Anyone awake for a hand hold?

[anothernamechangess]

DH and I are in the midst of a rough patch. Two kids 2 and 3, and he is grieving for a close family member who died almost a year ago in tragic circumstances.

We've been arguing a lot, a huge one tonight and he's yet again threatened divorce. He threatens it a lot and has not yet done it. Every time he threatens it I go through this rollercoaster again - even know I know realistically he will calm down tomorrow and (hopefully) things will be ok.

We have had therapy, but I think we need to go back to keep working on our communication.

I'm an anxious attachment type so this is awful for me, he's gone to bed in another room and refusing to talk to me. I asked him if we would be ok and he said he didn't know any more.

Any tips on how to sleep tonight and not have a panic attack would be great 😟

My abusive ExH left when the DCs were 14wks, 2 and 6. It's honestly the biggest favour he ever did me. At first I thought I wouldn't survive without him. Instead I thrived emotionally. I no longer walked on eggshells, my sense of self-worth increased and I eventually felt worthy of love again.

Do you think that it's maybe him and his behaviour making you feel so overwhelmed?

OP, this sounds really tough.

When you have got your thoughts together, it might be worth talking to a solicitor about what a divorce would mean for you and the family. It probably isn’t as bad as you fear. And remember, you can also apply for a divorce. It’s an online form and the only thing you need is your wedding certificate.

Yes it is emotional abuse.

If it's genuinely how he felt, he'd have a rational discussion about it. He's not doing that though - he's using it as some sort of 'trump card' in an argument and then snoring sweetly as you feel your world is crashing down.

@ItsKaos wow, I can't believe you actually coped with three little ones including a tiny baby. I feel like I'd just fall apart.

The way he is is killing my confidence and I feel very sad most of the time currently. But I don't feel strong enough to do anything about it right now other than hope things improve and try my hardest

It’s emotional abuse. The best thing you can do is review the division of assets. With or without a lawyer. Set out what’s yours his and what a split really means financially and practically.

Hello OP, what a tough time you’re going through, I’m so sorry.

The thing with threatening divorce is that it’s such a strong statement, it usually implies you absolutely are going to consider it, that it’s highly likely. I can’t imagine a scenario in which someone who wasn’t emotionally abusive would threaten it to someone vulnerable and stressed, then ‘calm down’ and carry on, only to repeat again and again.

Certainly you couldn’t threaten it in an angry rage and then peacefully fall asleep snoring in the spare room whilst your partner sobbed next door. And then wake up as if nothing happened.

This leads me to think he is deliberately using this as a power over you. He is manipulating you into this panic and stress. You are wound up and upset, desperately trying to adjust your behaviour to meet his impossible standards, whilst he has this power over you.

This isn’t normal, or healthy. There is a fundamental problem with how he is treating you.

You cannot change him. He is showing you who he really is.

I would suggest some solo therapy and support. You can’t tackle your relationship until you are in a better place, look after yourself and your mental health. And then perhaps you will see your relationship and the way forward in a clearer light.

Having someone to talk to, someone to listen just to you, is absolutely transformative in my experience, it is a weight lifted.

I just wonder if you’d feel some relief knowing you could take some control over it all.
Do you have an Alexa? If you ask her to play spa music it’s quite nice :)

He is gaslighting you. In the morning I’d call women’s aid for advice.

Trust me you wont fall apart. Us ladies are far far stronger than we give ourselves credit for. Call his bluff, face that fear and tell him do it, but once it is done it wont be undone and you will push for that divorce and he can leave there and then and you will be claiming the house and maintenance from him. Plus he will take the kids every second weekend and on the other week 2 nights during that week.

My ex threatened to kill himself one night near the end of our marriage, well it was already over bar the boxing match in court lol, so I said do it, I dare you and when you screw it up like you have fucked up everything else in our marriage, I will tell your kids you didn't give a damn about them. And if you survive and are mentally or physically damaged you better hope your Mother likes wiping your shitty arse for the rest of both yours and her days cos I wont be caring for you. Yeah he is still alive years later and we are divorced. I saw red that night as my Father threatened the same for years and controlled us all with the I will kill myself threats

I thought I would too - but I didn't. He left in September and by the end of December I'd taken VR from my job, put the house on the market, was renting somewhere else in a different county and had got the eldest into a new school. I coped because I had to, and you can too. I was able to because I no longer had a man undermining my confidence and self worth every day. Not going to say it was a breeze because it wasn't.

You can do it too without this manchild constantly chipping away at your self confidence, with me it got to the point where I was almost paralysed by doubt in myself.

And the best thing - the year after he left I met someone amazing who truly loves and values me. We've been together 11 years now. And yes, like most other couples we argue sometimes, but it never gets personal, threatening or emotionally abusive.

When things are calmer hopefully tomorrow could you say, you've said you want a divorce a number of times now, it's really upsetting to hear this and it's not what I want but the next time you say it, we need to seriously talk about separating if that is what you want.

You're stronger than you think OP - you won't fall apart without him. You may even feel calmer and less stressed without the arguments and him holding the threat of divorce over your head. This is no way to live and can't continue 😕

For now, try to focus on the fact that you're safe at home right in this moment. Don't allow your thoughts to stray to worrying about the future and catastrophising. Find something to watch that is undemanding and relaxing and wrap yourself up in a cosy blanket. Make yourself a warm calming drink like a camomile or peppermint tea. Hopefully you will drift off to sleep eventually. You can try speaking to DH when things are calmer and tell him the effect his threat is having on your mental health. And I would go and see your GP too for help with anxiety/panic attacks, there are lots of resources out there 💐

I have been you. Twice. I look back now with the confidence I regained as soon as I managed to get out of these utterly destructive relationships. Why should HE be calling the shots. Why is HE controlling your emotions. If you need temporary emotional support ask your GP for short term Diazepam 5mg, or an anti anxiety SSRI like Sertraline. Sertraline was a game changer for me as I so emotionally level now I simply can't cry. Start tomorrow building your self esteem. Asking if 'we're alright' is never conducive to a stable, health relationship. Communication is key to every successful partnership-and mainly the ability to communicate following a difference of opinions or a row. Without doubt I'll be older than you - and the couples I know who have survived are a) respectful to one another even when in conflict - they may swear, but not name call or get personal and
b) their conflict resolution is healthy and they can apologise, forget and move on. Your DP sounds extremely cruel and emotionally immature.

I'd been told it but don't feel it all the time. Still have wobbles but not over him. I'm glad we're divorced and will be happy to never see him again.

Hope you’re asleep now OP and will feel stronger tomorrow.

Wrists down everything he does to support the child rearing, the house maintenance, the feeding of you all etc. Then you'll see what you actually need him for or what he brings to the family .

Dear OP, you are a stronger person than you think. It takes strength and self confidence to reach out for help. There are a lot of great women here to support you but you need to get real life help. See your gp and tell them what you are going through. Call Women's Aid for talking support and advice. And read about what emotional abuse is.

Please stop worrying about what your P thinks. He is only concerned for himself. Start focusing on you and taking care of yourself. You deserve to be loved and treated with respect.

Take your power back by not reacting to his behaviour. Stay calm, leave the room or take the children out of the house when he starts acting up.
And don't let him isolate you from friends or family. Get all the support you need .

This is why he does it. He knows you'll backdown and shut up and he'll get the outcome he wants. Now XH used this many years ago, the second time he said it and went on about how miserable he was in our marriage I told him, genuinely if you are that miserable and truly thing what you're saying we should get divorced. He back peddled fast. He may well be unhappy, but he's using this to get his way. I eventually told XH I was done, only thing I regret not doing it sooner. What exactly is he acusing you of with the nitpicking? XH liked to call me petty when I expected him to act like an adult and not leave his clothes and dishes and wet towels all over the place. There was a hell of a lot of other stuff going on but if he's said something like this he would have meant he thought I should pick up after him and he felt it was unfair for me to expect him to act like a fully functioning adult.

Do you think this is his way of making you so miserable you end it because then he won’t be the bad guy. I think that’s what my exH did. He didn’t have the balls to do it himself so just constantly had a go at me. I made a lot of excuses for him that it was his mental health etc it wasn’t, he was just done and too cowardly to admit it especially with dc involved. It took me a long time to get to the point I ended it and I didn’t really see the behaviour for what it was until after.

I imagine the circumstances of the bereavement must have been traumatic.

Has he made any attempt to deal with his grief, in any way other than by wallowing in it?

Failing to access therapy to help himself work through it and move on is keeping him in the same bad place.

Any attempt you might make to try to get him to engage with you and your relationship with your family and so on is met with accusations of nagging etc.

Are there any signs that he might be making any sort of effort to help himself now?

If you ask him to do so he'll probably accuse you of it again.

So you have a choice. You stay and put up with him behaving like this, walking on eggshells and hoping that one day he will start adulting and do something about himself.

Or you become more assertive and tell him this is something he has to do for the good of himself, the marriage and the family, knowing that he will push back.

Or you accept that this is going to be it for the duration - he's never going to change and if you stay you're stuck with it.

And all the time he may one day make his threat good and leave you.

I think it starts with seeking some therapy for yourself. Learning some assertiveness techniques, a greater sense of self-worth, communication skills etc.

I can't help thinking that asking him to leave and telling him you're not prepared to live your life this way or inflict it on your children anymore could give him the shock he needs.

Or he may grasp it with both hands as a way out he wants.

This is SO common.

I hope you're well in the land of nod by now OP and I hope that when you wake up in the morning you read all the brilliant advice from all the fantastic women on this thread and act on it.

Your comment "The way he is is killing my confidence and I feel very sad most of the time currently. But I don't feel strong enough to do anything about it right now other than hope things improve and try my hardest" sounds utterly wretched and I'm so sorry you've been made to feel this way. He's worn you down, destroyed your self-esteem and made you feel like you're the problem. You're not. He is. He's made you distraught and is now sleeping like a baby - just who the hell does he think he is being so cruel? With two very young children and a job you need your sleep. I know what I'd like to do in this situation and it wouldn't be to "try my hardest"!

I don't think anything will change until you recognise you deserve better than this OP and demand it. He's your husband and the father of your children and needs to start acting like the adult he's supposed to be. (Incidentally, I've no doubt my husband would say I'm always "nit-picking" at him, but in all of our 42-year marriage he hasn't threatened me with divorce over it.) Your DH needs to grow up and I'm afraid, you may need to tell him that.

OP
You ARE strong enough.
You probably feel you aren't, because you can't imagine your future without him, or at least the man he presented as, before the death of his close relative.

When a catastrophe happens to someone (else eg a car crash) you midget think that they are marvellous for dealing with that situation, and you think that you'd never be as capable as the person it happened to.

It's truly amazing what you can do when "it" happens to you.
Your instinct to survive initially, then to gain strength to actually thrive, is there in you.
It may have been dumbed down by life- people- situations, but you have absolutely got it in you.

If you feel under threat that he might leave you, then quietly get your "ducks in a row", so that you can feel somewhat in control of what happens next.
This should help your confidence even if he does get over himself and values you as his wife, best friend and lover.

I guess you will read all of the replies that us mumsnetters are posting, and you may think that none of us truly understand your situation... that may be true, but surely if the majority of replies that you read are basically saying the same thing, then maybe you should reassess your situation and future and the future of your children.

Lastly, having two young children to care for and to have to make a new plan .. even if it is a just in case scenario, is hard... it'll probably feel insurmountable at first, but as you tick off each aim to achieve in your plan, you'll gain that confidence slowly but surely.
Like working out a new muscle for instance, for a while it hurts like mad, but with practice, that muscle gets easier to work.
I hope you find your courage, strength and confidence, it's there waiting for you to access it.

There is some absolutely amazing advice here. I wish I felt as strong as all of you sound.

Obv I meant write down.

You are strong. Being a mum gives you superpowers. You need to believe and unleash them. We've been sold a load of rubbish that men are better and stronger than us because of the workplace. No, they sometimes only get further than us as they are not at home growing a baby and giving birth and nurturing a child, sometimes literally with their body. We make an actual human. We grow them, give birth to them, feed them. Men can't do that.

Come on, you've got this. You just have to decide and believe.