Can my niece willingly walk away with nothing?

[happyless]

My niece is a free spirit and doesn't always think of the potential future impact. She has decided she wants a divorce (she has her reasons) and her husband has agreed on the following conditions:

50/50 custody of their 5 year old.
She signs the house over and he stays in it (90k equity).

She's going to need UC to pay her rent on a flat as she only works 20 hours p/w in retail and no savings.

She is going to apply for the divorce herself with no solicitor involvement.

Will this be allowed to happen? I'm really worried for her.

Just to clarify, all divorces are no fault now and you apply online. There’s absolutely no need for a solicitor to do the divorce part, it’s absolutely idiot proof. If he doesn’t agree it will happen anyway.

Separate to the divorce are financial
orders and child arrangements. A solicitor needs to write up those. If you agree then it is cheap to do, but a judge needs to agree it is fair. If you can’t agree it gets expensive very quickly.

Ours was amicable and only cost about £1400 all in, ex waived his entitlement to my pensions and my BTL but we split all debts, savings and marital home 50/50 and that was signed off. We also agreed 50/50 shared custody so no
maintenance payable.
But crucially we were both able to be suitably housed and did not need any benefits. Judge’s don’t like one party having all the assets if the other is dependent on the state. It’s designed to stop one party leaving with nothing.But it absolutely does not mean everything is automatically 50/50 which mumsnet always says either.

Why is she signing the house over? There’s free spirit and then there’s stupid!!

I did this. I had to sign a letter stating that I was going against legal advice. I had two young kids too. It was a continuation of the unhealthy dynamic in my marriage, and it was a huge mistake.

the Judge can intervene (not sign), especially as a child involved, however he also may sign it off.
I was advised if children or assets (ie house) a solicitor must be involved for protection for all, I think is more a moral advice, I am sure I have known people who were sensible and agreed a fair split and did themselves.
I wonder if there is an element of guilt that she is signing it all away? In time she may reflect on this decision that is was a poor choice.

That’s classed as deprivation of capital. She’d be literally giving 45k away and expecting the government to support her. You can’t claim UC if you have 16+. She can either give her money away and support herself or live on her money until she’s under 16k and then claim. But she can’t waste it or give it away.

ExH and I separated amicably. He was by far the biggest earner, 6 times my wage. I worked part time to look after DC. Basically I could not afford to run the family home on my earnings even though I then started working full time. I signed the house over to him but took some of the equity, just enough for a small deposit on a small house, mortgage for the rest. Children with me 90% of the time as they were old enough to decide. ExH pays child maintenance that we agreed between us, not the full amount on the calculator but just enough, and yes I could have got more. I don’t have much pension either and could have gone to court for much more but decided that us remaining amicable was far more important. All signed off by the judge, no questions asked.
In this case I would be worried that a 50/50 custody will mean that her ex will not have to pay any child maintenance at all and it sounds like she may struggle. It’s not easy to find jobs at the moment either. It’s not all rosy after divorce

She doesn't want the equity because it'll affect her benefits.

They can agree to split equity on sale in the future, it doesn't need to be split now.

I'd strongly recommend she speaks to a solicitor she may get legal aid but even if it costs £ it will save her losing £'s.

She should not walk away from this man with nothing. How crass of him to even think that's OK.

She sounds like she’s living in a dream world. Renting a flat with her twenty hours a week job and living off the dole like it’s the 90s

Giving away 45 thousand pounds so she can get some benefits.

The kind she wants to divorce. 🤮

This!

Is she being financially/emotionally abused? This sounds like madness. Can you show her this thread?

My brother and his ex divorced and the financial order is still not agreed. He was the main carer for their two children and now has 50/50. The judge is refusing to sign off on the financial order (even though my brother signed it) unless my brother is given a substantial sum of money in lieu of pension. Been to court five times and even though she submitted the financial order she keeps not turning up as a way of getting out of paying him - court are now going to make an order to make her pay.

Does she have a solicitor? If she does and a solicitor has advised her and she’s ignoring it, they’ll have her sign a declaration of understanding her position and the judge most likely won’t do anything in contradiction.

if you’re confused and concerned you need to speak to her about it and find out why she’s taking this position

It’s unlikely the judge will allow one party to walk away with zero.

For it to be amicable and fair, everything has to be 50/50 and done properly to safeguard everyone’s best interests. What father would want his child to potentially grow up in poverty if his mum can’t get a decent wage?

You’re right to worry,

No judge is going to sign that off.

was most of that equity his from inheritance or family or his own savings? That’s the only way it’s fair to let him keep most (not all) of it. She could get her 45k and use that for deposit or a share on a shared ownership flat and she could get universal credit to top up the rent if needed

A judge will only be involved if they involve them though won’t they? No fault divorce is all done online. I did not use a solicitor for mine as there was not a financial need. Yes uc will want past bank statements and they go through everything, debit debits, payments etc. She can’t just walk away hoping uc will pay her benefits. It’s hard if she is part time as she can’t buy anywhere on a part time wage I’m guessing. Hence wanting to rent? But this could backfire massively. She needs to work more hours to make this work and to take her money!

A judge will only be involved if they involve them though won’t they?

to get a divorce it has to be stamped by a judge

a judge has to stamp the paper work and can refuse, has been done before where a divorce is one sided

Have no idea on the divorce as never been married.
but where her work is concerned saying she needs to get more hours it isn’t always possible, my partner works part time in retail they always say they don’t have extra hours to give contracted they prefer to have part time staff more staff means more people can cover if someone is off. So she’d have to look for a second job elsewhere unless they were willing to offer more contracted hours.
Also to note she could still take 50% of equity and when her 45k has run out (has to be spent on essentials only not luxuries as UC will check bank statements to see where the money went) then she will be allowed benefits towards her rent.
Also UC works by an earning threshold not hours. She needs to earn above £952 per month as a single person and she will be in light tough meaning no appointments or meetings at the job centre. Me and my partner earn over the threshold of £1534 as we are a couple.

she wants a divorce (she has her reasons) and her husband has agreed on the following conditions:

But she doesn’t need his agreement to divorce. He doesn’t get to set ‘conditions’.

She can divorce whether he likes it or not, and then they negotiate.

With regards to simply just claiming UC for rent on a flat - how old is your niece? If under 35, she may only be entitled to the minimum shared accommodation rate for a single person, so needs to check the LHA rates in her area (easy Google search) - & on UC only one person can be the 'main carer' of the child. And due to the already mentioned issues of possible deprivation of capital she may not be entitled to any UC at all. This would be sent to a Decision Maker, and may not come back in her favour. They will ask lots of questions / ask for proof etc. as to why she didn't take her share of any equity.
Likely to also have to attend regular (possibly weekly) Jobcentre appointments if just working 20 hpw - will be expected to be looking for 35 hpw, depending on current salary.
She needs to take all this into account before rushing into 'free spirit' decisions. It just isn't that easy.
With kindness, I am not saying that she has to stay in an unhappy relationship, but she needs to get real legal advice before rushing in & assuming that UC will pick up the bill for her accommodation.

no it wont work its depravation of assets and you cant just live off uc for rent they rarely pay enough to cover it

she needs to get advice and get half the quity and live off that

As someone else has pointed out, she’s not going to be allowed to give her portion of the house away to claim benefits.

She needs legal advice.

@happyless could you or another family member afford to pay for her to have a session with a divorce lawyer? She likely can’t afford it herself, but if a family member could pay for her to have a small amount of initial legal advice, she might see sense.