Help - DH is suddenly insisting on Steiner

[blushbabybambu]

With a month to go till the deadline for submitting state school applications dh is suddenly strongly in favor of steiner waldorf.
Three years ago we have attended an open day and I alone attended a morning introduction. I was nt happy and we have since looked at other schools.

But now dh is refusing to listen to my concerns both about what I saw on my whole school tour (he's just seen the kindy) and with what others who have gone through the expeience have said on this and other forums. He simply counters any concerns I raise by saying that I can homeschool out of school hours and that we can review the situation when ds is 7 (and then presumably he thinks we can change schools). I feel that it is hugely shortsighted to start down a road without due consideration to where it may lead. Even ignoring the anthroposophy underpinning the approach (and my disturbed nights show I'm finding that hard to do) I think that a transition at 7 will be too hard a mountain to climb.
Has anyone been down this path before?

Um.

Er.

Does DH believe in gnomes, then?

This thread could disintegrate very quickly, I fear. There have been some calm threads abut Steiner. Find them.

Submit the state school application anyway (you could always turn down a place when offered). And tell him you will both discuss the Steiner option again if and when he has pulled his finger out of his arse, done a whole school tour and done some more general research around the underlying philosophy and practical realities.

It's a religious school. Does he realise that?

why send a child to a school with the mindset that you can teach them at home and counteract what they learn there?

and if you live in an area where good state schools are massively oversubscribed, simply moving schools at 7 and all the heck that entails is an airy fairy dream

submit the state school appliation

at the least make DH come and do the whole school tour and read some of hte concerns re steiner

Put in the app for the state schools, as SantaIs said you can always turn down the offer.

But found out why he's suddenly pro-Steiner. Maybe he's just anti-state school and Steiner is the only option he's familiar(ish) with? Has he visited the state schools you're applying to?

find out why, that is

He can't just dictate to you no matter what.

I agree with Santa; FWIW, I sent my DCs to a Steiner school for three years, but that was before much information ws freely available on the 'net.
I like to think I'd have made a different decision had I then had access to MN other opinions, but of course that's easy for me to say in hindsight.
I suppose DD did more or less what your DH is suggesting; started at kindergarten and did Class 1 and part of Class 2, moving to conventional education aged 8.
She coped fairly well, and is now at grammar school, but I would rather she'd taken her chances in a more regulated environment, and we'd not, as a family, been through some of the shall we say unique (though not within Steiner) experiences we did.

Steiner schools can be great (so Im told) but the majority of parents who send their kids to them have brought their child up in the phylosophy of the school.

So NO TV
No computers
No teaching them to read or write. They start this from 7 years old.

You wont/cant do stuff at home, it will contradict what the school is doing.

From what I do know, is that most of the kids that go to Steiner all fair better (with knowledge, but not behaviour) when they get to high school.

Also, lots of kids are sent to the Steiner who cant fit into the state system.

The steiner system is intended to be holistic, complete.

So NO homeschooling of the kind suggested would be allowed.

You also need to buy into the style of the school.

You will not be able to get anxious and worried and concerned when all your friends brag about reading levels, maths abilitites, basic academic stuff. They wont be anywhere near that levels and wont catch up til a few years time.
If you are of the mindset that you want your child to do additional academic learning at home, it wont work.
They do do fantastic stuff, so I am told, but it has to be a personal choice to what suits your family, and you cant listen to other people's views.

I also know kids that have transferred from Steiner into maintstream, and vice versa, and it really does depend on how your child copes with the school system as to what is suitable for your child.
Some parents hated Steiner, and the kids love mainstream, equally, some struggled in mainstream, and have flourished at Steiner.

Steiner is a lifestyle -- you are expected to back up the school completely in your home life as mentioned above. This may be a problem if you already have a religious belief that does not include gnomes, karma or reincarnation.

Pedagogy in Steiner schools is based on antiquated theories of race and blood and some really strange ones based on karma and reincarnation which you will never be told about.

In contrast to any impression you or your DH may have gleaned on the open day you visited, Steiner schools are not havens of creativity or artistic freedom -- the artwork is either right or wrong; much of it is copying and related to anthroposophic symbols that are never explained to parents or non-initiates.

www.openwaldorf.com/anthroposophy.html An idea of what you and your child may be getting into here.

What happens if a child has say 2-3 years of Steiner and then tries to transfer into a mainstream school -- aren't they hopelessly behind? When on average do Steiner-ed children catch up with mainstream-ed children, re literacy and numeracy? I'm afraid I've read too many damning indictments of people who've tried the transfer (before the age of 14) and been shocked and upset at how "behind" their children were.

My children were not precocious readers (not a chance of reading before school age, I mean) but they could all read competently before their 7th birthday. They get such pleasure out of reading. I find it strange that an educational philosophy would so enthusiastically deny them the opportunity of that pleasure.

I think a school needs to be a joint decision. I also think if you are honest with the school about your doubts and that your DH has suggested evening homeschooling they won't accept the application, anyway. So is he suggesting you lie?

He has no right to force this on you. It needs to be something you're both behind.

Many educational systems leave reading/writing until around age 7. Our DCs were in the Dutch system where this is normal. All three are now happy readers. No one ever looks at the Dutch and calls them a stupid nation. By leaving numeracy & literacy until a bit later the belief is that children will learn these skills quicker.

Transition between schools depends on the child. My DD1 transferred from second year primary in the UK to 3rd year primary in the Netherlands (different date cut off). New school, new language were all just water off a duck's back. Five year's later she transferred back again with no issues.

DS found the transition harder, he isnt so academic and he had a very poor teacher when we moved back.

Agreed that late starting is shown to aid formal learning, not hinder. But I'd have issues with Steiner for the other reasons stated, myself.

The late starting, for us, was one of the reasons for choosing Steiner; having seen my pfb struggle with Reception at 4 1/2, I relished the opportunity to allow the others to develop more at their own speed intellectually.
Trouble being that DD, a different child entirely (old for the year, for one thing), no doubt would have taken to early reading like the proverbial duck. As it was, she waited until she was nearly 7 and was then introduced to one letter a week, taught by flakey teachers and ended up bored out of her skull.

DS1 started Steiner aged 7 1/2, and I don't think ever got over his sense of puzzlement at being there. Copying acres of text from a blackboard, learning about Norse myths and worshipping a candle didn't really cut it for him, plus the emphasis on the aesthetic was something he struggled with; DS is one of nature's mathematicians, who gets satisfaction from pure logic, so he was never going to live up to the expectation to produce 'beautiful' work, and was subsequently made to feel

The school may well take you on under the terms you mention; they need a steady flow of new families to keep going, but your approach would be at the very least frowned upon by other parents who don't want their precious angels sullied by being exposed to an early-developing intellect.

'... made to feel inadequate.'

What are his concerns about the State options and why does he think Steiner would be better?

What kind of school did he go to? This may be influencing his judgement?

I had a look round the Steiner schools and my memories are:

The children chanting around the candle. Cant remember what they were chanting.

The beautiful handwriting on large unlined books. They wrote on one side and coloured a picture on the other, and the handwriting page was beautifully decorated as well.

I remember thinking they covered topics that wouldnt be covered at other local schools (Norse myths mentioned above brought it back). They covered a different country each year.
They have the same teacher from reception to when they leave.

All discussions about curriculum were poo-poohed.

I personally didnt like it but many many parents do and it has to be a joint choice that you are both happy with because 100% family involvement is expected.

gnomes and candles Seriously?
sorry, am very ignorant about what steiner schools are and have often read that many steiner threads are either deleted or turn into bun fights. very curious now

Thanks everyone for your thoughts. He had recently met a couple of ex-students who really raved about the Steiner system, and who had also achived degrees. I had a frank chat with dh yesterday and reiterated what I had felt 2 years ago after seeing the whole school. I also showed him some of the anthrosophic material. I have to trust my instincts. But really it boils down to our ds and what interests him. I know that 4 is very young but he shows a clear preference for science and maths and is curious about how things work. And curious to know now. Thankfully we have agreed to Steiner is not a good fit, even through kindergarden.