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Original poster

Teachers, how are things as regards cuts?

266 replies

fivecandles · 28/05/2011 10:10

If you teach, how are you being affected by the cuts? Have there been any reduncies at your school and if so on what basis? It's starting to hit my place of work now and it's rubbish. No redundancies yet but it's generally expected to happen at the end of next year unless people leave which they can't because there are no jobs anywhere else either.

OP posts:
MmeBlueberry · 29/05/2011 18:14

Schools follow business models. I don't know why you think they are exempt from being part of the real world.

This means that they have cycles of growth and cutting back, just like any big or small profit-making business.

Original poster
fivecandles · 29/05/2011 18:15

OK, if you accept that redundancies are devastating and bemoan the lack of empathy, it is odd that you are defending Blueberry who in fact is urging us to see reduncies as an opportunity in disguise!

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Original poster
fivecandles · 29/05/2011 18:17

No, not like any profit-making business. They do not make profits. Educating children is not like churning out cars. Please don't be so crass and glib.

At least Jabed has some empathy and experience of reduncies. If you're just here to gloat then please GO AWAY.

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jabed · 29/05/2011 18:17

With respect jabed I would rather funds were spent employing staff to teach or support the children than pay for an organist or chaplain who presumably could be found in the local community free?

With respect mrz, we have both in my school. We do not rob Peter to pay Paul in any way. Nor do we have to decide which to pay. The Chaplain (s) also has a teaching role and is invaluable in patoral support. The organists as I said do recitals and we have a large music dept ( just about won everything going in choirs and music festivals I think) .

We may organise things differently to you.

MmeBlueberry · 29/05/2011 18:20

Who said that there were no cuts in the independent sector? Cash flow is a perennial worry for independent schools and running a tight ship is vital. Because support staff is kept to a minimum, it is often teaching jobs that are most at risk, mostly by cutting hours of part-time staff and not replacing teachers who leave. Very few schools can afford to absorb the cost of under-utilised staff.

Original poster
fivecandles · 29/05/2011 18:22

'Because support staff is kept to a minimum'

In YOUR school. I have already said my dcs' school employ plenty of TAs. When are you going to stop making sweeping generalisations based on your personal experience? And nobody did say that there weren't cuts in the independent sector. What was said is since you have nothing relevant or pleasant to add to this thread since the cuts are not affecting you why are you here?

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MmeBlueberry · 29/05/2011 18:23

Stop telling people to go away, 5. You start a thread on a public forum and you don't have the right to say who can post. If you don't like my opinions, just ignore them. That's not such a hard thing to do.

Original poster
fivecandles · 29/05/2011 18:25

Does it not bother you that you've driven people away who wanted to respond to the OP? Does it not bother you that people who are suffering from the cuts have been angered and upset by your insensitivity?

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jabed · 29/05/2011 18:27

OK, if you accept that redundancies are devastating and bemoan the lack of empathy, it is odd that you are defending Blueberry who in fact is urging us to see reduncies as an opportunity in disguise

I have every sympathy and empathy but it is also possible as mmeblueberry says that it can be an opportunity . Lokk at my own case. I was on the at risk list being made redundant and I applied for the job I now have. I work in a fantastic school and with fantastic colleagues. It was an opportunity but one I would not have considered had it not been for needing to find another post.

I do not under estimate how gutted someone feels at being made redundant or even at being told they are at risk. It is depressing and de moralising and divisive on staff in schools. I was absolutely gutted. I know colleagues who were forced to retire who still havent got over it. I know only too well what it is like but that doesnt change the facts and economics behind it. To recognise the one is not to deny the other.

MmeBlueberry · 29/05/2011 18:27

Maybe you have driven them away with your anger and close-mindedness.

Me, I'm a dog with a bone when told to shut up.

Original poster
fivecandles · 29/05/2011 18:31

I'm glad it worked out for you, Jabed, but you must realize it's extremely naive at best to assume that this will be the case for the vast majority of people being made redundant right now. TAs are often women who have families and need to work flexibly around their own children. They are not often hugely qualified or experienced but work hard and do a valuable job for poor pay. Even for teachers it's really hard to get jobs now and it will be decades before the damage is put right.

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Original poster
fivecandles · 29/05/2011 18:33

'Maybe you have driven them away with your anger and close-mindedness.'

There's plenty of evidence to say that's not the case MmeBlue. Seriously, it's worth thinking about. What are you getting out of this? You have no relevant points to make to the OP and you've been upsetting people all the way through. It's a pretty sad way to get your kicks.

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jabed · 29/05/2011 18:33

It is true that many independent schools have tightened their belts and are running tight ships at the moment. As Independent school the effects can be quite different in each school. As I said, I came into my current school just as the recession hit. The management took the responsible ( if somewhat controversial ) action at the time of trimming and tightening in anticipation of possible roll falls and budget losses. That was a good move although it did cost some teaching jobs in some depts. Fortunately it did not affect me this time ( that is not meant to sound glib, but the relief for me was considerable, having come from one redundancy situation to find myself in another 12 months later.)

MmeBlueberry · 29/05/2011 18:36

I have plenty of relevant points. They just happen to not match your opinions.

It is a pity that you cannot see value in someone else's viewpoint, yet disagree.

Perhaps it is my turn to ask you if you are really a teacher. Touché!

Original poster
fivecandles · 29/05/2011 18:37

Sorry, but I've not noticed any relevant points. My question was have you been affected by cuts? A simple 'no' would have sufficed, Blue.

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MmeBlueberry · 29/05/2011 18:40

Are you really a teacher?

jabed · 29/05/2011 18:41

*I have plenty of relevant points. They just happen to not match your opinions.

It is a pity that you cannot see value in someone else's viewpoint, yet disagree.

Perhaps it is my turn to ask you if you are really a teacher. Touché!*

Too late. I asked that myself sometime ago ( another thread).

I may be blind, no doubt someone will say I am blind, but I do not see nor have I seen anything anywhere that says people have been driven away buy your comments mmeblueberry ( or mine for that matter).

There are many things about fivecandles I find both intreguing and difficult to reconcile with a chalk face experienced teacher as she says she is.

Original poster
fivecandles · 29/05/2011 18:44

Eh? What I've said is in line with what the other teachers on this thread have been saying. As far as I'm aware they work in the state sector and have experiences and views that are very similar to mine. It's you two who are the oddballs and have driven everyone else away.

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EvilTwins · 29/05/2011 18:44

MmeBlueberry - I am with fivecandles on this. I find your attitude not only insulting, but intolerably smug.

Original poster
fivecandles · 29/05/2011 18:47

You both work in private schools with no TAs and small class sizes. Jabed refuses to teach students with SEN while Blueberry has pupils with significant SEN and no support. Neither of you are experiencing cuts.

Your experience is therefore not typical when compared to the experience of most teachers and your experience is not relevant to the OP.

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Feenie · 29/05/2011 18:47

So do I. Even if you didn't understand fully the impact of losing TAs when vulnerable children are involved, several people explained it to you very politely. You could at least have had the grace to say that it's completely different to your situation but you had no idea so many children needed that kind of help. Instead you told someone to 'differentiate'. It was rude, childish and patronising.

jabed · 29/05/2011 18:52

But that wasnt in the original question was it Feene? That was not about TA's and vulnerable children. That was about teachers experienceing cuts in school budgets and being made redundant ( something I have volumes of experience with I can assure you).

mrz · 29/05/2011 18:53

I think it was Mme B who brought up excessive TAs in schools jabed

Original poster
fivecandles · 29/05/2011 18:56

I think Jabed and Blue's strategy is to continue to gloat and generally insult people until they all leave and then when nobody's left, congratulate each other on the fact that their point of view is indeed the right one even though their particular experience is highly unusual and their attitudes are deeply regressive. They call me closed-minded and yet they are unwilling to listen or learn anything from others assuming that they can speak for everyone despite having very limited experiences.

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jabed · 29/05/2011 18:58

You think Fivecandles?

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