Please help I'm losing sleep and constantly worried 😟

[beetlehope]

Please help. I almost want you to lie to me as I think the truth is going to cause me more 😧
Separated 3 years. He had depression so often off sick, I worked to further career and had a child whilst managed renovation and most of the family chores and finances.
He gaslight me refused to speak or look at me for over a year leading me to seek help from women's aid.
Dragged to court to settle child - cost fortune - court barely changed what I had given.
3 years on he wants half of everything.
I have stayed in family home and he only really paid half after leaving.
A free solicitor today told me I will likely lose my home as I'm over provided for with 3 bedrooms.
That mesher orders are rare and likely will be forced to sell
I'm devastated. I feel like my life has been for nothing I've worked so hard to stay here and make this a home for my child. I have had an awful few years losing family and being alone for much of covid. I lost my job and was unemployed for some time. Then bam menopause...
I feel stuck.
Without the means to buy him out - half could be 120k (london) I feel like goign home to my parents and admitting defeat but I can't even do that as we have a shared care order.
Anyone have a mesher order and can anyone tell me life will ever feel better?

I don't fully understand what you mean here: Dragged to court to settle child - cost fortune - court barely changed what I had given.

AFAIK, Mesher orders are very rare these days.

What's the current custody arrangement and who pays maintenance to whom?

How old is the child?

What's your husband's current financial situation and earnings, compared to yours?

waiting 3 years without sorting out the finances may not have been very smart.

I think you need to retain a solicitor to get a clear idea of what you can realistically expect. Hopefully he or she can give you some clear information that may ease your worries. 💐

How long were you married?
what are the chikd arrangements?

a mesher is likely to only kick the can down the road - as you’ll be paying all the mortgage and bills and still owe his share ( possibly 50%), only then you’ll likeky be paying more if house prices rise over the years. Do you understand how a mesher works?

in my view better to face it now rather than have it hanging over your head fir yiurs and financially still being tied.

unfortunately yiu are in the sane position as many married couples with the higher earner substantially losing out financially vs what they’ve contributed in money terms

No I didn’t get a mesher order and I did have to sell the house (ordered by the court and I had two small children.) I had to massively downsize.

I think you need to look at it differently eg a fresh start in your own place with no ties to him. I still miss my old home and so do the children but financially there was no choice.

Flower arranger -
I don't fully understand what you mean here: Dragged to court to settle child - cost fortune - court barely changed what I had given.
THE COURT GAVE HIN A FEW % ETC TIME WITH DAUGHTER - ID ALREADY GIVEN HIM 40% WHEN WE LIVED TOGETHER I DID LIONS SHARE IT COST ME MY SAVINGS

AFAIK, Mesher orders are very rare these days.
SO UPSET BY THIS

What's the current custody arrangement and who pays maintenance to whom?
IVE NEVER CLAMIED HE SAID I AM NOT ENTITLED
HE PAID HALF MORTGAGE ONLY SINCE HE LEFT TO PROVE A POINT .
ITS SPILT VERY WERIDLY THANKS TO COURT BUT EQUATES TO HIM HAVING 6 NIGHTS OUT OF 14.
BEEN TOLD I CAN NOW CLAIM CM
HES STOPPED CONTRIBUTING ANYTHING - LEFT ME WITH 2 BIG DOGS AND BIG MORTGAGE HE CANT AFFORD ON HIS OWN AND AN UNFINISHED HOME

How old is the child?
7

What's your husband's current financial situation and earnings, compared to yours?
NOT SURE MAYBE 45 / 55 ME AT THE MO
HES GOT A FANCY LEASED CAR GYM MEMBERSHIP AND WONT SAVE A PENNY AND LIVED I THINK (HE SAYS NOT) RENT FREE WITH BROTHERS

waiting 3 years without sorting out the finances may not have been very smart.
IVE BEGGED AND PLEADED HE GASLIT ME FOR YEARS AND REFUSED TO TALK TIL WE DID CHILD AND THAT TOOM YEARS IN LOCKDOWN
EVEN NOW I REAPPLIED FOR JOINT DIVORCE ABD DESPITE HIM ASKING FOR THAT IS DRAGGINF HEELS
I LOST MY JOB LOST MY SELF CONFIDENCE IN LOCKDOWN AND COULDBT AFFORD A SOLUCTOR PLUS I WORRIED I COULDNT TAKE ON A MORTGAGE WITH NO WAGE
I ASKED TO DO FINANCE WITH CHILD HE REFUSED

I think you need to retain a solicitor to get a clear idea of what you can realistically expect. Hopefully he or she can give you some clear information that may ease your worries. 💐
I SPOKE TO ONE AND LEFT ME WISHING I WASNT HERE. I DONT WANT HIS MONEY PENSION ETC I JUST NEED WHAT I PUT IN.
IF HE EARNS LESS THEY COULD APPARENTLY FORCE SALE. MY METBAL HEALTH WONT COPE
THIS IS WHERE I FEEL SAFE
HE LIVED HERE LESS THAN 2 YEARS SO IT ISNT LIKE IT EVER FELT LIKE HIS. HE WAS ALWAYS OUT AND NEVER HELPED WITH WORK I DID ON IT.
IF THEY FORCE SALE I WANT TO LEAVE THE AREA AND GO TO MY PARENTS ITS TOO MUCH TO BE ALONE WITH NO FAMILY OR CLOSE FRIENDS AND 3 DOGS AND I CWNT AFFORD TO LOSE THE SOLICTORS FEES MONEY THE MOVING COSTS AND STAMP DUTY.
MY DAUGHTER WOULD BE DEVASTATED TO LOSE THE ONLY HOME SHE HAS KNOWN THE SEPARATION MESSED HER UP A LOT HE TRIED TO ALIENTATE HER FROM ME BY TELLIGN HER I ENDED IT TO GET A BF AND THAT I DIDNT LOOK AFTER HER WHEN WE WERE TOGETHER.

IM EXHAUSTED FROM TRYING
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millymollymoomoo · Today 07:18

How long were you married?
what are the chikd arrangements?

a mesher is likely to only kick the can down the road - as you’ll be paying all the mortgage and bills and still owe his share ( possibly 50%), only then you’ll likeky be paying more if house prices rise over the years. Do you understand how a mesher works?

in my view better to face it now rather than have it hanging over your head fir yiurs and financially still being tied.

unfortunately yiu are in the sane position as many married couples with the higher earner substantially losing out financially vs what they’ve contributed in money terms

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ImGood · Today 07:28

No I didn’t get a mesher order and I did have to sell the house (ordered by the court and I had two small children.) I had to massively downsize.

I think you need to look at it differently eg a fresh start in your own place with no ties to him. I still miss my old home and so do the children but financially there was no choice.

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Marriage is not about getting back what you put in. Divorce does not work like this.
courts do not care who paid for what or should financially contributed what

in simple terms here you earn very similar ( at least earning potential is) and you have bear 50:50 childcare so your needs in terms of housing snd ability to pay and rates mortgage is approximately the sane. So 50:50 split or near that seems reasonable based on what you’ve stated.

yiur child will be fine if she has to move - she will take cues from you. I expect she is less tied that you are emotionally

. I DONT WANT HIS MONEY PENSION ETC I JUST NEED WHAT I PUT IN.

I'm afraid it doesn't work like that. Financial settlements are largely based on current needs and take the full financial situation of both parties into account. His pension is a valuable asset and should not be discounted.

You are clearly very worn down and extremely distressed, but you have to find a way of coming to terms with what you need to do. Counseling would probably help you - a safe environment in which to voice and explore your fears and emotions.

But ultimately you will have to accept that retaining your home may not be feasible. However, it is possible to create a new, comfortable and safe home for you and your child. Millions of women have had to do this. You can too 💐

As a pp said you probably need to get some help to come to terms with the situation. In reality this is not a catastrophe. Your life may change immediately but you are not going to be penniless or homeless.

Marriage is a very blunt tool that combines two people financially. Divorce is an even blunter tool that splits those finances up and usually people don’t have enough to go as far as meeting needs.

A mesher is no guarantee you would be allowed to keep the house you are in if it is too big. You could still be told to downsize so that at least some of his capital is released. He would then still own a % of your new property.

The law is a joke.
If I knew what I know now I would never ever have got married
My life will never recover and he will benefit from my hard work whilst making my child hate me and contributing nothing.
I'm being penalised for trying
My contract ends soon - what you are saying is if I am then unemployed it would mean he has to then pay for me?
So I'm insentivised to not look for work?

Can I ask that you don't tell me its just a house and I'm not homeless it's not helpful
I've suffered os much from this man and its taken years to get back my confidence
My home is my safe place

My mum helps with childcare because I can't afford to pay it - where is she meant to sleep when I'm forced to down size?
Where are the 2 big dogs meant to go that he left me with?
I dont want child support or his pension I want what is morally mine.
The law is a joke it let a child sleep in her dad's bed but queries my one gin a week.

I'm giving up its pointless being a woman who wants to better herself

Suck a man dry and take what you can should be taught in schools honestly there is no safe way to be married

With all due respect you are catastrophising

the law would not give more to you if you stopped Erik as it would look at your earning potential and expect you to maximise it. It takes a dim view of those deliberately doing that also

most men divorcing would agree they are sucked dry as they usually come out with a lesser sgare if they are higher earners

yiur child won’t hate you for moving / people move all the time for jobs, partners, divorce, work, personal reasons. You are overthinking it and making it so negative. On the plus side, you’d be free if him, have no financial ties and can make a fresh start without him still being financially tied to your property

if he has a pension ensure this is included in the pot - you can use this as part of the negotiation

It's true that the law in England is particularly punishing for the higher earner. It is usually men who learn this the hard way.
Lesson should be : do not get married!!

@beetlehope - you are clearly in a very bad place emotionally and unable to see clearly and accept what you need to do in order to be able to move on with your life.

Please consider doing the following:

Get counselling.

Consider asking your GP for an antidepressant; it'll help you see things with greater clarity and hopefully help you act rather than ruminate.

Find a family solicitor who you feel comfortable with - and listen to their advice.

If you don't, you'll still be in the same mess in 3 years time. And this will be very detrimental to your child - and you.

OP, are you getting any therapy? Do you have someone impartial to talk to in real life? I think it would help.

Obviously, you are extremely angry, and who wouldn't be? But you might need to be calm and reasoned to get the best you can out of this situation.

'Comparison is the thief of joy', people often say. Don't compare 'now' with 'then'. You aren't the single woman you once were. You've been married and it's changed everything. Find out where you are now financially, accurately, from a solicitor and/or financial advisor. Find out who you are now through therapy.

I think you'll find you're better all round than you think you are.

Oh, and drop his dogs off wherever he lives, or with his relatives. Not your circus, not your doggies.

You made me laugh about the dogs - unfortunately I'm very moral and an animal lover - I don't believe in giving things up to suit my needs when they have no choice. He wanted them but obviously doesn't contribute.

Whoever said don't get marry I'd say this-
Marry up - or get a pre nup
No one wants to get divorced but stats speak for themselves.

The lady who said this -
I cant move.
I am stuck tied to this man because the court would have to grant an order to allow me to move schools etc. So please try to understand how i feel. I'm alone in a big place with no help and my mum travels to support me- i can't ask her to stay on the floor.

"yiur child won’t hate you for moving / people move all the time for jobs, partners, divorce, work, personal reasons. You are overthinking it and making it so negative. On the plus side, you’d be free if him, have no financial ties and can make a fresh start without him still being financially tied to your property"

So I won't be really free till she is 18 or I give up on my child?
She hates that we are not together and it took years to repair the damage he did by lying to her and saying I kicked him out because I got a boyfriend - not true. I took her to therapy to help.
She won't want to move and I don't think I can afford to stay local which means I'd be back in court. The cost of a 2 bed is about 480 with moving costs etc it makes no sense to do that.

I'm not depressed - I lived with that and I hate when people say things that aren't medically accurate.
I'm sad angry and frustrated as I feel like working is pointless whilst I'm paying his equity.

Women who give up work are obviously entitled ot a home - but I had to work and be a mother and am now being penalised.

if he has a pension ensure this is included in the pot - you can use this as part of the negotiation
I will but I think this is just gross its his why the chuff do I want it - I want whats mine only and dont want the jewelry he gave me or anything of his. I think its grossly unfair but will of course use it as leverage.
I dont want cms either - I think that's unfair too but again I will have to claim to offset what he will get - stupid system.

The unfair thing is that the system essentially incentives you to be lazy.
If you give up work and stay home you will probably get all the equity in the house.
If you work and earn the same as partner have to pay them half?

Insane.

I'm so sorry you're feeling this way and I hope you get some relief. For what it's worth, I got a mesher order. The ex pays the mortgage (in full) until youngest finishes A Levels and then we leave with my equity. In addition I also get a small amount of spousal maintenance for the rest of my life (or until I remarry, which will be never). It doesn't seem typical for posts on here though. Ex high earner, long marriage, consent order from two months ago.

Everyone always says you won't get xxx they don't do that any more. I got joint lives spousal maintenance with an option to go back for more should/when his finances increase/allow at the beginning of this year (huge delays due to Covid). He however, cannot come after me at all, ever, even if /when my circumstances change.

This is why you need proper representation - a good lawyer and a shit hot barrister. I understand you are angry, divert that anger against 'the system' and use it to good effect against your husband.

@unsync please can you share the details of the hot barrister. Thanks

unsync - are you missing here they op earns more than ex? I expect your ex was very high earner and you have highly unusual circumstances. It’s not helpful to suggest op here will be entitled to anything like joint lives, or even tine bound spousal.
it’s also highly unlikely he can never come back - is his circumstances materially change I expect he could fight for a variation

Time to play hard ball.

tell this man that you will forgo his pension and 50pc maintenance if he signs the house over to you

if he refuses to do that put in a claim for maintenance tonight and start making a plan regarding your housing situation

do not put these conversations in messages give him a call and tell him

if you continue to try and uphold your principles then this man is going to trash you

also consider offering him a certain percentage of the property when said child is a certain age

but still go for maintenance - you can negotiate you just need to be more creative

Not at all, I was meaning that with proper representation, it is still possible to get the more difficult / rarer judgements if circumstances to do so exist. There seems to be the assumption on MN that it's always 50:50 yada yada yada, but that isn't always so.

And no, variations are not possible in my case - judgement was very clear on that (psychological & financial abuse).

Sorry I don't know how to reply to a particular person. - mums net newbie

I was hoping to use pension and not wanting child maintenance as leverage and offer him smaller amount to get the house ... but one solicitor told me judge needs to rubber stamp all things like that and rhey would have questions

For the record I have prob naff all pension as unemployed for year and furloughed b4 that.
Yes I earned more but only about 15k ish and during marriage paid more so have not a lot of savings - what I had went to do child arrangements which cost a fortune and he got the same as I gave.

I'd like to stay in the house as solicitors bills and moving costs etc would eat into equity and though court may say I'm overhoused as have 3 beds I need space as mum helps me and travels miles to do so. Or I'm alone with a child and no help or help I can afford. If I am forced to move and get 2 beds it's not much less and I'd really struggle.

Thank you for those that gave me some hope and anyone who can recommend solicitor please do so

I dont want what is his or want him to suffer I only want to keep my home for me my child.

Solicitors will never sign off a trade between assets for no maintenance as this can be overcome after 12 months, a claim made to cms and maintenance would be due despite receiving more assets. After 12 months cms takes the case

i know I can sound unfeeling and im
sorry for your predicament- but I still think you need to accept the law, cut your losses, be in a position to sever financial ties and his ability to control / impact you and better to do that now than have to fight and wait years more.

If I was to give up I'd have to go home
It's not as easy as you imply.
Without a bed for my mum I can't afford child care. And in the world I work in jibs are really scarce.

has he said he wants you to sell? Has he offered to let you stay there? What are his suggestions?

OP, I feel your pain.

You're in a completely unfair situation having contributed so much more in terms of your financial contribution and labour and the heavy lifting you've done on the domestic front. It would be unjust for you to be forced to sell and live in a home where your mother can't help you with the childcare.

Others on here will say, that's just the law, and maybe they know more about it than me. Strikes me the law has probably developed off the back of cases where there were significant assets and likely as not very high earning husband and trailing spouse/homemaker wife who can argue she's forgone her earning capacity to support his success. But that just isn't the picture these days for most ordinary women who increasingly work as much as or more than their husbands and do all the work looking after children/ keeping the household together.

I had heard that although the presumption is 50:50- it's driven by legislation aimed at ensuring provision for children. I say this because I wonder whether in your case there would be potential arguments that you should be enabled to keep the house especially if losing it would mean compromising your earning capacity (if you have to pay for childcare) and also diluting your daughter's contact with your mum.

Is there any way you could try to flesh out the possible scenarios with some sums/data? So, for example, comparing 1) you staying in the house and paying him a small share of equity (perhaps remortgage) with the rest later under a mesher order 2) you moving into a smaller place nearby but with moving costs and calculate the likely childcare costs (which presumably further diminish your mortgage capacity so you might be able to demonstrate that financially
It isn't feasible) and 3) buying a smaller place but close enough to your mum that she could still help with childcare (which may be the best scenario financially for your ex but would mean he'd have to agree to the change of school). I know none of these is ideal from your perspective but as other posters have said, it might help you come to terms with the massive loss to feel as though there are options.

If your daughter has lived with you for 3 years has your ex objected to this? I ask because if she's going to live the majority of the time with you wouldn't there also be an argument there that the split shouldn't be a straight 50:50 but something which reflects you have a greater need for a family home and your childcare arrangements require the extra bedroom?

There may be family lawyers on here who can offer more insight on your particular circumstances. I agree with posters who have said try again with the legal advice.

I really sympathise, it's a truly rotten situation and no comfort at all to know that many blokes have been in the same situation as higher earners. Maybe some of them were brilliant parents but I bet in many cases they didn't bear the same domestic/household/emotional load.