Too poor for uni so how about the OU

[Pennylessparent]

As time goes by and my DC get closer and closer to Uni age it is looking more and more unlikely we will ever find the money to fund them through it.

We are not on a particular low income but got our mortgage late in life and cannot down size or move really as we already live in a cheap area.

Its not just the uni fees but acomodation and everything else that goes with it.

I dont want my DC to start out in life with a huge debt and end up in a similar financial situation yo us - not poor but just about getting by with few treats etc.

Is it a dumb idea in these circumstances to consider the Open University?

Has anyone elses DC done this?

I'm currently beginning an OU course myself and I must say the price is preferable to going to an actual uni. Whilst course fees vary, mine is about £370 a unit and i think there are about 6 in total. Far cheaper! There are also grants if you are on a low income to help with fees. Plus obviously it means I can be at home with my young son.

What does your DC think of the OU? Because uni is often more than anything a chance to make your own way in the world, leave home, meet new people etc... The OU does require an extensive amount of solitude... If you are on a low income you can get grants from the government which you don't have to repay as well as the loan. Whilst it seems like a large ammount of debt, payments don't kick in until you are earning a high salary, and the interest rates are very low. Plus if you don't find a job paying at least £15,000 within a certain number of years, you don't have to make the payments. So it's almost a no win no fee situation if you get what I mean...

Hope this was somewhat useful. The main thing is for you and your DC to decide why is best. For a youngster though, going to uni can be a very rewarding life experience- plus a great way to move into the adult world :)

I did a full-time degree in the early 80s, I've dabbled with the OU but I'm now back at my original university full-time doing a PhD.

Did you have a traditional university experience yourself? Do you understand the differences? University is only tangentially about the degree itself, and is a whole, wider experience: friendships, contacts, inspiration. The OU is a very solitary experience. If you live somewhere there's a lot of people doing your popular module, there will be dayschools and face-to-face tutorials which can give some contact: I did AA100 Arts Foundation last year, to get out of my science/engineering bubble, and I had about 40 hours of contact time, which given it's a notional half-time course is actually not a million miles from half the contact time you'd get in a physical university. I also had several lengthy telephone tutorials. But a friend did a low-volume MSc module, and had a tutor three hundred miles away who didn't answer his phone. In both cases, of course, there isn't the 24x7 social context of a physical university.

Then there's issues like libraries (you can use your local university's library, but that may or may not be good and may or may not be near), computers (you need to row your own boat), labs and practicals (complex), etc, etc.

I think it's do-able. But you'd need to be a very, very self-motivated 18 year old with a lot of parental support that actually understood the issues.

"more and more unlikely we will ever find the money to fund them through it."

It's not your degree, it's their's. When they get to Uni age they will be adults: it's up to them to sort the finance. This is the sort of "make your own way in the world" decision that Katerpillar was talking about. Step back: you only have to give emotional support, not financial.

I agree with the previous posters- it isn't your job to fund uni. However, OU would more than likely be free as they go by the student's income when working out finance. So, unless your child has a private income of more than around £15,000, it will be free.

I did OU at 18, as I had a job, but I still wish I'd have gone to uni "properly". It depends on the student, and is nothing to do with the parent. Although, if you are very poor, they may get grants as well as loans.

I have a degree from a brick university, have studied with the OU (I'm currently completing a masters) and DD1 is about to start her second year at university.

When I did my first degree I was completely immersed in the subject, I had a fairly full timetable of lectures, practicals and tutorials and loved every minute of it. The OU is very different, the courses are very well run but you have to be very self motivated with very limited contact with other students. I'd give anything to actually go to a lecture at the moment or to have a decent library to study in (my local library just appears to be full of people on facebook!). DD1 is having a similar experience at university than I did and as she is studying a science degree at a good university I hope that it will be worth it financially. We top up her maintenance loan and she works in the holidays - she is with a temp agency and so even if she just gets a few weeks full time it makes a huge difference.

I would consider what my child wanted to do at university, how able they are and therefore what sort of university they could get into and what sort of career they are likely to go into as to whether the traditional university experience would be worth the expense. DD2 is applying for university now and wants to do Maths at a good university. I would expect that her earning potential afterwards would be quite high and that she shouldn't be scared of the debt.

Studying with the OU is a possibility but I think both my DD's would need a lot of support and encouragement to get through it (as do older OUers ) and it can be a slow process compared to studying full time.

How about if they went to uni near you so could still live at home?

" I'd give anything to actually go to a lecture at the moment or to have a decent library to study in"

I realise it may not be practical, but you know don't you that as an OU student you can get reciprocal rights at your local university library?

My local university is quite far away Tokoyonambu but I am thinking of treating myself to a day there. I am likely to lamp one of the facebookers or people rustling the newspapers if I spend any more time in my town library.

I rejected my place at a good uni because we wanted to start a family. I knew I could do an OU degree and as it turns out I got full funding. I love it but you need a lot of motivation. I don't miss all the 'uni life' stuff as it's just not me IYSWIM, all I want is the actual degree. Maths is easier to study alone than other subjects which need debates etc.

TBH all that matters here is how your kids feel, they are the ones studying. They'll manage the debt and get bursaries etc if necessary. They're adults by that point so it's their choice :)

Tbh I'm glad my parents never let me consider the OU fir my first degree. I went to Uni for 3 years andhappened to get a degree out of it but it was so much more than that.

Now I study with the OU and it's hard. Harder than my first degree even though I'm doing a subject I love, in all honesty I should have studied it earlier, which fits in with my circumstances. It's tougher because I miss the interaction with other students, the societies and associations, student politics (never thought I'd say that ) and just being around other people in the same boat.

Also you don't get the same support with study skills IMO. If I didn't already have a degree I'd be floundering wildly.

Why are you so set on Uni for your DCs? There are other options and the OU is there in later life if they want a degree.

Agree with many but especially senua. It's their degree and their decision.

When my DD said she wanted to go, we were pretty broke (one small wage plus housing benefit for a family of 5). She got the maximum grant & student loan, and worked part time too.
She funded her Masters with £1k from me, plus a £2k bank loan in my name that she paid- she worked as a TA in her old secondary for that year.

She's just done a year's work to clear some debts and has returned to Uni to do her PGCE, again on a student loan. This is the first time she's not had a job whilst studying but she just doesn't have time.

Her self confidence has grown enormously, both by being away from home and by working, and she has been largely financially independent of us for several years. She's had nice holidays and runs a half decent car which she saved for.

I hate the fact that she has a huge debt (@£17k) but she truly regards it as an investment in her future career, and is adamant that she wouldn't have it any other way.

please please don't think that you will not be able to afford to send them. It is attitudes like this that remain the real stumbling block to equality of access to higher education.
Fees are NOT PAID UPFRONT. your lo will pay them back once they begin earning close to average earnings so this is not something that you should worry about.
living costs, your children will be eligible for a loan to cover these and if your income is low enough you may even get a grant. This is probably not enough to cover everything BUT combined with a part time job and working over the vacations should be. Honestly all your responsibilities will be to feed them in vacations and do their washing when they come home

And the other elephant in the room, of course, is the acceptability of OU degrees to employers of 21 year olds. Employers won't have a lot of experience with them, and when you employ a 21 year old you're employing the whole package, not just degree, and the whole package will have benefitted from the overall university experience. There's also the (absolutely unfounded, but nonetheless common) perception of OU degrees somehow not being real degrees. Things like OU masters and doing second career-change degrees with the OU following a physical university first degree is one thing, but I suspect pitching up at a graduate recruitment event with an OU degree done 18-21 makes you something of a niche proposition.

Here's what you can offer:

• they could continue to live with you and study at the local university (if possible - this wasn't an option for me as we were rural)

• you can offer some money with the understanding that they will have to work their way through university. This is fine, lots of people do it! You don't have to completely support them financially. Some parents do. They are not the benchmark. It's a time for learning how to budget, learning how to scrimp, how to work and study at the same time.

• pay into an insurance policy that matures when you need it (my dad did this for me for a big birthday)

• ask relatives to give things like book tokens for presents (make sure 2nd hand bookshops take them) (many, many students buy 2nd hand books, there's no shame at all)

• as others have said, the value is in the experience and also the opportunities for things like travel. You can be supportive of those whilst not being responsible for paying for them. There's a 3 month vacation, too, so you're not paying for the whole year. Your kids can do things like go and do charity work on a student volunteer programme - it's completely great for them, for their cv, and it doesn't cost much to do. They basically have the chance to do a lot of exploration of themselves and the world, and the minute they are out of university and into the working world, those opportunities are limited (generally you don't earn a good amount until maybe your late 20s, but once you do, your income can rise rapidly).

I wouldn't swap those years for any money. I know it was a struggle for my dad to see me through it, but he simply said, if you want to do it, you work. If i'd been at home doing an OU degree I simply would not have learned what I did, I wouldn't have met the friends I did, I wouldn't have met DH, I wouldn't have travelled, etc.

Also I did come out with student loan debt - yes it's a pain but I invested in myself, I was happy to pay it off and as a result I have earning power that I wouldn't have had.

Completely agree about employers looking at an OU degree btw.

The big problem is that people probably value, as in are willing to fund for their children, a physical degree if they did one themselves. And if they did one themselves, they're more likely to be in a financial position to underwrite their children. Hence social divides increase.

Another problem is that people who did degrees themselves and/or have some involvement in higher education today are aware of which degrees are "worth it", either in terms of earning power or in terms of personal growth. So it's one thing finding (whether from parents, grandparents, loans, the state, working, whatever) £50K - which is likely to be the all-up cost of a degree, given the rise of 4 year degrees - if you have some knowledge of what you're getting into. The people I feel sorry for are those who do degrees that sound "more practical" from second-tier institutions who then end up with a poor experience, debt and no real benefit either in employability or personal development.

...does this mean with an OU degree I'll be unemployable?!

I suspect the evidence for the employability of OU graduates who did their degrees 18-21 is sketchy, because people who do degrees with the OU are not homogenous with people who did their degrees at physical universities. But I personally would interview someone with an OU degree as their first degree very carefully. I'd worry about team-working skills, for example, and compromise and negotiation: they may well have them, but they won't have acquired them as part of their degree. First degrees aren't just about the subject content.

Mind you, having sat in a couple of maths research seminar this month, I'm not sure teamwork and negotiation are on the agenda anyway .

hopefully they'd take other skills such as self discipline into account... and the fact I've done it while raising my kids and therefore won't bog off on mat leave :o

I'm trying to console myself with the fact that an OU maths degree (on track for a first) will be better than a 'mickey mouse' degree from a proper uni.

hopefully.

If your DC could also do some valuable part-time work in their chosen field (not flipping burgers!) while studying they may indeed stand out above someone with a 'standard' degree, and easily be able to demonstrate teamwork & negotiation skills.

I'm also studying for an OU maths degree, but sadly it's a long time since I was 18...

If you are anywhere near London, send your DC to Birkbeck, part-time but a proper evening study face-to-face university, with excellent researchers and teachers - and at a fraction of the cost, and you can work during the day. It takes 18 years old now (used to be 21)

My response to the OP is that her DC will be adults when they would go to the university and that it would then not be her decision whether or not they went away to university and took out student loans.
If they would be happy to do OU, then that is up to them as well.
It is up to them to decide which path to take. The OP has to tell them that she is not in a position to help them financially and that they need to plan around this.

Telling your children that they can't go to university because you can't afford it is...quite honestly moronic.

I suggest you look at the funding options available to students and ensure your child correctly considers university to be as much a financial investment in their future as a 'tick in the box'.

I think Julraj's comment is somewhat uncalled for. Lots of people are going to be unable to support their children through university who might previously have been able to (and yet won't qualify for bursaries etc)- let's see what the Browne Review brings tomorrow. It won't be good news and clearly there is a move to restrict numbers going into Higher Ed and the burden of fees is being shifted back onto individuals. Arts and Humanities can forget it, by all accounts. No more govt funding so most will close down and only Oxford, Cambridge etc be there as finishing schools for the elite.