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Divorce/separation

Here you'll find divorce help and support from other Mners. For legal advice, you may find Advice Now guides useful.

Legal advice or give in?

31 replies

mynamechangemyrules · 24/07/2022 10:21

Very long story short;
I reside in the UK, home country of all of us (children and parents) and EXH lives in another country. We left with his 'acquiescence' but not legal permission (he's too canny for that..!). It has now been a year so our residence here is pretty firm standing now.
EXH doesn't tell us when he is coming over and then demands to see the children when he wants. We have acquiesced as he has not seen them in between these visits and I try to keep the relationship going as much as possible. (I send photos and videos/ get them to video call once a week min/ communicate updates with all of his family as well).
He is an extreme bully, that's why we left. He exerts coercive control, also why we left. He continues to do so.

The country where we divorced does not recognise this although evidence was cited at time of divorce.

Anyway, he sets a little 'I'm an arsehole' alarm and ALWAYS messages on the morning of their first day of holiday to crap it all up.

This time he messaged and said he doesn't approve of my plans for the holiday (foreign divorce he has veto on plans if he doesn't approve- as we are nearly always seeing friends who used to be mutuals but can't stand him he has little tantrums and blocks our plans...)

So- he is saying he will land in the uk next weekend and have all 3 DCs for 4 weeks till 31.8.

He is saying he will take legal action if they are not all delivered to him then. He puts this because all 3 have form in refusing to go (they all hate it- he schedules 'enriching' activities- usually where he self-teaches them- which they loathe and plans it around his social calendar/ desire to shop in the UK. Never relates to their interests.)

The stay will be away from their home town and means they will miss a European holiday to see friends with me, plus 2 trips in the UK to see friends and family. Incl his family who he won't see.

Anyway, part of me wants to go 'woohoo a month without the kids let's book a spa and actually get some work done'

But they.won't.go.

(He also has form for dropping them back when they misbehave/ won't do the activities he's planned- so if I plan anything it could be scuppered anyway.)

Do I

A) acquiesce (word of the day) but make it clear they stay the whole time without dropping back
B) Say that they need to come on the (uncancellable) EU holiday?
C) Seek UK legal advice for how he communicates with all of us ('your opinions are pathetic and I don't care about them, you just need to get them to me or face legal action' etc etc etc) and not allow the visitation?

I have 'sole care and control'- not sure on terms of ref used over here.

OP posts:
mynamechangemyrules · 24/07/2022 10:21

God, sorry even the short version is really bloody long 😂

OP posts:
Sundayfootball19288228282 · 24/07/2022 10:24

Personally I’d seek legal here, I’d look at some type of order that prevents him taking them out of the country- what is to stop him taking them back to his home country and keeping them?
id go on your holiday with the kids as planned and look at drawing up formal contact through a U.K. based solicitor

MichelleScarn · 24/07/2022 10:24

This time he messaged and said he doesn't approve of my plans for the holiday (foreign divorce he has veto on plans if he doesn't approve- as we are nearly always seeing friends who used to be mutuals but can't stand him he has little tantrums and blocks our plans...)
Do you get to veto his plans demands?

SD1978 · 24/07/2022 10:24

What if any recourse would he have if you didn't follow the terms of the foreign divorce? I'd be tempted to say that's nice and do whatever you wanted! And also see a UK lawyer as to whether things can be tightened up for you.

mynamechangemyrules · 24/07/2022 10:26

Also relevant to avoid drip feed (hard with this messed up web)- the longest he has ever had all 3 children together is 3 nights. I have to pack all clothes/ toys/ sports equipment/ blow up beds/ bedding/ sheets and FOOD even in the country we used to jointly reside in. He has/ keeps nothing for them.

OP posts:
Goawayangryman · 24/07/2022 10:27

I'd seek legal advice from someone who knows about both jurisdictions, hague convention applications etc. It sounds like he could be really difficult if he wanted and potentially have you up for child abduction if he wanted to.

Sorry. He sounds absolutely appalling.

mynamechangemyrules · 24/07/2022 10:27

I do- and I realise how shit I sound here- but I write it all out and he shoots it all down with ‘parental alienation’ ‘Hague’ and various threats.

OP posts:
mynamechangemyrules · 24/07/2022 10:28

Sorry that reply was to MichelleScarn thought it would tag the previous message sorry

OP posts:
Goawayangryman · 24/07/2022 10:29

I'd also stop packing up all the stuff!

mynamechangemyrules · 24/07/2022 10:30

Immediate replies are all legal which is pushing me to get out the credit card 😳🤪 Last ‘chat’ was £1k
Anyone know a cheaper route for uk solicitor advice? Problem is they need some international knowledge and my local family lawyers all said they don’t have it, so it was a pricey London firm.

OP posts:
Goawayangryman · 24/07/2022 10:31

Ah parental alienation, the battle cry of the inept, abusey father, subtext, my kids don't dislike me because of anything I have done, it must be someone else's (your) fault ....

mynamechangemyrules · 24/07/2022 10:31

Goawayangryman · 24/07/2022 10:29

I'd also stop packing up all the stuff!

I have tried that. The kids get it in the ear about how crap I am and how I’ve ‘prevented them’ from being comfortable/ doing activities.

OP posts:
mynamechangemyrules · 24/07/2022 10:32

Goawayangryman · 24/07/2022 10:31

Ah parental alienation, the battle cry of the inept, abusey father, subtext, my kids don't dislike me because of anything I have done, it must be someone else's (your) fault ....

Omg this 1000 times over

OP posts:
Goawayangryman · 24/07/2022 10:34

I still wouldn't pack the stuff up. Let him give them an earful. It will

Goawayangryman · 24/07/2022 10:34

Oops...hasten their separation from him.

The charity Reunite might be able to give you some free advice or at least recommend a suitable solicitor.

godmum56 · 24/07/2022 10:35

mynamechangemyrules · 24/07/2022 10:30

Immediate replies are all legal which is pushing me to get out the credit card 😳🤪 Last ‘chat’ was £1k
Anyone know a cheaper route for uk solicitor advice? Problem is they need some international knowledge and my local family lawyers all said they don’t have it, so it was a pricey London firm.

I googled legal advice charities children and found quite a few. here's an example. I don't know them from adam and cannot comment on what they would be like but it seems like it might be an option? www.coram.org.uk/how-we-do-it/coram-childrens-legal-centre-upholding-childrens-rights

Starlightstarbright1 · 24/07/2022 10:38

From what i have read on mumsnet previously.. it is very complicated.. how old are the children? Old enough to be heard?..

Goawayangryman · 24/07/2022 10:40

Coram is great. Reunite is the specialist in international child abduction ... Don't be frightened by the term, they advise both people who have removed children from a jurisdiction and the non-resident parent.

Cantbeliveyoufakeit · 24/07/2022 10:45

I wonder if Reunite or Rights of Women could give you advise OP? There is a section on the Reunite website for parents accused of abducting their children so that advise might be useful in terms of finding out how much of what he threatens (PA, Hague etc) would actually happen. I think knowledge is probably power here, he sounds the type to make threats without actually knowing whether they have any basis so I would be finding out everything you possibly can about where you really stand legally.

SolasAnla · 24/07/2022 10:49

Are you both citizens of the UK or citizens of the other country or dual citizens?

Are the children UK citizens or dual citizens?

If the European country is the one you lived in and left, you would be very foolish to bring the children back with its Court's jurisdiction, as he could go to Court to get an injunction preventing the children from leaving untill any custody and visitation issues was ruled on by the Court.

Quitelikeit · 24/07/2022 10:49

You married this man and had three children with him.

one, two, three

you are painting him as the devil but the guy wants to see his kids. I understand he has not lived up to your expectations but your attitude towards him is horrendous.

it really is heartbreaking for a child when their parents speak ill of each other.

try to find a positive. I’d be quite surprised if your children weren’t looking forward to seeing their father at all!!

Quartz2208 · 24/07/2022 10:51

how old are the children?

But yes look at the charities and get advice

MichelleScarn · 24/07/2022 10:51

mynamechangemyrules · 24/07/2022 10:27

I do- and I realise how shit I sound here- but I write it all out and he shoots it all down with ‘parental alienation’ ‘Hague’ and various threats.

You do NOT sound shit, he just sounds like even more of a twat. Make him do the leg work, don't deliver them to him.make him provide what they need.

Sapphirejane · 24/07/2022 10:53

@Quitelikeit - did you miss the part where even though the country doesn’t recognise coercive control it was still mentioned in the divorce?

Maybeebebe · 24/07/2022 10:53

Quitelikeit · 24/07/2022 10:49

You married this man and had three children with him.

one, two, three

you are painting him as the devil but the guy wants to see his kids. I understand he has not lived up to your expectations but your attitude towards him is horrendous.

it really is heartbreaking for a child when their parents speak ill of each other.

try to find a positive. I’d be quite surprised if your children weren’t looking forward to seeing their father at all!!

He puts this because all 3 have form in refusing to go (they all hate it- he schedules 'enriching' activities- usually where he self-teaches them- which they loathe and plans it around his social calendar/ desire to shop in the UK. Never relates to their interests.)

Doesn't sound like they would be looking forward to it to me.

Go full on legal, your dc are worth it