Not married - house and children

[CoffeeloverNo1]

My ex left over a year ago without warning. Children now 12 and 9. We own the house jointly and equally. We also jointly own a 2 bed flat purchased a few years ago which we rented out but he know lives in.

children remain with me full time and don’t want to stay overnight with him. They do still see him regularly each week though after school and during the day on one weekend day each week.

he wants his share of equity which is approx £140k but I’ve spoke to mortgage advisor and been advised that a sole mortgage for me, max I could borrow means I can only give him £90k. He is saying that’s not good enough and won’t be able to get him a house for him and the kids. He has £50k in savings and earns £80 a year. I just increased hours to full time so I now earn £35k a year.

what I want some advice on is if it went to court and we couldn’t agree between us, what’s the likelihood I’ll be forced to sell. Or do I have any rights to stay there until children are adults? I receive DLA for one and the others is with CAMHS because of the trauma this has caused and him leaving suddenly. Thanks

What’s your share of equity in the flat?

No you have no right to stay in the property I’m afraid.

does he still pay share of mortgage? Has he taken into account the loss of income from not being able to rent out the flat he’s living in which is half-yours? You should work out how much you’ve lost as a result - he owes you it.

Yes - but I think you can also force him to sell the flat so all assets are liquidated and pooled.

You aren't married so you have no rights.

If you are 50/50 on both the flat and house then what is the actual amount you need to buy him out for the house and for him to buy you out from the flat?

You can claim CMS for the children.

@lllamaDrama (not all assets as they're unmarried, only the property OP is on the deeds to.)

No, you don’t have any right to stay in house until DC are 18, unless he agrees, but you should get proper legal advice, his savings, earnings and pension, I doubt will be included in any share out as you are not married. Otherwise it will be a case of selling both homes and splitting 50/50 and you getting maintenance.

The only thing you’re entitled to ( as is he) is the share of equity on properties held. As you own as joint tenants he’s entitled to 50% if any equities, as are you. Neither can force the other out and both of you have rights to reside in either property, You have no claim on any other assets held in his sole name, inc pension and no automatic right to remain until children are 18

that said, there are measures a court could take to allow you to remain in the house- under sch 1 of children’s act and to force a sale tolata 1996 would be used

in which case a judge would look at the values involved, whether children could be housed adequately elsewhere, the needs of ex and their requirements to equity

ultimately nothing is automatic

assuming you are in England /wales

He has a two bed flat why does he need a house for children who don’t want to stay over with him? Ask him would he rather his kids were uprooted for his want for a house?

What is your share of the equity in the flat? Because I’d subtract that from his share of the equity in the house and then pay the difference. He gets the flat, you get the house.

You aren't married so you have no rights
This is actually not completely true. Even unmarried, you could make an application to the family court under section 1, ie. the needs of the kids.

You would gave to evidence that your children absolutely need to stay in that house or that you otherwise couldn't house them appropriately if you sold. That is likely to include not being able to afford to rent adequate housing.

It is likely to be an expensive procedure so you would need to be very confident that a judge would support your application.

That is more probable where one is a sahp and the other is a high earner however on this occasion there are two owned properties and op is earning. Don't give a drowning woman false hope.

Although I was married, I got the house in entirety due to giving up my career to care for my SEN son and didn’t have to downsize as the house had been adapted to my sons needs (open plan downstairs to keep an eye on him) my ex (high income) got £10k

This is not entirely true.

The children have rights which would supersede her exes need to release his equity. But that would only apply if there was no means to house them following the sale of the house in the local area.

Unfortunately if there is some decent equity in the home that allowed the OP to rent then that would be a housing option. It would also eat her equity.

OP please look at ways to maximise your income especially through benefits and child support. Then reassess your mortgage limits.

we both are joint and equal on this too. Although I am prepared to let him just have it and sign it over. There is only about £8k in total equity anyway as it’s an interest only mortgage. We also borrow the deposit for the flat and have only paid off £8k of that loan. (Hence the £8 equity)

@houseofisms Being married and needs of dc would make a huge difference. In many divorces the family house IS sold.

Here, you would expect the two properties to be sold and each partner takes their 50% share. They can then both get something else. This is what not being married means. You take what is yours but you don’t get extra. Also it’s reasonable for dad to want space for dc and the op should have realised the dangers of not being married but no ex is entitled to a family house on the cheap and many family houses are sold. Clean break divorces mean all finances are sorted immediately - no hanging on until dc are 18.

I’ve already told him that I’ve had a conversation with the kids and they really done want to move out of their family home. It’s affected them so badly and I really feel that this will just be another thing they don’t need. He is just focused on what he wants from it and it to be ‘fair’. Love to remind him that walking out of our lives after 18 years is not fair, messaging other women is not fair. What he’s done to my and the kids and our family is not fair,

Sorry are you joint tenants or tenants in common with equal shares? This is not the same.

You could apply to stay in the house until the youngest is 18, could work given they are in receipt of DLA. This might be a family court matter though.

He pays half the mortgage currently as in a cheap fixed rate. I also pay half the flat mortgage and half the loan for the flat deposit . He also pays child maintenance.

You are not married. You will have to sell and split the equity in the properties. Can your share of the rental help you to afford to buy out his 50% in the house? Any court proceedings can only order your legal share. It is unlikely you would get an order to stay under the Children's Act when there are 2 properties.

(I won't go down the route of why has yet another woman had kids with a man without the protection marriage brings them financially especially when is able to then earner higher than the other because I am sure you already realise how different the outcome would be if you were married).

He hasn’t walked out of his children’s lives after 18 years - and talking to the children about whether they want to stay at his house or not, or live somewhere else is not a great idea. They sound like they’re suffering because of this split, but the solution is not to stop seeing their father, rather to help their relationship with him to rebuild. They may well not want to sleep over because it’s a 2 bed flat. They may not want to sleep over because they’re afraid it will upset you. In my experience, children tell each parent what they think that parent wants to hear. They may well be longing for the pair of you to get back together - that’s what most kids really want.
Id advise you to stop asking them what they want to do, try to help them build their relationship with their father and seek legal advice about the properties. Both parents should put the children first.

@LittleGreenDragons, I gave no false hope. I made it clear that if she could afford to rent, her chances were low.

It's however important to challenge wrong legal information such as what you posted. Lemon, our expert solicitors confirmed the exact information I wrote. If it doesn't help OP, it might help readers.

What he’s done to my and the kids and our family is not fair
What is deemed emotially unfair is very different to what is deemed legally fair.

You are being unfair to your children if you are telling them their life is going to be unpleasant and it is all their dad's fault. Children have to adapt to new homes and schools every day, often due to no fault of either parents.

Your children will adjust well if you show them all the reasons why it will be fine rather then getting them to hate their dad for having to move home.

In the kids eyes yes he did walk out on them actually. There was no build up, arguments or arguing and he just decided one day he couldn’t do it anymore. With all due respect you don’t know what I’ve been through with my kids and how they have been affected by him leaving. I do not ask my children where they want to live. Their home is with me and they can see their dad as much as they would like and have never stopped that. If he was a more present dad and didn’t spend all of his time away from the family doing his own hobbies, then they might have had a better relationship with him and want to sleep over. Again their choice with what they feel comfortable. I am not stopping them from building a relationship with their dad at all. Far from it. I spoke to the kids about we might have to potentially move to see how they felf initially about it. They don’t know the ins and outs of it all. They are kids and they don’t need to be part of the shit show that goes on in the background. I put my kids first every single time and always have.

I have not told my children that life is going to be unpleasant at all. Neither have I blamed their dad for it. Where do you get that from?

I came on her for advice about the hose situation and again putting my kids first and want as least disrupting as possible. You don’t know my ex or how he was when we were a family either. Even after everything he has done (which the kids know nothing about I’ll add) , I know it’s important for them to have a good relationship with them. He sees the kids more now infact than when he lived with us.

Unfortunately as unmarried, you’re going to have little choice but to sell. I know it can feel unfair, it was for me, as I had full custody and had to rent whilst my ex ended up selling the family house and buying a 5 bed house, which largely sat empty. Only now 15yrs later I am buying again now DC are 18 plus as I can move to a cheaper area. DC have remained close to their dad, and we all get along. At the end of the day, what was important to me was their happiness and living in rentals didn’t impact that. Being unmarried does put you at a disadvantage unfortunately, and whilst it can feel unfair, the law says you own 50:50 and legally he is entitled to that. Morally, well that’s another matter.

Is the house currently mortgage free? If so, you’re not crazy far apart.

If you start by selling the flat then he gets your equity from that - £8k.

Then you no longer have the deposit loan or mortgage on the flat so that should improve your affordability for mortgage by an equivalent amount. Unless you have other significant loans or mortgages at that point you should easily be able at that point to borrow 4 times salary which would give him the rest of his share of the equity.

Even if the house currently has an existing mortgage which you need to take over, you can probably get what you need from a specialist broker once the flat is sold, because the house equity is high.