Teen Eating Issues/Disorders Support Thread 2

[myrtleWilson]

Our first thread is almost full. Here is our second - a place to seek and share advice, to lament and scream with rage and sadness, to celebrate each other's successes as we navigate the choppy waters of supporting our children with eating disorders.

All are very welcome, whether you're at the start of this journey or a more seasoned traveller.

I'll link this thread to the first one and then I thought it may be helpful if on joining this one we did a quick precis of our current situation.

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/eating_disorders/4016379-teen-eating-issues-support-thread?msgid=104736115

I’ll have to make the best of it....

We booked a holiday today, a caravan in Wales! I had a f*ck it moment and just thought I need something to look forward to, it's also for May half term.

It's quite a posh caravan but I will have to carefully plan the food situation, will also have to negotiate snacks around exercise as there's a pool on site.

I have trouble with my mum making constant comments about food and talking about any food we're eating, she mentioned cooking the roast spuds in oil earlier and I nearly kicked her!! She also expects dd to say how nice the food is which is obviously a big ask of her!!

I'll talk to the psych on Wednesday and see what she thinks re meds, I'm wary as although things aren't great they could be a lot worse so don't want any set backs iyswim.

@Girliefriendlikespuppies my Mum (who is mentally disabled now) said joyfully to DD1: 'If you eat that, then you'll put on weight ' She was trying to be encouraging!

DD1 said she simply had to go to bed at 6:30pm tonight. I tried to persuade her to stay up a bit later, but she said her whole body was needing sleep. Then she went to fridge and snaffled 3 chicken goujons left over from last night's dinner, and said 'can I have my medicine now so I can go to bed.'

We finished the day on 2734 calories, even without a formal dinner, so I'm happy. It will be interesting to see if she gains this week. We had a 600g loss last week.

@Girliefriendlikespuppies i am already making lists in my head..... scales, blender, rice cakes, ashes nuts, double cream (secretly) and worrying about how to keep her out of the kitchen when it’s in the middle of our open plan caravan etc etc

....oooh holiday talk...I'm under no illusion that going away anywhere won't be relaxing or easy, but sorely tempted just to get away for a change of scene - even if it's just to spend 11 hours a day in a different kitchen interior .
Day 2 post discharge- not the best, a couple of food/drink casualties but I felt strangely disconnected from it today. Can normally feel the panic rising up as it unfolds but feeling determined not to let it phase me as I'm sure that's where E.D gets a win if it sees me rattled. So I watched pretty dispassionately and kept quiet while DD tipped 350ml of banana Yazoo on to the floor and later, her bowl of yoghurt on the table. Each time she had a strop, stomped away but at least kept a lid on the anger more this time - def think she reacts more if I try to intervene or communicate too much at those points.
So although not great, I guess I have to be glad it wasn't worse and both times, after calming, she did go on to eat. No wonder she seems exhausted by the eve - must be like climbing a bloody mountain several times a day...

A new week begins and it's sunny here. And because my closest friends are in their 50s, they're wandering around wearing 'I've been vaccinated' stickers and big grins.

And DD has put on 300g. Whopee do - that means that over the last three weeks, it's a grand total of 100g. However, I'm taking it as a win due to being back at school. It feels miraculous to me that she's not lost any given how much more energy she's using and how little time I've now got to cram food into her.

@Roolet12 really sorry to hear that it's hard post discharge.

@Jojo2347 I totally agree re. the relentlessness of constant meals and snacks. It reminds me of when they were babies and you were trapped in a cycle of feeds and sleeps. Or when potty training and you had to dash out and try to do things in the window just after they'd finally weed in the potty. With all the attendant cheerleading.

@Lottsbiffandsmudge your mil sounds most unhelpful but not untypical of that generation? I didn't tell my parents about DD for ages, partly as I didn't want to worry them, and when I did, I downplayed it. My mother did once say to me (then a perfectly normal teenager) that 'anorexia might do you good'. And I've never forgiven her.

@Valleyofthedollymix great news on weight gain! What an awful thing for your mum to say. My mum has mostly been amazing or then she single handedly had to deal with my brothers psychotic breakdown in his late teens and was a full time carer to him for years so she gets mental illness. She sometimes doesn't do things the way i would but is used to the melt downs...
@Roolet12 well done for remaining calm it is sooo hard
How is everyone else day going?

Sunny here too tho not made the most of it..have some kind of burning, manky ulcerated rash in my mouth which kills & is putting me in a v bad, bedridden kind of mood!
No food missiles here today so far. DD in a reasonable mood thank G. That may soon change when I bring up the subject of tackling lunch at school so she can go beyond 12.05pm....
Transpires CAMHS have managed not to have a single member of DDs team available this week, her first post discharge. Good going! Were told last wk her KW wld call today and arrange wkly obs etc but nope, she's on leave all week... IP unit clearly unhappy about it, said they wouldnt have discharged her last wk had they known. How hard is it to know these things???????
@Valleyofthedollymix congrats on the 300! Good going with school in too...hope it continues.
@Lotts @ any brainwaves on the caravan front? Tricky when it's all open plan...think Id probably try and take as many meals with me( frozen if becc) as poss so minimum to do there..?

Lil zoo had check with g.p today ahead ED clinic on thursday.shouldve been Friday really as was ment be interim.shes still having dizzy spells.has maintained in 3weeks since there which maybe down to seemingly eating loads over weekend,and fact lays in bed editing whenever not in school!grateful tho
Roolet hope you feel better soon

DD1 has done well today. Her mood definitely dips in the afternoon now, but she's eaten when asked. Clinic with the Psychiatrist tomorrow.

Fab gain valley well done.

Could it be thrush roo? You can get it in your mouth and it's very sore. That's crap of Camhs 😡

My day has been busy, dd has another urine infection (3rd in two months) she had a complete meltdown overnight as was in pain with it. More antibiotics prescribed today and waiting for the Gp to decide what to do with her. So was dealing with that snd working which was fun 😕

@Girliefriendlikespuppies .poor DD, that's not fun..for either of you. Hope it resolves really soon...
Not sure it's thrush, had a look and not as white as the ( lovely!) images I've seen. Thinking maybe canker?? B painful tho!
@still glad she's maintained; not long now until your app't.

roo hope you feel better soon - our CAMHS have had loads of people on leave, am guessing it is before end of March and people may have been limited taking leave at other points in the year due to staffing being off due to Covid? Would make more sense if they just rolled this annual leave year and next in to a two year period....

Poor DD girlie I hope the GP comes up trumps quickly - and has a think about frequency..

lougle - hope session tomorrow goes okay, is olanzapine a long term drug? DD took promethazine to help with her anxiety, which also made her sleepy but she's been taken off it now as only a short term option..

still maintenance is great news as is yours valley

Yesterday we had a massive meltdown - all around body image, she was self harming, distraught, voicing suicidal thoughts, lasted hours. We rang CAMHS crisis and they said to take her into their base which we did. After an hour with them, DD was okay to come home and she's done okay today - she had a 1-1 with her lead support nurse which went well.

Tomorrow we have our first meeting with adult team lead who'll be picking us up. CAMHS and adults are going to work in tandem for all of April but with CAMHS stepping down in stages. Not entirely sure what to expect tomorrow - will be a bit like starting all over again with background, telling our story afresh. And we have our last CPA with CAMHS on DD's birthday - happy birthday love!

@Girliefriendlikespuppies poor DD. Would she drink cranberry juice? It's not very sweet.

@Roolet12 your mouth sounds painful. My Mum gets a sore mouth and uses apple cider vinegar which seems to sort it. Perhaps your pharmacist could help.

@myrtleWilson what a rollercoaster. Re. olanzapine yes, I think it can be taken long term.

DD1 only managed half of tea tonight. Sore tummy, feeling sick, feeling scared again. The olanzapine wears off and the eating becomes hard again. Still, 2675 calories today, so happy with that.

My brother has been taking olanzapine for 15 years....so it can be v long term!
Glad you DD is feeling more settled today @myrtleWilson hope tomorrow goes well and for you @lougle
Nothing worse than a sore mouth or indeed a urine infection.... unmumsnetty hugs all round...
Weigh in here tomorrow. I upped the ante this week on snacks so hoping for a Goan but who knows...

@myrtleWilson sounds like you had a b tough day yesterday...glad today calmer. She's been doing so well challenging things, guess it's never a straight line up tho'. Hope the new team seem effective.

@Lottsbiffandsmudge and anyone else with weigh-ins...🤞🤞

@Lougle thnks for the mum tip! If I'm feeling brave might try it. Spent over an hour trying to eat tea this eve - slightly ironic.

400g gain today now at 92%wfh. I am a little deflated as I am getting 3100 cals a day in... at least I hope so... about 15% of that is the snack at school....
3 weeks off school coming up to try to get our increases a bit higher. I said to my DH that this just reinforces that we cannot allow ANY extra exercise regardless of how ‘gentle’. I think he got the message and I will not be allowing yoga on `Friday.
All her footie is back next week. It gives 3 weeks to see if she can manage it calorie wise before trying to do both school and football....

It seems such a lot of effort, doesn't it @Lottsbiffandsmudge, but you've managed a gain while attending school, which is great. I guess we shouldn't be surprised that it takes so much effort to gain, because it takes so much effort for overweight people to lose, but it still feels like it's disproportionately hard.

We have clinic today, and despite getting good calories into her from Thursday onwards, we average 2327 for the week, so I'm preparing myself for a small gain rather than a good gain.

DH was up all night last night and I was up most of it - he managed to get something in his eye when he was working in the garage. I could see something was clearly there, but I couldn't get to it and DH finds that sort of thing really difficult. He went to A&E and they managed to remove two tiny metal fragments. By the time he waited for a prescription and went to the pharmacy, he got home at 6am. He then went to work at 6:45, the wally. I woke up with a migraine again, which is no surprise.

400g is amazing @Lottsbiffandsmudge - I'd be very pleased with that. If dd continues with her current rate of gain (100g over three weeks!) it'll take her about 4 years to get to 90% wfh.

What wfh are you aiming at? I know I've said this before but I find the idea of a fixed percentage a bit weird as it doesn't seem to take into account of different body types. A friend dug out something in the Lancet that showed that the mean BMI of girls and adolescents has gone by one since the seventies. In other words, DD would be a far higher WFH back then than now.

@Lougle crossed posts, but omg how disturbing. I'm wincing at the thought of metal bits in the eye.

Ouch @lougle DH....hope your head improves too... I get migraines and they are awful I hope you get that Goan your DD (and you) have been working’ so hard on it.
@Valleyofthedollymix I know it is ‘good’ but we were far 650g a week... 2 weeks of school have seen 600g in total. I hate not knowing what she is up to.
I spoke to her KW yest and she said I will know when DD gets where she needs to be as her mind will free up. We aren’t there yet she freaked out yest about the caravan trip t]ranting about take away sand unhealthy eating because ‘that’s what we always do on holiday’ err yes it a a holiday....so clearly not anywhere near free in her head of AN thoughts. Plus at her age she needs to gain 5kg a year so around 400g a month just to stay ‘on curve’ so she will need to gain.
I think my aim is to over shoot, I need her periods to start, some growth and a freeing of her mind. Her rigidity around food and exercise is so limiting for her.
I said yest that at some point she needs to tackle take aways and eating out as that is what normal people do. And she will miss out as she gets older if she can’t eat off plan. I am hoping to arrange a picnic for her friends in the hols as thinking that may start the ball rolling.

@Valleyofthedollymix

400g is amazing *@Lottsbiffandsmudge* - I'd be very pleased with that. If dd continues with her current rate of gain (100g over three weeks!) it'll take her about 4 years to get to 90% wfh.

What wfh are you aiming at? I know I've said this before but I find the idea of a fixed percentage a bit weird as it doesn't seem to take into account of different body types. A friend dug out something in the Lancet that showed that the mean BMI of girls and adolescents has gone by one since the seventies. In other words, DD would be a far higher WFH back then than now.

Your friend is right that your DD would have been a far higher WFH back then, but that's because of a range of factors. The old UK 1990 charts were based on 'how children were growing' - they gathered data from lots of children, regardless of their circumstances, and plotted the data to get ranges. So children who were overfed, children with the right nutrition, children who were underfed, children who were neglected, etc.

The UK-WHO charts were based on data gathered only from babies who were being fed 'optimally' in stable environments. They were deemed a measure of how children 'should' grow. So the new growth charts are more about the ideal, rather than actual society.

Everything I've read shows that WFH is problematic. Eva Musby does a great piece on it. Generally, WFH doesn't take into account growth stunting or the child's pre-ED growth centiles.

@lougle.....ouch your poor DH and poor you for having such a sleep deprived night. Hope he's on the mend soon. And good luck for your appt later.
That's interesting re the shift in BMI charts....you certainly seem to know your stuff!
I remember reading that improvement in A.N cognitions lags physical recovery by about 9-12 months. So not entirely sure how you can know when the ideal WFH is reached given you're not expecting to see any significant shift in thinking until then???

@Lottsbiffandsmudge our DD is currently 93% and as you describe, is v far off ever being able to eat stuff spontaneously or not "justify" her eating with exercise. I think it really does take time. But well done on your 400g - that's bloody good. We were only managing that level during a mix of IP and home leave! Maybe the footie will lift spirits and spur DD on with her intake. 🤞
Ours wants to restart her footie too end of nxt wk so will def be using that as leverage.

@Girliefriendlikespuppies good call on the thrush! GP thinks might well be - apparently more common in elderly peep with dry mouths (?!) - prescribing anti fungal drops. Said to get plenty of rest too. ....ha ha.

HI All, i've just been digesting everything here and at home so not in the space to post.

It is so incredibly draining on everyone in the family. all I am able to focus on is getting the meal eaten then trying to think of how I'll encourage the snack and on and on we go..... DD is really not into it yet at all her AN brain is so strong, she really believes that everyone around her is making up the problem and that she is fine . It's the same conversations numerous times a day and she feels she's too fat to leave the house as people will look at her .
There is so much that parent need to be able to do at home to tackle this awful illness, it's relentless
DD wants to go back to school in April, at this point I think she's closer to going into hospital than school

Nothing seems to work and I think we all feel quite alone in the house and the battle........ I wish there was a magic cure.

Roolet12 that's quite deflating that cognitive changes happen 9-12 months after weight restoration. But it is positive that it does happen, I have been so worried that she will stay like she is. The sooner we get weight on the sooner and more likely a full recovery - is that right?

What do you all do to stay sane while completely focused on beating this illness with your children?

Thanks @lougle that's really interesting. I didn't know if weight charts took account of all the extremes at the upper end which would obviously skew the mean.

Eva Musby does talk about it but only in terms of aiming to 'overshoot' it, not in cases of undershooting it. And I don't want to talk about it with the therapist as it makes me sound a bit disordered myself - like I want to keep her thin, which I absolutely do not, I just don't want her to have to put on more weight than she necessarily needs to.

In some ways, she's not too bad - she eats takeaways, we've been out and had to just grab lunch from wherever we can without planning, she can eat in front of others. But in other ways, I can absolutely see the disordered thinking - rigid rules about portions of fruit and veg, how many 'unhealthy' things she's allowed in a day, feeling bloated etc. So much crap from Tiktok - some guy saying eating past feeling full is the definition of greed.