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Divorce/separation

Here you'll find divorce help and support from other Mners. For legal advice, you may find Advice Now guides useful.

Original poster

Dad - needs help on Christmas arrangements

49 replies

crazylife2022 · 30/01/2022 17:25

Hi,

I wasn't sure where to go and I came across mumsnet which I didn't know had this dedicated forum.

I'm in the final stages of my divorce due to my wife having an affair with her boss (they are both engineers and quite senior). What was horrific was that the AP's daughter was tutoring my two children and the AP's wife was also suffering with Cancer when I found out about the affair, there's lots more horrific stuff (video showers in the house, sending pics to him of my kids, omg it goes on forever). We'd been together about 17 years, happy I thought, no issues etc. It was the biggest shock of my life when I found out, I had absolutely no idea and trusted her.

My ex is Swedish, however the children have been brought up and born in the UK (10,13 girl boy). My wife wants to put in the parenting plan that every other year she takes then to Sweden for Christmas from the 20th - 27th Dec to spend with her parents. In the children's life I have been the most active parent and made the most sacrifice, I have always taken care of the children during her many business trips, collected from nursery, bathed them, a very active and loving dad which I still am. The thought of not seeing them even for a short time over Christmas makes me unhappy. I do not see why I and the children should be put at such detriment at that special time of the year. I have suggested that she spends a week before or after Christmas at her parents every year and have agreed she can have the children each Christmas eve (when Swedes celebrate).

This whole situation is playing heavy on my mind and I have no idea why she puts the children seeing her parents at Christmas above them seeing their father. During this year she also intents to take them to Sweden at Easter for a week and two week in the summer. Recently my son 13 has said that he does not want to go to Sweden for Christmas away from me and was quite upset about even discussing it.

I know opinions are just opinions, but if I agree to this am I being too reasonable? I don't have any family but my father who lives in Wales (4.5hrs away) so the reality is I would be spending Christmas alone without the two things in life that matter most to me.

Any help would be really appreciated.

OP posts:
Ouchiebum · 30/01/2022 17:32

I am both a child of divorced parents and a divorced parent of two children. And half Swedish as well.
Having lived this scenario from both sides I strongly feel that alternate Christmases where the children are settled for the entire Christmas period works best. That way there is no rush to go somewhere else. I hated having to leave jul on the 24th to go for Christmas with other parent on 25th.
I know this is new and upsetting and you are angry with your ex, but you need to step back and think about what’s best for the kids. And that’s being supported to have a relationship with both parents and their extended families. As well as experiencing their cultures and traditions.
Your children will appreciate you helping their relationship with their mum and her family. It will just become how things are done for them. I promise things will work out for you all.

SwayingInTime · 30/01/2022 17:35

Her suggestion does sound best for the children. I am a child of divorced parents and a stepmother.

bluejelly · 30/01/2022 17:36

I'm sorry you have been through such a tough time. I know it all feels very raw, but it is quite normal for divorced parents to take it in turns to have the children for Xmas. My stepchildren are with us one year, not the next. We've been like this for over 10 years now and it's really been fine for all concerned.

ArnoldBee · 30/01/2022 17:37

So practically were talking about the next 8 years so would be 4 Christmases to Sweden?

Twillow · 30/01/2022 17:38

It's difficult for you, but it's the best thing for the children that counts. It sounds reasonable that they have alternate Christmases with each.

Twillow · 30/01/2022 17:41

Sorry, just saw the comment your son made. You may well find as they progress into their teens that they make their own minds up. In that case, you can support your son in having a conversation with his mother. But try try try as hard as you can not to be disrespectful to their mother to them - it is a hard stone for a child to swallow. They need the role models of how adults should behave, regardless of what your wife has done that has devastated you.

RandomMess · 30/01/2022 17:46

Perhaps next 2 Christmas they stay in the UK and then alternating if the DC want that.

Original poster
crazylife2022 · 30/01/2022 17:47

Appreciate the comments. Just for clarity, I and my ex live very close due to schooling. She is a UK resident. This isn't about bitterness, it's about what's right. The children go to Sweden several times throughout the year and I think it would be much fairer if her parents came to the UK for Christmas. We have 50 50 care arrangements.

OP posts:
averythinline · 30/01/2022 17:48

The fact you have no other family to spend Christmas with is tough for you......but equally not your ex wife's problem...
You could do something completely different for Christmas when you don't have dc....beach holiday/skiing/working for a charity / yoga retreat.....
As an adult that got shuffled around at Christmas I think the whole week approach is better and less disruptive..for the children.

Uusually the parent who doesn't do Christmas gets new year so maybe work on your new year plans for those years....

Your son doesn't know what it will be like yet as it hasn't happened yet...and will sense your unhappiness which is not fair on him...

Please please think about how you can frame this in a good way for the children...bit of fake it till u make it... you've got a whole year to plan...

Same for the other holidays week at Easter and about 3 weeks in summer is the norm.

As a single parent you have to make sure your emotional needs are not met by your children...they will grow up and you won't be the most important thing in their lives which is how it should be...
With a 13yr old you are just starting the teen years where they make the moves for their independence so you need to be ready with your own network..

Not saying its easy and must really hurt but think of the long term

Original poster
crazylife2022 · 30/01/2022 18:15

I absolutely understand this. By the same token it's not really my problem that my ex's parents live in Sweden. Her parents play little part in the kids life, they don't call, are not particularly nice when we used to visit and I've always encouraged this contact. I already ski and yes can use the time to do that. However this is about the children and perhaps them being whisked away to Sweden this year after the divorce is not the best way for them to get used to the new situation. But I take on everyone's point and compromise seems the best approach. I do sometimes wonder what the replies would be if I was writing this from a woman's context as female friends have said they could never be away from their kids over Xmas.. but I suppose they are not in this situation.

OP posts:
Ouchiebum · 30/01/2022 18:21

I’m a woman and away from my children every other year at Christmas. I have said the same thing to you as I would to a woman - the children need you both, Christmas should alternate.

You need to step back from your emotions and support your children through this. They are not being “whisked off” and using that kind of emotive language is not helpful for you or them.

auberJohn · 30/01/2022 18:27

I am a single dad and have learnt to pick my battles. If you show compromise on this, you will have some co-parenting credit.

There will probably be some bigger co-parenting issues to deal with in the future.

Original poster
crazylife2022 · 30/01/2022 18:31

@Ouchiebum

I’m a woman and away from my children every other year at Christmas. I have said the same thing to you as I would to a woman - the children need you both, Christmas should alternate.

You need to step back from your emotions and support your children through this. They are not being “whisked off” and using that kind of emotive language is not helpful for you or them.

Sorry but I feel you are making assumptions here. I would never and have never used this phrase with the children and never talk about there mom to them with anything but niceness. Yes this is emotive, hence why I have come here for advice and am open to the advice. However I'm also entitled to express an opinion. And I do fully support my children...
OP posts:
Original poster
crazylife2022 · 30/01/2022 18:35

@auberJohn

I am a single dad and have learnt to pick my battles. If you show compromise on this, you will have some co-parenting credit.

There will probably be some bigger co-parenting issues to deal with in the future.

Absolutely, I know it's about compromise but in all areas of this divorce my ex wants everything.. For 13 years she didn't really give a damn about the kids, now all of a sudden she shows interest. But then I think she is potentially a nacacist...
OP posts:
titchy · 30/01/2022 18:41

Alternating Christmas is pretty normal for separated parents. As long as the trips to Sweden fall when it's her turn I don't see the problem tbh. The only issue might be that schools don't break up till after the 20th often so don't be tied down to specific dates. Just agree from either 20th or when school breaks up whatever is the latest till 27th.

gonnabeok · 30/01/2022 18:42

you need to suck it up Im afraid. She cannot tell you what to do with the children when they spend christmas with you and you cannot tell her what to do with the children when the children are with her every alternate christmas. The only other way is to split christmas which some parents do. So have them from 20th december to christmas monring one year and from chrismas afternoon to 29th December the next year. Then you get to see them every christmas for a realistic period of time. I know many divorced couples who this works well for.

Ionlydomassiveones · 30/01/2022 18:44

This reply has been withdrawn

This has been withdrawn at the poster's request.

madisonbridges · 30/01/2022 18:44

Say you went along with this, would she expect to see the children when you had them for Christmas, so Christmas eve, boxing day? Calling round. So you forfeit every other year and she gets to enjoy them every year. I know it sounds petty of me, but that would annoy me too because reasonably you couldn't prevent your children from seeing their mother over Christmas in the UK.

Original poster
crazylife2022 · 30/01/2022 18:53

@madisonbridges

Say you went along with this, would she expect to see the children when you had them for Christmas, so Christmas eve, boxing day? Calling round. So you forfeit every other year and she gets to enjoy them every year. I know it sounds petty of me, but that would annoy me too because reasonably you couldn't prevent your children from seeing their mother over Christmas in the UK.
Yes she would expect that and wants to take them to Sweden the week before or after Christmas. This is the issue, it is only me that would not be able to see the children. I would never restrict her access to the children and couldn't bring myself to stopping them seeing her over Christmas, that would be totally wrong as we live so close.
OP posts:
averythinline · 30/01/2022 18:55

I would say the same to either parent posts would be the same if you were male or female...this is the norm when families spilt up....your posts are very angry.....maybe understandably but that's not going to help your DC..

Maybe see it that the kids get an extra holiday/see a different culture its educational..etc etc...

Original poster
crazylife2022 · 30/01/2022 18:58

@gonnabeok

you need to suck it up Im afraid. She cannot tell you what to do with the children when they spend christmas with you and you cannot tell her what to do with the children when the children are with her every alternate christmas. The only other way is to split christmas which some parents do. So have them from 20th december to christmas monring one year and from chrismas afternoon to 29th December the next year. Then you get to see them every christmas for a realistic period of time. I know many divorced couples who this works well for.
I would be totally happy with that. But it doesn't work as she want to be in Sweden. It's complex and she's insisting that they are away for a whole week over Christmas..
OP posts:
Original poster
crazylife2022 · 30/01/2022 18:59

@averythinline

I would say the same to either parent posts would be the same if you were male or female...this is the norm when families spilt up....your posts are very angry.....maybe understandably but that's not going to help your DC..

Maybe see it that the kids get an extra holiday/see a different culture its educational..etc etc...

I don't think they are angry at all! I'm just trying to be articulate and precise. Yes this is emotive, but angry, er no. If I was angry I wouldn't be trying to get some constructive advice..
OP posts:
Hoppinggreen · 30/01/2022 19:01

Sounds like you have been through a tough time and your wife has behaved badly.
BUT I do think that the alternate Christmas arrangements will probably work better for your children.
I appreciate you want to punish your wife and I actually don’t blame you and I’m sure it will be a bit shit to be on your own every other Christmas but you will have to get past all that

nocoolnamesleft · 30/01/2022 19:03

They're half Swedish. I would think it would be important for them to spend some time in Sweden, with the Swedish part of their family, learning about their Swedish heritage.

Original poster
crazylife2022 · 30/01/2022 19:04

@Hoppinggreen

Sounds like you have been through a tough time and your wife has behaved badly. BUT I do think that the alternate Christmas arrangements will probably work better for your children. I appreciate you want to punish your wife and I actually don’t blame you and I’m sure it will be a bit shit to be on your own every other Christmas but you will have to get past all that
I don't think it's about punishment at all. In fact I'd say it feels like she is trying to punish me! The children don't really want to spend Christmas on an island in the middle of nowhere! But I have always encouraged their culture. There's many other issues at play, far too complex to discuss here. But perhaps compromise and endorsing this is the way forward.. it's been good to read the replies, really useful and helpful
OP posts:
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