Can’t afford to divorce? What should we do?

[lking12]

Hi all, after looking at our finances (though I knew anyway) even running one household our remaining income is only about £400 a month. If I stopped a saving scheme and my pension contributions this would go up to £800 a month. This doesn’t seem enough to divorce and run two separate households as we live in the South East.
I can’t work out the logistics of divorcing!?!

My husband works from home and does the school run whilst I commute into work. The only way I can see us divorcing is if he moves back with his parents an hour away, I put the kids into childcare in the morning which will cost me £100 a week (or slightly less depending which days I go into the office) and have them in the week… And then he has the kids each weekend?
Otherwise is there some magical way we can afford to divorce? Ideally I don’t want to disrupt the kids schools and my job.

I’ve looked into rentals and the cheapest are about £1900 a month for a 3 bed before bills… we have three children aged 6, 3 and 1.

My situation isn't dissimilar to yours. Presumably you own your current property? I am going to speak to a mortgage lender to get an agreement in principle, which will give me an idea of how much I could borrow in my own right (based on my single wage and projected expenses). You would be entitled to some universal credit as well, so use a benefits calculator to get an idea of this..the reality is, that while divorce proceedings go ahead you can't afford to live separately unless you do as you mentioned and utilise his parents home for him. Could he still do the school runs while living with his parents?
You'll get a reduction in council tax if you are the only adult also..
Good luck! It would be worth speaking to a solicitor for 30 mins free advice also..there a quite a few around who offer this

you can claim benefits whilst still in the same house - and separated - worth a look.

Don’t think I can claim benefits as my salary is in the 40% tax bracket, maybe but I’ve never been eligible before not even for child benefit etc!
No he couldn’t do school run whilst living with his parents, they live in Canterbury we live in London, it could take two hours to drive in at rush hour!

We have a house with about £230k equity and mortgage is £1900 a month. But to cash in and spend it all on the instability of renting seems crazy?
He earns less than half of what I do so most of our income and spending comes from me. I own the car and have £12k in emergency savings but that’s it. I know that’s probably better than most and none of it is desperate but he does pay half the mortgage. I don’t think I could take it all on myself until our youngest was getting her 30 free hours in a few years.

As he is the primary carer, you find yourself a cheap flat closer to your work. He has them through the week and you get them at weekends. Seems fairly straightforward.

What @Crossinsomekindaline said. And because he earns half what you do he might be entitled to benefits exactly with kids of school age. And you split those between you afford key if he agrees to it as that's what's fair to run the two houses (or you pay him less maintence).

Unless you are mega wealthy there is no way to divorce without a huge financial impact. And even if you are mega wealthy there is no way to divirce without recognising that you will see your kids for half the time you are with them now. Lots of people seem to go into divorce without accepting this reality from the get go and that's what causes the (expensive) acrimony later on.

Divorce is awful because it's terrible to stay but it's also terrible in itself (in most cases)

A cheap flat in London is the problem? This is pretty much the cheapest I can find that isn’t a house share, and it’s in a cheap area of London too.

https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/132567737?utm_campaign=property-details&utm_content=lettings&utm_medium=sharing&utm_source=copytoclipboard#/&channel=RES_LET

That flat is a studio at 1195pcm. I’m not sure if it includes bills.
I’m not sure he’d want the kids on his own in the week, if he was with his parents his mum would be helping out. I think he’d find it too stressful on his own for that amount of time (evenings too).

I might suggest he talk to his parents and do a trial? I’ll also see if he’s entitled to any benefits. I think his parents are going to get annoyed their house is overrun by the kids every weekend though.
My family are all in the North West so I don’t have anywhere to escape to on a weekend if he came here! Maybe every other weekend I could go back to Liverpool and he use the house then but again just more money in train tickets!!

So basically I think put the kids in childminders few morning a week at an extra £50 a week/£200 a month. Then do two weeks in north west so he can use the house that’s £210 in train tickets a month (off peak return is £105). That feels ok as it’s about £400 a month if his parents would go along with it!!! But at least it’s an option.

Could you nest? I know it's not ideal but he stays in the house with kids during the week and you get a room in a shared house. Friday evening until Monday morning you stay in the house with the kids and he either sleeps at his parents or in your room. He should be able to make a claim for benefits on the basis he has the kids 4 nights each week, Mon-Thursday. You'd have them Friday to Sunday nights.

What does nest mean?
I might be able to find a room in a house Friday- Sunday rather than go up to Liverpool. Tbh my parents are really anti divorce so might not have me in anyway!

I did the benefits calculator and looks like he’d get £330 a month but that’s based on receiving no spousal support and having no claim on the £12k savings (they’re in my name and no evidence he contributed to them as he doesn’t but assume we might have to split that cash).
also said he’d be able to claim child benefit But I don’t really understand that when I earn over £60k and we aren’t entitled to it currently. Bit confusing!

If I work on the assumption we have £700- £1000 a month to run a separate household then I think we’d have enough so one of us could rent a room.

Universal credit

Yes nesting in a house share is an idea. You rent a room and then the pair of your come and go, leaving the kids in the house all the time. You just swap in and out.

Divorce is for high earners in London! Could you both move separately but together to a further out location? Friends in similar circumstances determined to live centrally downsized to a houseboat which I know is not ideal. This city is dire sometimes.

Is there abuse or just dissatisfaction?
What ages are the kids?

Have you thought about marriage counselling? Or if it's really over, then meditation to help you sort out children and financial stuff? I couldn't get my head around any of it, and it was very helpful. Have you spoken to your husband about any of this?

Can you rent a room in a share house and stay nearby, Op?
You could help out some nights with kids. On weekends wh ever has the kids stays with them,the other one goes to the rented room.
Could you set up another bedroom in your home until the little one reaches the 30 hours of care? Effectively treating it like a rented room. It would take discipline and respect from you both to tolerate that.

Have you thought about an au pair to help with mornings, maybe one doing an English as foreign language course or something so they can help with children in return for room and board? I'm not sure how the finances work out but I'm considering that, or a lodger during the week to bring in extra cash?

I would say that’s effectively how we are living now!!
I am not sure if we rented a room the other sharers or landlord would be comfortable with a man and ex wife swapping and tbh if I rented a room I’d prefer to keep it my own space away so might be the way to go.

The kids are very settled in school/preschool and with the childminder and divorce would be unsettling enough without throwing in a house move. Tbh we can’t move anywhere in the South East the place we live is already one of the cheapest!

Theres no particular issue he’s just very insular and unfortunately it bothers me, we’ve been back and forth a few times about seperating and had counselling before with Relate but it was useless. We’d already tried almost everything they said, think her final advice was stop breastfeeding and move the baby out of the room!!! He was the same when we were dating but we had more time and energy to make an effort now we just don’t or basically have lost interest to bother.

It’s lonely being in a marriage where the other person doesn’t really notice or care if you’ve had a conversation all week. No cheating or abuse so it’s not acrimonious. Just will be annoying to be hitting 40 renting a room like a 25 year old!!!

Divorce has a HUGE financial impact which can last for decades. Are you sure this is what you want? Have you tried counselling? I had an unwanted divorce 20 years ago and am still feeling the impact, having to work full time in my sixties. I wouldn't wish these implications on anyone and though you may have exhausted all the possibilities, I feel I always have to say this to anyone at this stage!

I'm not sure your marriage is beyond salvagable. It's only a couple of years ago you decided to have another kid so it can't have been this bad for very long. Having three under 6 isn't easy at all and it's common to lose yourselves during that stage when they are all small and demanding. That in combination with the fact that you can't really afford to keep two households afloat and that you have found a split that works when it comes to the workload (he does most childcare/you bring in more money) makes it very hard to find a middle ground that would work for all of you.

I don't think you can assume that he would be OK with moving in with his parents again (I certainly wouldn't). Most likely he will go for being the resident parent as he has the time to look after them and you would then pay him maintenance and he might even be allowed to stay in your current home until the youngest has finished school.

Frankly if my spouse sat me down and told me that we are divorcing and that I would need to go live with my parents and accept some pie in the sky plan I would be very put out and it would put my back up. The first and only thing you need to deal with is that you want to split. When that decision has settled then individually look into how you will be able to afford life as separately. Then come together and discuss.

I would drop any presumption on your part that he would be happy living with his parents and travelling to see his children. It is an even bigger overstep to think his parents want to have him living there for the foreseeable. None of that will factor into how your assets are split up.

At the moment it looks like he is the parent who can provide the most practical and affordable child care. He can also claim benefits which you can’t. It is Also never a good idea to put distance between children and parents.

The other thing you need to stop assuming is that the savings are yours. They aren’t because you got married. They are a family asset and they will be split. Along with the equity. As the lower earner and involved parent he is going to get most of the equity and savings. If you have pensions these will be equalised.

In this case I would consider a relocation out of London for both of you. That might mean you do a daily commute but I think that’s the only way you will both be able to give you children a secure home in a place they can maintain relationships with both of you.

Thanks all!
Sometimes it just feels like it’s a bit inevitable!
I think the worst thing that’s happened was he didn’t get me anything for Mother’s Day this year even though just weeks before it had been his 40th. He said he didn’t want to do anything (he never does and it was going to be tricky with a 3 month old baby), but at least I ran round with the little one getting balloons, a banner, photo card, lots of presents so he had things to open….
When I got angry and upset about Mother’s Day he got angry at me because his birthday had been ‘shit’!
Nothing has really be the same since then. It’s obviously not just that but that was a bit of a turning point.
I might see how Christmas goes and then chat about it.

If you moved away and rented somewhere you would not get Universal credit anyway if you have more than 16k equity in a property you don't live in. If the house was being sold and is on the market then it can be disregarded for a while until sold. I guess most splitting couples sell the house and divide the equity nd then if they have enough to each get back on the property ladder, they do. ( maybe shared ownership ), or they rent. You obviously could claim child maintenance if you are going to be the main resident parent for the kids, but not if you have them 50/ 50.
Your kids are very young and if the worst thing he has done is not get you a mothers day present I think I would try and work things out but only you know whether that is an option.