. The local authority have been given the go-ahead for two (I think) annexe grammar schools in Sevenoaks. Gove is surely rubbing his hands with glee. I agree with the decision as pressure on places in this area is causing a lot of heartache for many families whose children are travelling a long way, but is it paving the way for the creation of new grammar schools.
Would be interested to hear your thoughts?

I should imagine your DC would be livid in later years as in 'you sent me to a secondary modern when I could have passed? Why?

gladders
why should a supporter of comps be hassled into attending a sec mod

My father in the early 50s failed his 11+. Went to secondary modern where for 2 years his masters asked him what the hell he was doing there. Retook at 13 and passed, but always felt like an outsider as hadn't passed at 11 like the others. Of course well-funded state schools with a decent top ability curriculum are the ideal. DH's cousin's children have been discouraged from doing MFL at GCSE by their technology college (incidentally a former grammar). Massive local reputation with very creditable GCSE score in those league tables, but EB score of 6%.

I send mine to a comprehensive-all abilities are there.I am not going to send them to a secondary modern. If you send to a secondary modern you are supporting the grammar school system. It is just that people always say 'bring back grammar schools', they never say 'bring back secondary moderns' which is what it means. They have the weird idea that their own DC would be in the grammar school-which very often doesn't happen.

Reallytired I went to the idealised comp you describe and had a fab education but I was in the grammar stream. The problem with it was the education of the kids in the middle and bottom streams weren't so great with lots of low level classroom disruption. I actually think educating the clever is fairly straightforward but how best to educate the academically less able is much more difficult. However they need to be part of a productive society as much as the former. Nulabor tried to make everyone go down the academic route: gcses, a levels, university and it wasn't right for a lot of people. Not sure what the answer is though

The Sevenoaks annexe case is valid and well supported as there is a black hole in this part of Kent.

The grammar school system exists in the county, and this area isn't effectively serviced by it.

Interestingly, I agree with the parents in Sevenoaks
by the anomalies of the system all their kids are driven miles to the nearest GS
so just on carbon footprint grounds this is a good thing
BUT
(just punting an idea here)
should EVERY grammar be forced to "federate" with a non grammar and provide opportunities to switch between the two, train across the two and generally give full spread education, with the bright kids not distracted and the thick kids not looked down on.

Can someone explain to me why they got rid of Grammar schools in the first place?
Why are they seen as bad or unfair?

I utterly agree with you TalkinPeace.

Because they label 77% of children as failures based on an arbitrary test taken on one day when they are 10.

I live in this part of Kent, and without getting into the right and wrongs of the grammar-comprehensive argument, Kent has a grammar school system currently. There were several children at our local primary school this year who passed the 11+ but could not be offered a grammar school place.

The grammar school option is a good one in view of the alternative - which was a Christian 'free school' who, from their own literature, quite obviously wanted to teach creationism. Far better to create a new annexe grammar school. But I would like to see a bit more money put into the other non-selective Kent schools as well.

seeker
what do you think yo my random friday night idea?

talkinpeace2 interesting idea and certainly one that many independent schools are having to adopt to maintain their charitable status (but mostly token gestures I think re; sharing sports facilities!). Another option for Sevenoaks may have been for the grammars to support the Sevenoaks state school (think its called Knowle acadamy). Don't think the parents wanted that though.

i think most employers recognise now that some kids went to grammar schools and were educated to pass certain professional exams

think it's kind of sad myself that so many middle class parents pick the career for their children , that maps the career they or their husbands took

make for a bland society imo and one that isn't open to the rest of the world

duchesse - not sure if they will be ready by then. I think the land that one of the old comprehensives was on needs to be sold to fund the new buildings, and although staffing I understand should come from the "mother grammar" they would obv not have enough staff so recruitment etc would need to happen too.

I think if it's an outdated concept in the majority of schools in the UK then why can't it be nationalised?

why does kent, Devon , London & buckinghamshire have to endure the grammar sytem, the 11+ when the rest of the uk doesn't?

I would have equally supported a 'grammar stream' in the current non-selective Academy in Sevenoaks, but this particular school is still reeling from the effects of a merger between boys and girls schools - so not ideal to introduce more change now.

Sometimes, pragmatics have to overtake ideology.

But what about the 23% who pass?
Surely it's not fair that they should be held back ?

i really think the majority of mumsnetters totally forget their own school lives

There is only one grammar school in Devon! Torbay is a separate authority and has a few more, but those schools are not all that accessible to children from the rest of Devon.

peace- an excellent idea- what shall we call the new schools? How about- and this is just a random thought- "comprehensive"?

meant 'academy'!

yy Wildernesse and Bradbourne merged and Knole Academy created - 1 - 2 years ago?

Too soon for any other big changes

If you really want to get rid of the inequality in education you need to get rid of the Independent Schools. Can't see that happening somehow

another thought - wonder if they will be able to create these satellite schools in out of borough areas or will they be confined to the same local authority?