Coping with Teacher Training days

[bacon]

I'm new to education, DS1 in reception DS2 19 months old. But this is really going to get right up my nose. Teacher training days tagged onto half terms. 1st one Friday just before the weeks break.

How do mums cope? Ive got something planned - booked months and months ago and have to leave really early and now just checked diary and DS1 is home and I'm paying for DS2 to be in nursery!

Why cant they do these training days in the evenings or even Saturday morning like the rest of us? Why has education have to be so disrupted? Surely with the number of weeks off they get it wouldnt be too much to expect a few days to be put towards training?

Struth, we are self employed here, hubby never hardly gets time off, when we were farming we worked well unto the night, expected to get up at the crack of dawn, 7 days a week, working when completely exhausted and so hanging and no paid holidays!

So many families are struggling with childcare, trying to hold onto their jobs, and then this is slapped in our faces.

Surely this doesnt happen on the continent??

pisces, since I work in a 6th form as I have explained many times, we tend not to have many babies and toddlers!!

What sort of meetings are you talking about? Our own staff meetings are held on a Monday morning before the timetable begins for students. If you mean parents evenings then parents with toddlers of whom there are few (given that this would involve a 16 year age gap) would bring them to the meeting, which always cheers me up, or leave them with someone else for the 10 minutes appointment.

Not really sure what your point is.

'In the eyes of the law, education is in fact the responsibility of the parents, not schools'

We really must knock this one on the head because it's hugely offensive as well as absurd.

Are you seriously suggesting that it is IRRESPONSIBLE to leave your child in out of school provision.

Seriously?

I thought so-it is all me, me, me and what you need. I know many a 6th form parent who has much younger DCs. Lots of people get married twice and start second families.I wouldn't bring a young DC to the meeting-it isn't fair when I am concentrating on the older one. I would like them to start at 8pm but I don't expect everyone to change for me-it is my responsibility and I sort it.

'I said that our playleaders were unable to cover training days. You said:

"To suggest that there wouldn't be the staff in this climate is ridiculous.

More problems, problems, problems.

Finding it increasingly bizarre actually."

Which I did find dismissive...'

I don't remember being aware that you had actually tried to provide care during INSET days at this point. This is now a very long thread and I can't be expected to remember everything that has been said and by whom.

Out of interest, why can't the playleaders cover training days? And why couldn't you employ other people?

Well done you for trawling through the thread to find that though!

Blimey. I don't get that from it at all!

I give up fivecandles-you keep putting silly words in my mouth! I appreciate that you think that before a school holds an INSET day they must arrange to babysit your DC. It won't happen-unless you form a committee and sort it out-or persuade other parents or afterschool staff to do it instead.It isn't the school's responsibility and it shouldn't be IMO.

Aaaargh. In the post to which you were responding withg those kind words I said that the staff could only work those hours because of other jobs/caring committments. And employing people is a massive faff actually. So we chose not to and make our own arrangements.

And now you're being quite rude again in fact.

'I thought so-it is all me, me, me and what you need.'

Absurd and hostile. I would like to remind you that I have been arguing for a service that would benefit ALL parents who would use it. And I'm sorry, what's your argument again? Something along the lines of I'm all right Jack and sucks to the rest of you.

'I know many a 6th form parent who has much younger DCs.'

But do you know many 6th form parents at my college?

As it happens I'm sure my college would look into providing a creche if it were thought necessary. Nobody has ever made such a request to my knowledge and for all the reasons that I've said it would be quite an odd one. We have parents once a year and each appointment lasts 10 minutes. Very few parents have children with a 16 year age gap so we really are talking about a very, very small minority. Getting someone to watch your child during this time is not usually difficult and certainly any one of our staff would be happy to look after somebody's child while the parents had their appointment.

As I've said, on the very, very rare occasion when a parent has had a young child to look after they've brought them in to the appointment with them and both parties have been quite happy about this.

By the way our parents evenings run from 4- 9 pm but if parents can't attend we are always happy to arrange another meeting or phone call.

I've phoned quite a few parents over the years because they weren't able to make it at the right time for one reason or another.

I would say that's really quite family friendly. Wouldn't you?

'I appreciate that you think that before a school holds an INSET day they must arrange to babysit your DC.It won't happen-unless you form a committee and sort it out-or persuade other parents or afterschool staff to do it instead.It isn't the school's responsibility and it shouldn't be IMO.'

Do you have a problem with understanding what I am saying or are you not bothering to read and just trotting out your illconsidered responses to what you THINK I might be saying?

My dcs' school ALREADY has an out of school provision. It employs people to run this service. So no committees are needed. It is just asking them to extend the hours of a provision which is ALREADY in place and which people are PAID for.

In what world is it unreasonable to pay people to do their jobs?

Sometimes people ask me to tutor their children. I can say yes or no but it would be very strange if I said how dare you ask me to do that, educating your child is your responsiblity. Weird.

' I said that the staff could only work those hours because of other jobs/caring committments. '

Sorry to hear that but presumably there's room to review that situation in the future when different people may be employed or people's commitments change?

If there is the demand then people could be told there is a possiblity of extending their hours when they are employed?

Yes, employing people is a faff but in the current climate it's great if people can employ people to do valuable jobs.

'INSET days and parents will continue to have to cover them in the way that they cover holiday.'

Except that in the holiday there are usually school or LEA run holiday clubs or you can employ a childminder for a few weeks!!!

There are often no such facilities during INSET days hence the thread.

fivecandles I'm sorry but I know you will probably be offended but I do think your knowledge of the Extended Schools initiative is somewhat limited if you beileve it is down to who pays for what. The Initiative was set up to look at the type of services available to parents in the area and yes those services are in many cases paid for by the parents. Private Day Nurseries, Pre Schools and existing out of school services including leisure centres and playschemes all come under the Extended Schools umbrella.

And your point is?

fivecandles Fri 29-Oct-10 13:47:30

TBH I can really see how, as a result of a meeting where you are involved looking at the pros and the cons and the cons and the cons, nothing would actually be achieved.

Actually fivecandles it was almost a years worth of involvement and a great deal was obviously achieved as the parents in my area don't seem to have the difficulties you clearly do

The point is you clearly haven't got a clue what you are talking about and don't want to hear anything that distorts your view of how things should be.

'a great deal was obviously achieved as the parents in my area don't seem to have the difficulties you clearly do'

Well, I'm glad. Unless they were too afraid of admitting them for fear they'd be called irresponsible or pathetic!

I think we've already concluded your area is not representative.

And I'm not happy about the implication that I'm alone in having difficulties with childcare. It is widely acknowledged as a widespread problem everywhere except on this thread.

I am lucky in that the only days I do struggle are the INSET days but I'm acutely aware that for others the INSET days are on top of having to find and pay for childcare for another 13 weeks. The particular problem with INSET days as we have established is that there is often a huge shortage of childcare available whereas there are usually organised schemes for holidays and before and after school.

I think you may have concluded many things fivecandles but that doesn't mean they are true only they fit your argument.

'The point is you clearly haven't got a clue what you are talking about '

I really haven't got a clue what YOU are talking about.

Out of school care existed and exists and will exist irrespective of the extended schools project.

Well, no, mrz, I'm interested in supporting what I say with facts.

You've already said that yours is a village school where you'd managed to consult every parent whose child goes to the school and they all said they didn't want any sort of out of school care. This IS unusual.

Nationally finding good quality, affordable childcare is a problem and there's lots of research which indicates this. I've linked to some of it earlier.

In nice simple terms that you hopefully will understand [not a chance] existing out of school care all came under the Extended Schools Initiative when it was introduced in 2005.
One of the first tasks of the LA committee was to look at existing out of school care either council or privately run in the area and to ascertain if it was adequate or additional services needed to be introduced.

Actually fivecandles we canvassed every household in the extended area not only parents of children who already attended.

and again as you jump to conclusions I said the parents didn't feel their was a need for the school to provide these service as they were already available most choosing childminders or private day care

Yes, but I still don't see your point mrz about extended schools. What is your point? Even if there is no funding for extended schools there will need to be out of school care in most areas excepting yours of course.

Yes, I understand that point, mrz. It is still unusual. Most areas DO provide out of school care because there IS a need. And village schools are rare and cater for a minority of all of our pupils. Nothing wrong with that of course but it is not typical.