Child arrangements & not agreeing to 50/50

[MrsResilient]

How have most people finalised child arrangements during a divorce/ separation?
(They cheated/ some emotional abuse)
Wanting to avoid solicitors & do it ourselves due to no funds. Don’t own a house or have assetts. Divorce is being filed very soon. Soon to be ex is wanting 50/50 of our 2 children (age 6/10) but I don’t agree. I feel this is due to avoiding any contributions whatsoever & had been communicated abruptly in a conversation previously.
They looking for alternative property.
Happy for children staying eg 3 days (alternate weekend & 1/2 days) but want & need help with keeping existing home & to manage keep them settled/ secure/ happy.
Anyone else been through anything similar?
Thankyou

I think you will need to see a solicitor, my ex was not listening to anything I said until the legal position was explained to him. Then his wish for 50/50 disappeared as it wasn't financially viable.

Needing him to contribute isn't a good enough reason.

50/50 is generally the starting point. Why don’t you want him having 50/50 - is it so you can claim CMS?

Assuming he didn’t do 50:50 currently so he’ll have zero idea of what is actually involved, do a spreadsheet for the year showing who will have them when, split up birthdays/Christmases/Father’s & mother’s Day/school holidays then go on to propose how you deal with when the DC are ill (take turns in being off work etc), same for doctors, dentist, haircuts etc. Go on to cover if he’s going to have a full set of clothes at his including school uniform and what he’s going to do for after school care, how you split costs for school clubs, lunches, trips etc. Maybe include what you think should happen if either of you is ill or wants to swap weekends etc.

Once he sees what is actually involved in doing HALF the parent (and that’s an actual half not a half-assed bloke half) his wish to do 50:50 may change 😬

Exactly! Mine wanted 50/50 but we agreed on 28/72 which even then was me pushing him to have more time. He has no interest in actual parenting, like school dinners, uniform, playdates, parties. Just like he was before. I don't know why either of us thought that would be different post split.

OP, has your stbx realised that 50:50 means he will need to do early mornings and school runs with his dcs, then collect from school at 3pm or arrange after school club.

He will need to do school uniforms, meals and homework. He will need to take days off when his dcs are ill, collect them mid day if they are poorly, and will need to manage summer holidays. He will not be able to travel with his job. Perhaps you should make all that clear

My ex wanted 50:50 until I left ds, aged 2, with him for a long weekend. It placed such a restriction on his way of life, and he was so disgusted with nappies & feeding, he never mentioned 50:50 again and now only sees ds 6 hours a week.

What would your thoughts be if he stayed in the property instead?

I don't think you needing money to stay in the house you're in is a good enough reason to not want him to have his kids 50/50 (if that's what he genuinely wants).

You just reminded me, mine wanted 50/50 but could I pick them up from school and keep them at my house until he finished work on his collection days?! What?! Dream world.

Reading your message I find myself in the same position my Ex wanted our 3 boys 50/50. Untill he decided to persuade the middle child who is on the autistic spectrum to go and live with him. I came home from work to find that he totally emptied his bedroom there wasn't even a pair of socks left. It was a Saturday. I was absolutely devastated and beside myself as there was no conversation whatsoever about it. I was furious and heart broken, but decided to take a placid approach. ( He had never been around at all for the boys growing up, because he was supposedly working, but he wasn't I found out he was a complusive gambler 2 months after we were married and 3 kids later) All I can tell you is that he didn't even last the week. He was asking me to pick our son up from school. Bearing in mind that our eldest son also attended the same school who was a year older. He expected me to drop one kid off at his, and take the other one home with me. Or bring them both home to mine. Feed all 3 of the boys. Then he comes to collect the one he took after he finishes work. (They are all his kids. He favours one against the other and it certainly shows) My boys aren't little anymore thankfully they are 17, 15, 13 he's welcome to their pubescent mood swings and constant bickering. My ex is absolutely clueless when it comes to parenting I just love it when he has all 3 of them at once. It's called payback. P S awaiting final order of divorce and counting down the days. Ex's will reape what they sow. You just have to be patient!

What’s the reason for him not having 50:60? It’s not good enough to simply say he didn’t do it before or that you want to stay in fmh ( can you afford to?)

there needs to be much better reasons why not

Yeah this.

You can’t refuse 50/50 just because you want money from him, and lots of parents don’t do exactly 50/50 when living together as a family because that’s really exactly the point of being a family.

He's their parent, he wants to see them just like you do. Why shouldn't he have them 50/50?

I would assume 50/50 would be a given. So many men aren't bothered about seeing their kids - surely you should be pleased for your kids that their Dad wants to see them as much as possible.

50/50 can work fine.

You are both parents to your children and they are the priority.

If you can, make the childcare arrangements the same regardless of which parent the child us staying with. This gives continuity and both parents before and after school care as needed.

My friend works hers as 50/50 over 12 days, 6 each so that this is smooth for the DC’s including weekends. Appears as a gradual shift rather than EOW etc.

Be strong for your kids, downsizing is not the end of the world being happy and having your kids with you is all that matters. It's hard And stressful but you will come through it. Ex's have a way of dodging the financial bullet when it comes to responsibility its like trying to get blood out of a stone. Seek legal advice there's a few on line sites that can offer free advice regarding these matters.

Why is everyone creating the narrative that OP wants the kids more due to wanting money off her ex?!

She has said that she feels he only wnats 50/50 for him to avoid contributions. Which, please correct me if I'm wrong OP, means that he only wnats the to avoid paying her any CMS. I can't understand the crappy responses towards the OP. How many people on her have been through separation?!

It's so much easier just saying, oh agree to 50/50, it's the default, it's what's best.
Actually no. 50/50 isn't always what's best, especially if the other parent only wants them to avoid paying cms. Which BTW is so unbelievably common. I know SO many (sadly) dads, including my own children's, who have threatened court etc to take the children 50/50 to avoid paying cms. And then the mum AND children loose out on time with eachother just for them to spend time with someone who doesn't actually and honestly want them there.

Imagine being in a relationship which has shut down, outside do your control, and then processing also loosing your children half the week. Honestly MN can be a great place sometimes, but the flippant comments and narrative on here is just so insensitive and potentially damaging. And that's why I wonder, who has actually been in this situation?

Anyway, rant over.

OP, if you don't think 50/50 is what is best for your children then you don't have to agree to it. Your children are a little bit older, they have opinions and comforts too. What do you think they would want?
If your ex continues to argue this you'll likely need to consider mediation and court.

Stay strong ❤️

People are rightly picking up on that because OP has literally said herself thats a reason she doesn’t want 50/50: “want & need help with keeping existing home”

@autumngirl714 imagine being a dad who contributes to family life by working and bringing in income, for wife to then want to split and take your home, and children for more than half the time and make you v much a part time dad. Why is it ok to assume dad’s only want 50:50 for financial reasons but not mum’s and op

50:50 may not be appropriate for everyone. But it can be. And simply because mum doesn’t want it or wants money /home is not an acceptable reason.

if op can’t manage the home she’s in she’ll need to downsize and up income.

if he wants 50:50 and can demonstrate it’s achievable, most likely he’d get it, as he should

OP I would approach it from the point of view of what 50/50 would look like for him, and for the children.

That on his days he would be 100% responsible. All the childcare arrangements, all the parenting, all the admin, all the time juggling, cooking, cleaning, appointments, providing uniform and clothes and keeping them clean and well fitting, giving them quality attention, ferrying them to clubs, leaving work for a child with D&V and nursing them at home and all the clean up, etc. Make it clear you'd be doing none of that on "his" 50/50 time.

Are you having mediation sessions? If not I'd offer some so you can discuss this with a third party and have it all set out and try to come to an agreement. He needs to see the reality of it and know you wouldn't be picking up the slack on his days.

I would advise you not to do alternate weeks, but to have set days at handover times because you can then be very clear about which days and times you would both have to pay for childcare for example, or be on call for an ill child. Also makes childcare costs and arrangements easier to sort when you have set days rather than 1 week on, 1 off where you'd both have to agree on childcare and pay half each - I've seen exes not pay their half for example of decide they aren't happy with the childcare etc, it can be used as a tool to control or make things complicated.

The house and the maintenance etc, I would keep that very separate for now from the discussions about contact. The conversation about contact should be focused on what can he actually do around his job, and what does he truly desire to want to do as a parent.

@millymollymoomoo that's a different scenario though isn't it. I've spoken from my own, and many of my friends, experience where the father has only wanted 50/50 to avoid CMS.
That is what I'm referring to. Not what you have just said.

Op has said that the relationship ended due to adultery and emotional abuse. That's not what you've described. Op also said dad wants child to avoid contribution. Again, not the scenario you've painted.

OP mentioned the money twice in her post. That’s why posters are “creating the narrative” that she wants to safeguard her CMS claim.

Undoubtedly she’s upset that she won’t see her children every day but that wasn’t mentioned. Her primary drivers are money and anger towards her ex.

What will matter in mediation and if this gets to court is whether both of you can demonstrate that you can adequately parent. That is, ensure they are fed, supervised when in your care, have access to medical care and you can get them to and from school. As long as there is no deficit in your parenting and no risk of harm, differences in parenting won’t be relevant to the outcome in court.

Speculation on either side isn’t relevant nor is personal opinion. Both will hamper your ability to reach agreement out of court and neither will be considered in court. A judge isn’t interested in listening to your opinion or speculation if it has no relevance and isn’t factual or evidence based. They are family court judges. They have access to accepted evidence on the merits of co parenting and what it means for their decision making.

If during medication he demonstrates he can parent sufficiently then you should agree to this. Asking a 6 year old and 10 year olds opinion on the matter isn’t necessary in this case. They are too young and it would cause unnecessary upset for them when it won’t change the outcome.

The things you and he can object to are not being able to show you can get them to and from school; not having routine childcare if you work during the time they are with you, never being present during your time and overuse of childcare, not being able to feed or look after their health.

The mediation should really focus on things that practically make life easier for them. Number one is you don’t have a needless and avoidable battle over this. After that it is mundane things. It’s better to have one consistent form of childcare if you both work. And that there is a back up option that can be called upon. You need to be sharing the likely need for dealing with their sickness and health needs because this impacts on your work and social life. Think about their social life and how this can be supported. What about schools holidays and organising childcare during that time.

These practical and logistical issues can reshape both of your thinking on how much support and cooperationyou need from each other. The other parent is a resource that means you can be a good parent and have a career and an adult life.

@StormingNorman the OP mentions the contributions once when they explain that they suspect their partner wants 50 50 to avoid contribution's and then later says " but want & need help with keeping existing home & to manage keep them settled/ secure/ happy".

I don't read this that she wants the children more so he pays for their lifestyle. I read that that she needs support with that?

Like I said, correct me if I'm wrong OP. That is my interpretation of your post.

I read it that’s worried about not getting CMS if they have a 50:50 split.