Teen Eating Disorders Thread 7

[Lottsbiffandsmudge]

We have managed to fill the previous Thread here https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/eating_disorders/4471980-Teen-Eating-Disorders-Thread-6?page=40

So I thought I would start a new one.

Everyone supporting a young person with and ED is welcome here for advice (non professional but lived experience) and support.

Hoping everyone can find us...

I've not posted for a while and am in a very different situation to most of you on here.
For those later to join on here, dd was diagnosed and hospitalised 20 months ago. For her it was all about exercise and justifying food rather than body image - lockdown hit her really badly.
I'm so delighted to say that she's home from her first term at university (catered halls) and in a better place mentally than she's been for the last two years at least.
I wouldn't say that she has an amazing relationship with food but nearly all fear foods are eaten now. She is at the point where she needs to cut back a little on the carbs - she eats lots of bread - and have more protein and veg. I can't decide whether to say anything as I'm very wary about triggering old thoughts - is this just a typical student diet?

Hi @NCTDN lovely to see you and great news that DD is a much better place re MH now. Having her way at University must be both a "yay" and a "omg" moment in many ways.

re carbs - I think it is student diet/lifestyle and yet I wonder if its worth opening up (not immediately) opportunities for chats about managing in non self catering - I presume she'll be in a non halls setting for her 2nd year. Would she be up for learning some cooking lessons on how to eat well when living in a student house - so you could show her some new proportions? I follow "beatthebudget" on insta/her website beatthebudget.com/

she doesn't (as far as I know) have a history of ED but did eat healthily pre Uni but then felt it going away so she made conscious decision to meal plan within a student budget.

We use some of her meals as DD likes to have a stack of 15 or so meals in the freezer each week so she doesn't have to worry on any individual day what she is going to eat (can be a trigger for her). What I like about BTB page is that the nutritional value is there and she down/up scales for potion numbers (useful for us as Dd is in training for a marathon). Maybe take a look and see if it would work for your DD?

Nc I wouldn't say anything at all, if she wants to eat carbs all day (personally) I'd let her. From memory 99.9% of my student diet was toast 🤷‍♀️

I think any hint of judgement or talk of 'healthy' choices has the potential to be massively triggering and it wouldn't be worth the risk imo.

I would be celebrating that she's out in the world and eating independently.

Thanks @Girliefriendlikespuppies that's my thoughts. I never dreamed 18 months ago that this was possible.
@myrtleWilson she can cook really well and knows all about healthy / balanced diets. Next year she will be self catered so it's just budgeting to ensure it can be relatively healthy. Pre Covid her diet was excellent, the first lockdown triggered the onset of the ED.
I think maybe if she's still the same in the summer I'll rethink my plan.

Hi @NCTDN great to hear your DD is doing so well. I think the student diet is always pretty carb heavy tbh. They're cheap and easy to make!
I think I would just let it go. I'd be worried about triggering something too tbh

Hi all. I've been a bit awol over Christmas although have been reading. Things were seeming calmer and progress was being made. DD ate (a modified) Christmas dinner at the table, she tried some fear foods and actively asked for things (eg cauliflower cheese and stuffing). She had a few down points but was quite engaged with family, playing games etc.

I had a sense of unease over it all though and it turns out I was right - she admitted to me just before we came back that she had a plan to stop eating again when she got home and that's how she allowed herself to eat over Christmas.

She tried yesterday and I was clear of the implications - fully restricted phone, stopping pocket money (she's obsessed with buying clothes), no activities or socialising if she's not eating. I started to put phone restrictions on yesterday and that seemed to be enough to get her to start eating. But this morning she said she didn't care so I've followed through with the restrictions on phone and stopping pocket money.

I'm concerned though as her younger brother (9) started to mimic some of her behaviours when we were away eg not wanting to eat around others. He's also got very down on himself saying he doesn't like the way he looks.

I mentioned to DD that this was happening and that he looks up to her. She's taking this as guilt tripping and is furious/upset, so I'm not sure if it was the right thing to say or not.

She saw her therapist yesterday afternoon and is now angry with her because she wouldn't agree with her that I was guilt tripping, and is now saying she doesn't want to go again.

I'm hoping seeing her friends, and the reality of going back to a restricted life will make this a short lived blip, but I'm so worried this is the start of a spiral. Just as things felt a bit calmer.

Need to find the strength to pick myself up and keep going.

Well done on following through little I haven't had to deal with the fall out for siblings but personally I don't think there's any harm pointing out the reality of the illness to your dd.

My dd has got younger cousins who idolise her and I've been worried in the past that they might pick up on some of dds behaviours.

Dd point blank refused breakfast this morning, said she wasn't hungry.

What's so infuriating is I think she's telling the truth, she probably isn't hungry but how can I trust her?! I packed her an extra snack and said she'd have to have that to make it up but God knows if she will eat it.

I'm so done with it all, I find myself thinking I should just give up, maybe if I let her fail she'll realise herself how shit her life with an ED is 🤷‍♀️

I'm starting to think the same girl. Currently sat in the car with DD refusing to eat anything. Advice from Maudsley was up just sit here as long as it takes. She's so stubborn though.

She's saying she doesn't care about not having her phone. I hope it's not true

I'm so sick of this. Had to extend my sick note again and I'm really worried about my job. I just don't know how on earth I could manage going back

It was around this time last year that dd started getting weird with food and I just thought it was another phase. I've looked back at some of our WhatsApp messages and the signs are all there. Easy to see in hindsight of course. If only I knew what I know now I might have stopped her losing so much weight and becoming very mentally ill. There needs to be some sort of handbook given to parents as their dc are nearing puberty with signs to look out for. I had no idea that ED was such a sneaky creeping illness.

My dd will compensate as well LittlePickleHead. It's awful as you just know that good meal that they've eaten or little extra that they've chosen will come back to haunt you.

I have let go a bit. I couldn't handle the stress of full control. On the whole I do breakfast lunch and dinner and dd chooses her snacks. Not great choices but better than nothing. Occasionally she makes her own breakfast or lunch too, but she eats pretty much the same thing daily and I keep an eye on it. It gives her a bit of control and gives me a bit of a breather. I add fats where I can to make up the shortfall. I know it's not ideal but over time it's become the norm for us and we're muddling along with small weight gains. Its definitely not the camhs way but it's very difficult to completely control older teens. Those that manage it must extremely strong mentally, which I am not. If she relapses and camhs feel she needs full control she'll have to go to a unit because I can't do it.

Bagpuss that was exactly what I did a year into our journey, I couldn't hack full control. Being on my own with dd with zero outside support it was just too hard. I went down the path of least resistance which for me was to insist on 3 meals and 1 snack every day and work on adding as much extra to that combination to make up the short fall.

I also accepted 90% of food and drink being eaten.

I feel the same that she'd have to go into a unit to get full control. I haven't got the energy to do it. Just doing the above pushes me to my limits some days!!

That said I was able to get dd to a really decent weight, mentally she's okay (I think normalish for a neurodiverse teen who has always struggled to fit in) and generally she's able to do everything she wants to.

My worry is that I think dd thinks once she turns 18 she can do what she likes, she said this to me Ystd!! That's only just over a year away now...

Interesting what you're saying about not having total control. I'm finding I'm making slightly more progress with increasing DDs range of food by being led by her.

Anyway, after about 2 hours in the car and tears from both of us we had an emergency call with our therapist from the Maudsley, and it did seem to break through to DD. I took her home (as pretty much missed second half of school) and she ate all her lunch and has been back on track since then, albeit very low.

This is so hard isn't it. She seems to think she can't allow herself to enjoy herself or have a nice time, and the guilt over Christmas is so strong.

LittlePickleHead Ultimately you keep control and prepare the meals, but you could allow dd a choice of snack or allow her to help with planning meals for the week. In our case it was useful as it opened up dialogue around food and we worked out which meals she was most comfortable with and identified her fear foods.

Obviously you'll have to be prepared to pull back if she pushes too hard which is the risk of letting go slightly. It's trial and error.

The worst thing I ever did was allow dd to go shopping with me which resulted in her hunting for the lowest calorie everything and us having awful arguments, so I took control of that swiftly and started doing all food shopping online.

I'm fuming.

It turns out yesterday morning there was a PHSE class talking about healthy nutrition and foods that can make you fat, and how bad obesity is.

I'm friends with one of DDs school friends mums and her daughter told her mum that she was worried about DD because she was head down, shaking in class (she only recently told them about ED).

The school are aware of her diagnosis, why didn't they tell me this was happening? The impact was obvious!

Oh @LittlePickleHead am sorry for your Dd and how careless of the school - we had similar when the chaplain did a Lent themed assembly banging on about strength of mind to give ups something. Thankfully, although upset Dd took herself off to head of 6th form and we all got an apology. I honestly think some schools compartmentalise EDs or other MH issues into 'special days or events' and don't think enough about how day to day life in school can impact

Yeah we had similar happen little schools are a nightmare for talking rubbish about 'healthy eating' when dd had recently been diagnosed in one science lesson they all had to weigh each other and work out their BMIs 😱🤯🤬

I go to a local primary school to a Pilates class once a week and they have a sign in their lunch hall that says 'self control' and has a picture of a child refusing a piece of cake!! It makes me so angry.

Re control I would always encourage parents to take full control if possible as that has been shown to give the best results.

It could well be the reason we are still stuck here with dd not being able to make sensible/free choices for herself so definitely don't think loosening the reins works, it's what I did to save my own sanity but ideally I would have been much stricter from the beginning.

If I could go back in time and do things differently I would sit it out, insist of everything being finished, use sanctions consistently but I didn't know what I was doing and Camhs were so woolly with their advice 🤷‍♀️

By the time I figured out what I should have been doing it was a bit late really and I was already running out of steam.

It also gets harder the older they get.

Not a good day today. DD refused breakfast: at her last appointment the specialist said that her obs were worrying, and unless she started eating a larger breakfast all activities other than school would have to stop. She interpreted this as "You can still go to school if you don't eat breakfast", so refused completely. I called the ED service, who said that I should contact the school and say she wasn't allowed to stay after 3 on medical advice. DD reacted by leaving at three and taking a bus into town. Got back at 7, refused dinner and refused evening snack. Says she ate packed lunch and two snacks, but really, who knows? I'm at a loss now. What can I do? I can't physically restrain her. She doesn't care about havnig her phone removed. Hospital have removed the NG plan, because she used it all the time, as it made her feel less guilty than eating. Hospital are saying they may have to reduce school to part-time given her physical health, but I have exhausted all my annual leave and sick leave, and we have a mortgage to pay.....

Oh @NanFlanders I'm so sorry to hear this. I don't really have any advice but couldn't read and run. How I wish there was a magic wand.

Thanks @SwattyPie. Appreciate that. She hasn't eaten anything today. CAMHs have said to bring her to A&E if she faints. She's cuddled up next to the radiator because she's so cold. Has a new obsession with getting under 40kg.

My heart goes out to you NanFlanders. Could you contact citizens advice to see what your rights are if you need to stop work to care for dd? It certainly sounds like she should be part time or no school if she's refusing. Sending you lots of love and support x

@NanFlanders does she know her weight?

@NanFlanders im sorry I don’t have much advice but sending a hug

DD is doing amazing and has made masses of progress as she actively wants to get better so is asking for fear foods and talking through what the disorder is telling her and then doing opposite actions and while the pain she is in makes me so unhappy it is better than the pain the disorder gives her.

however my youngest went back to gym this week and the coach asked to speak to me afterwards and she said she was concerned as she has looks like she has lost weight. I feel awful I didn’t see it but she reassured me it is harder to notice when you see them every day but still as her mum I should have noticed. I spoke to her about it that evening to see what was up and she said she hasn’t lost weight and wasn’t trying to lose weight and there is nothing to worry about. However I wasn’t convinced and said ok let’s go and watch a film with hot chocolate and she immediately said I’m fine thanks I don’t feel like hot chocolate I knew something was up she loves hot chocolates. I took her to GP and she has been referred to CAMHS Ed service. We should see them next Wednesday however of course this triggered eldest who now hasn’t eaten anything in 48 hours. I am such a failure of a mother I just keep thinking how much better of a life my children would have if I didn’t bring them up as I have caused so much damage somewhere and the worst part is I don’t even know where I have gone wrong

Oh @NanFlanders am so sorry - this must be so hard for you. I know she's had various hospital admissions but am I right in thinking those were on paeds wards? Are they/you considering a tier 4 residential unit as possible next step. The thought of that use to terrify me but when CAMHS floated that for us, I was at the point of "yes, please as this isn't working" Sending hugs and anything else you need.

@lovewinter - you are absolutely not a failure of a mother. You have been coping with one of the most traumatic experiences anyone can possibly imagine. You haven't got any thing wrong - you're a human doing life saving work every single bloody day. Focus on the fact that its been picked up and you're in the system - hopefully as she's a bit younger (not sure how old) it will be easier to nip this in the bud. I wasn't previously a one for positive affirmations etc but I think you should go outside (out of earshot) scream and then tell yourself how strong you are and you are an amazing mom.

Oh for an edit button - I just wanted to add/reinforce @NanFlanders when I typed 'this isn't working' it was about my feelings and my ability to cope - just wanted to reassure I wasn't suggesting you weren't doing all you can - we know you are.

@myrtleWilson No offence taken! I was actually just thinking, should we advocate for Tier 4? It's been 14 months now and DD weighs less than when we started! @lovewinter - it's NOT you! There are very complicated reasons why ED develops and we know a large part it genetic. @NCTDN - yes, she does know her weight. ED team wanted to do blind weighing, but she wouldn't have it. @BagpussSaggyOldClothCat - thanks. We have just been awarded PIP for DD, but we (probably rightly) don't qualify for any other benefits as both DH and I have reasonably well-paying professional jobs. Trouble is the mortgage is predicated on us both having those salaries.

Oh Nan and love I'm so sorry things are so shit, I fucking hate this illness.

Nan personally I wouldn't wait for her to faint, I'd pack her up and head back to a&e now. I'd also push for a tier 4 bed, there's a waiting list so you might as well get her on a list now and if she does start to improve you can always review if it's needed. She doesn't sound well enough for school at all let alone part time and I think it's fine to say we can't do this anymore at home.

Love I'm so sorry re your younger dd, this illness is genetic so sadly it's fairly common between siblings. Re your elder dd not eating for 48 hours I think you probably need to find a way to separate her from the younger dd, I appreciate that's easier said than done. Will you take her to a&e if she keeps it up? I'm so sorry, this illness is absolutely not your fault.

Every single mum on this thread (myself included!) is absolutely amazing, we get up every day and keep going, we are warriors and our girls are lucky to have us.