Active discussions

Meet the Other Phone. Protection built in.

Meet the Other Phone.
Protection built in.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Talk
Divorce/separation

Here you'll find divorce help and support from other Mners. For legal advice, you may find Advice Now guides useful.

Original poster

Child maintenance - can he use it?

33 replies

Alara84 · 08/05/2023 11:04

Hello,

This sounds potentially a bit stupid and I will be getting legal advice after bank hol (!) specifically on this point, but really wanted to ask what other people do. I am in process of getting divorced, we have had several mediation sessions (one DD aged 3, house being sold and equity split) we agree on most things. The only thing I am finding very hard is the child maintenance chat. DD will be with me officially 60/40 but we have both agreed it will likely be more than that. I am and will continue to be in charge of anything medical, educational, social etc - (i mean, we're getting divorced for a reason ha). He's agreed to pay the 200 or a month that the gov calculator spits out. But then y'day wanted to set up a joint account so that that money could be accessed by both of us. He doesn't take into account I will be using child maintenance to support me with bills (I work pt on a farily rubbish salary, compared to his, he's on 20K more). So I've said absolutely not, the whole point is we are separating and I will continue to buy clothes etc as I always have and these will be shared between houses/not belong in one single house (!?) Anyway, he said ok as long as I can claim money back off the child maintenance if I've bought her clothes/shoes/haircut (all that is hugely unlikely as he's not done it ever but you know.)
Is this reasonable? I'm overwhelmed at the mo as the divorce is my choice, so I am doing everything - driving selling the house, the admin etc. Would really appreciate any advice. Thanks

OP posts:
Original poster
Alara84 · 08/05/2023 11:05

Sorry - equity split is 50/50 but might shift in my direction following next mediation session

OP posts:
Fandabedodgy · 08/05/2023 11:08

He has no say on how you spend the child maintenance.

Although he does have a say over health and education.

Lovingitallnow · 08/05/2023 11:10

Does he think it costs 200 a month to house feed and clothe her? Because that's what it sounds like. Tell him the Maintenance is to cover his share of her upkeep for the addition time you have her.

MangoBiscuit · 08/05/2023 11:11

Child maintainence is to cover the additional costs of having your child more than 50% of the time. He is responsible for paying for all costs while your child is with him. The calculated amount already takes that into consideration. So no, he doesn't get to deduct that from the amout.

You might want to get something into your agreement that you will split things like school uniform and shoes 50/50. ExH and I have this. We have to agree beforehand (no one gets to splurge £££'s and expect the other to foot the bill, but necessities have to be agreed), show the receipts, and the other has 14 days to reimburse.

millymollymoomoo · 08/05/2023 11:27

Dont have a joint account

no he can’t use it

if he wants to buy her additional things then that’s on top, out if his own pocket
the 200 is to help you cover costs of food, clothes etc and won’t go a v long way

Inthebathagain · 08/05/2023 11:42

In the haze of early separation, ex insisted we used the old marital joint account for the children. I agreed.

I changed it very quickly. He wanted to know what X spend in Tesco was for, y spend in Primark...etc.

He got really angry when I began moving the maintenance into my personal account. He stopped paying it. So I threatened him that we'd go through CSA, which would cost him more.

He stopped hassling then.

Don't do it op. That maintenance is yours to spend on your littlie, however you decide.

rwalker · 08/05/2023 11:57

Lovingitallnow · 08/05/2023 11:10

Does he think it costs 200 a month to house feed and clothe her? Because that's what it sounds like. Tell him the Maintenance is to cover his share of her upkeep for the addition time you have her.

There on 60/40 split that’s why it’s low

Milkand2sugarsplease · 08/05/2023 12:11

CM is determined by how many nights he has her and he finds the nights he has her.

Set it up officially through cms and don't leave a grey area for him to pick at.

Milkand2sugarsplease · 08/05/2023 12:12

*funds not finds

VisitationRights · 08/05/2023 12:18

A) you don’t need to take into account anything he spends on her when she is with him, this includes toys, clothes, activities, toys etc.

B) he cannot decide for anything to be deducted from child maintenance, ever. He owes what owes every month and on time.

C) He doesn’t get to claim child benefit if he tries that either.

don’t let him try to coerce you into making things more beneficial for him financially. Being the resident parent you including all admin, appointments, etc. is time consuming and takes commitment.

Quartz2208 · 08/05/2023 12:23

His child maintenance doesn’t cover 100% of her care. It covers the 20% difference in time you have. So you are not out of pocket for having her more.

he is responsible for the 40% of the time she is with him, feeding her, clothing her extra.

things such as school trips/uniform etc should still be 50/50 split

the cms goes to you and you alone to cover the extra day to day expenses

Original poster
Alara84 · 08/05/2023 12:29

Thank you each of you for explaining it so clearly. I carry guilt over this decision and want it done quickly but I know in doing that he’s trying to get control financially (not a bad person , but he is controlling over money!) and I really appreciate the head wobble. Thank you 🙏 ps does it get easier 😂

OP posts:
BetterFuture1985 · 08/05/2023 13:09

@Alara84 It depends whether you want an answer on what is "reasonable" from a moral or legal perspective. Morally he might pay half of school trips and uniforms on top of child maintenance but legally it's a grey area. You might negotiate on this point but I suspect it isn't worth going to court over so you might end up deciding it is cheaper to concede.

I think the most likely outcome is that he can't touch what he pays you in CM and in retaliation he pays for absolutely nothing else. Sorry.

Milkand2sugarsplease · 08/05/2023 13:13

It absolutely gets easier!!

I'm 4 years in now and it's all like clockwork now.

I tried an amicable agreement at first as I know how much of a pain cms can be but I've ended up going down the road of making it official with cms now to make life easier.
Ex always paid, I can't say he didn't but it was extra correspondence each month that I didn't want or need as I had to chase him every month. Now that it's through cms, he sees it as "official" and he pays when he's been told to and I don't have to contact him.

Also, it's tracked through HMRC so I know it's based on his earnings and accounts for pay rises etc.

Ponderingwindow · 08/05/2023 13:32

He is supposed to be buying the clothes for his house.

he pays for childcare on his days

he covers any expenses that come up on his days

his maintenance is supposed to offset your expenses of having them more time. So the fact that you have to feed, clothe, and provide other care for them for more days. It doesn’t make you responsible for paying for everything for the children.

BetterFuture1985 · 08/05/2023 14:07

Ponderingwindow · 08/05/2023 13:32

He is supposed to be buying the clothes for his house.

he pays for childcare on his days

he covers any expenses that come up on his days

his maintenance is supposed to offset your expenses of having them more time. So the fact that you have to feed, clothe, and provide other care for them for more days. It doesn’t make you responsible for paying for everything for the children.

Yes and no. As a rule of thumb, as you said you are responsible for when the children are with you. So if it's a 60/40 split then the OP might expect to pay 60% of school uniform or the cost of the school trip for the days falling when she is responsible. Contribution to these things could be inferred from maintenance.

But I'm using words like could and phrases like rule of thumb because there are no clear rules, it's a negotiation and will depend on all the other circumstances. In my own case my ex-wife did extremely well out of the split of assets and relies on me for childcare on "her days." So she gets CM calculated to the penny and nothing else for anything. But then that is £1.1k a month so she's not complaining!

Doggymummar · 08/05/2023 14:13

It's 200 a month not 1.1k

Losingweightissohard · 08/05/2023 14:16

Will you be claiming UC because of your low wage? Is that why he is asking as you about the child maintenance money as he believes you will be subsidised by UC and he will not be?

Fireyflies · 08/05/2023 14:25

Setting up a joint account as he's suggested won't give either of you the independence and autonomy you need and will be setting you both up for years of future conflict.

Make it simple. He pays you the £200 a month. You both feed DD when she's with you and pay for any childcare on those days. The £200 a month he pays you (plus child benefit, any other benefits you're entitled to and some of your own earnings of course) go on the other costs - cloths, school stuff, etc. If there are big optional extras (eg a school trip or music lessons) you work those out on a case by case basis, which might involve him paying or splitting the costs depending who can afford it and wants to spend the money.

But most of all you need to each make your own individual decisions on day to day expenditure.

caringcarer · 08/05/2023 16:13

The parent who has DC the majority of time can claim Child Benefit.

Child maintenance is calculated on how many nights each parent has the child. Always use a CMS calculator for this.

Child maintenance is paid by the parent who has the child less frequently to the parent who has the child more frequently to be spent how they wish.

Both parents buy clothes/shoes/coats for child and child wares clothes when with that parent. Both parents buy toys for the child and they are kept at separate accommodations.

Good if nursery fees can be shared 50/50 and school uniforms/PE kits too but not always possible.

Parent who has child more frequently might be awarded a bit more equity if there is any.

Pensions should be shared equally.

You will be responsible for paying for any activity DC does on days with you and DH responsible for paying for activity on day DC is with him.

Some parents who see DC less frequently will agree to pay for activities for DC especially if they already do them on days with other parent. EG my nephew paid for his DD's to continue piano and dancing lessons even though on days he did not have them.

You will need to sort out who.has DC on Xmas day. Many parents do alternate years. Some if live close to each other do half a day each. The only decent thing my exh did was to agree to our DC being with me on Xmas Eve and Xmas day and him on Boxing Day. He did not want to bother with stockings or cooking Xmas dinner but I was hugely relieved I'd have my DC for Xmas day.

I'd still see a solicitor to check out what they consider fair in your circumstances and I've noticed mediation seems to favour parent who has child less frequently.

If you end up having DC more frequently than first thought then stbexh will have to pay you a bit more. Go through CMS. Keep it official.

Ponderingwindow · 08/05/2023 16:40

BetterFuture1985 · 08/05/2023 14:07

Yes and no. As a rule of thumb, as you said you are responsible for when the children are with you. So if it's a 60/40 split then the OP might expect to pay 60% of school uniform or the cost of the school trip for the days falling when she is responsible. Contribution to these things could be inferred from maintenance.

But I'm using words like could and phrases like rule of thumb because there are no clear rules, it's a negotiation and will depend on all the other circumstances. In my own case my ex-wife did extremely well out of the split of assets and relies on me for childcare on "her days." So she gets CM calculated to the penny and nothing else for anything. But then that is £1.1k a month so she's not complaining!

Show quote history

Yes, technically it should be proportional. Especially since the NRP often has fewer school days so and fewer working days of parenting so if you went on a strict day to day split, the NRP ends up with cheaper parenting. There are no school uniforms to buy or child care to pay for on weekends.

An ex who is trying to get maintenance put into a joint account isn’t going to understand he should be paying certain expenses on top of maintenance at a proportional level, regardless of day. Hence the suggestion to stick to the you cover your days approach,

BetterFuture1985 · 08/05/2023 17:36

Yeah... I should probably point out that I'm saying there are no hard and fast rules really. It comes down to a negotiation and all facts of the divorce might influence the outcome. In the end, for a payer it's a simple matter of opening up a CMS case and refusing to pay extra if they don't like the outcome that was negotiated so caution should definitely be exercised.

I think from a payers perspective, they want to ensure it is for the children's benefit too. I think if the OPs ex is paying £200 that can be reasonably assured. In my case paying £1.1k I was less convinced and remain slightly concerned that some of it is being spent on alcohol, dates and the like so I make sure it's me rather than her buying anything extra they need and I insist that she covers the full cost of uniforms to be certain at least some of it is being spent appropriately.

Fireyflies · 08/05/2023 17:48

With a 60-40 split I think you do have to be clear that the money passing from him to you will cover costs like uniforms, clothes, etc. Otherwise he's going to say "Why am I being asked to pay £200/month extra if all the costs are being shared 50-50?" Especially if there are child benefit and other benefits also flowing into the household with slightly more than 50% of the care. But that way to do that is by agreeing what the things are that you are responsible for buying and he isn't, not for him to be policing every pound you spend.

I think it's cruel on children to say that the clothes bought by one parent stay in that parent's home. The clothes belong to the children, who will be wearing them as they move between homes. (Only exception is things like pyjamas which don't move and you might want to have one set of in each home to make life easier)

If you're doubtful that he will actually have DD as much as has been agreed though OP, do keep a record of when it gets changed and why (ie your request or his). That way you can request an increase in future if he's actually having her less than 40%.

Quartz2208 · 08/05/2023 18:23

It doesn’t cover school uniform, school trips or extra curriculum activities those should be 50/50

it covers basic needs food, cloth8ng, housing and you don’t have to explain what these are

BetterFuture1985 · 08/05/2023 23:46

Quartz2208 · 08/05/2023 18:23

It doesn’t cover school uniform, school trips or extra curriculum activities those should be 50/50

it covers basic needs food, cloth8ng, housing and you don’t have to explain what these are

You've said this twice now and I've tried to diplomatically suggest this is a grey area, a matter of negotiation etc to try and give the OP reliable information.

Unfortunately I'm going to have to try a different approach now.

Please point to where in the law it says school uniform, school trips or extra curricular activities must be 50/50?