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Divorce/separation

Here you'll find divorce help and support from other Mners. For legal advice, you may find Advice Now guides useful.

Original poster

Separation after 20 years together, 2 dc

49 replies

Igiorni42 · 03/10/2021 22:52

We’ve been together since 2000, bought house together in 2003, had 2 kids 2007 and 2008, married in 2009.

Dh brought about 90k into our first joint house purchase in 2003. I had about 15k savings that I contributed. He is very insistent that he wants to ‘protect his investment’ we’re we to split, so I assume that the equity will be 15:90, ie 1:6 in his favour :(

I’ve been a sahm (through mutual agreement) since 2007. I’ve built up a self employed, seasonal and part time income to work around school hours. I was planning to return to ‘proper’ work sooner but our eldest is sen so i ended up wfh, when I could, around their school hours. I earn about 16k per year. He earns nearer 90k, plus bonuses.

So ive been out of the workplace for over 14 years. I have a lot of academic qualifications (masters degree and a professional qualification) but absolutely no recent experience. I applied for an admin assistant job and didn’t even get an interview :(

We have about 550-600k equity in our house. Which seems like a lot, but you can barely get a 3 bed terrace for less than 400k in our area. I can’t move areas, as I’d never in a million years get ds (sen) into such a good school as he is in at the moment.

Am I unreasonable to ask that stbx dh gets a mortgage of, say 450k against the family home. This, plus our savings, would enable him to be a cash buyer for a reasonable 3 bed house. In return, I’d ask him to pay the mortgage on the family home for 5-6 years, so the kids and I could (just about) manage to stay here till they leave for uni. I think I’d be able to get benefits on my variable self employed income, as I am restricted with working hours due to ds’ sen (he gets dla).

When the kids are settled at uni (5-6years time) I’ll sell the house, dh can pay off his mortgage and I’ll take what is left and buy a flat somewhere cheaper.

Does this sound reasonable? Dh is convinced I’m trying to fleece him :(

OP posts:
MrsBertBibby · 03/10/2021 22:59

Long marriage with kids, so starting point is equality, and your needs (as lower earner) need to be met.

You need to see a family solicitor, but no, it won't be 15:90.

Plus you'll be equalising pensions.

RandomMess · 03/10/2021 23:00

You are married, legally the house, pensions and any other assets are marital assets especially as you co-habits for years before marriage and have DC.

The starting point is 50:50 so your H needs to seek legal advice and realise he's being ridiculous and if you have the DC most of the time and sacrificed building a career to be a SAHM so he could build his you are highly likely to get more like 60% of all assets (after debts).

How's his pension, has he even had it valued?

You need a solicitor recommendation and get a shit hot one as I suspect he will get nasty when he realises how much you are entitled to a she will try and bully or emotionally blackmail you into accepting less.

Original poster
Igiorni42 · 03/10/2021 23:07

Thank you.

As he was the higher earner, it made sense to pay into his pension and not mine. I only have about 30k pension pot (I’m 48 :( ) but he has about 150k, probably a lot more as since we started finding things hard he stopped overpaying the mortgage and is maxing out his pension contributions.

I’m not convinced by the ‘get a shit hot lawyer’ argument as I really don’t want to be seen as fleecing him. I want to find an arrangement that is fair for us both.

OP posts:
frazzledfragglefromfragglerock · 03/10/2021 23:09

But if you don't have a shit hot lawyer you could end up with an arrangement that's not fair to you.

Original poster
Igiorni42 · 03/10/2021 23:11

If we were to both go to a solicitor and suggest the 15:90 split, would the solicitor say that wasn’t a fair split? Or would they look at the assets brought into the marriage and base it on that?

OP posts:
AutumnColours9 · 03/10/2021 23:13

The starting point is half of everything. Then you will possibly get more due to restrictions on earning potential. Either way you should get way more than 1/6. Get a good family lawyer and pension reports.

Original poster
Igiorni42 · 03/10/2021 23:15

@frazzledfragglefromfragglerock I want it to be as fair as possible to us both. His view is that he’s worked 24/7 for the last 15 years to put a roof over our heads. My view is that I’ve put myself in a vulnerable position, having not had a ‘proper’ job for 15 years latterly due to ds’s sen. He values money more than I do and wants to retire early, free of financial constraints. I’m just happy with a comfortable, quiet retirement.

OP posts:
MrsBertBibby · 03/10/2021 23:17

I'm a family solicitor, OP, and I'm pretty good at it.

I really do recommend getting a good lawyer. Shit lawyers cost their clients a lot more.

The overriding task for the Court in financial remedy proceedings is to find an outcome that is fair. Good lawyers work on achieving that for you.

RandomMess · 03/10/2021 23:17

I decent lawyer would say to split the house equity as per original deposit.

Same with his pension you enabled him to work and career climb to invest in that pension pot.

They would be saying 50:50 of all pensions and house equity as still probably unfair to you.

FVFrog · 03/10/2021 23:17

You don’t need a shit hot lawyer. But you do need a good family solicitor. I am recently divorced (long marriage). You can come to a financial agreement through mediation but you must have legal advice. It’s not a matter of anyone fleecing anyone but making sure that the marriage assets are fairly divided (and that doesn’t always mean 50/50) and that your contribution as main caregiver is given equal weight to that of the main money earner. Please do not sell yourself short. And make sure you have decent pension provision. Good luck. It’s not an easy time no matter how amicable.

ChairLegs · 03/10/2021 23:18

The very idea of you even entertaining that sort of split given the length of your relationship, marriage and what you have sacrificed for the sake of the family the two of you created tells me that you absolutely need a lawyer. Not because you should be trying to "fleece" him but because you clearly have absolutely no idea of the true value of your contribution to the marriage and you need someone to represent you who does.

That sort of split - when you have been a sahm to two children, one with sen, and presumably will continue to be the primary carer or at the very least equal parent - is, with respect, absolutely bonkers to my ear.

MrsBertBibby · 03/10/2021 23:20

The Court will weigh your respective contributions equally, OP. His earnings, your child rearing. He doesn't get more because he was the one with a salary.

RandomMess · 03/10/2021 23:20

He was only able to work 24/7 because you ran the household and looked after the DC.

How much does he think a nanny and housekeeper would have cost him per year including employee costs inc their pension contributions?

Have you been claiming child benefit all this time to protect your state pension? If your child has SEN are you ever going to be able to work?

MooseBeTimeForSummer · 03/10/2021 23:20

He didn’t take steps to protect his 90K, so what you each brought into the marriage doesn’t matter. 50/50 will be the starting point.

Get advice on what your mortgage capacity is. There is a strong argument for you getting more of the equity if you can’t borrow much AND you offset your interest in his pension against it.

HerRoyalNotness · 03/10/2021 23:21

FFS men. You’re not fleecing him. He’s worked for the money, you’ve worked in the home looking after the D.C., and worked. Your contributions are equal over a long time, don’t let him call the shots and fleece YOU!

FVFrog · 03/10/2021 23:21

@Igiorni42 he may want to retire early free of financial restraints but the reality is he may not be able to. He will be obliged to continue to meet his financial commitments to his family (as he is the one whose career has continued unhindered). Divorce is expensive, everyone ends up worse off than if the family unit stays together, that’s just how it is.

Original poster
Igiorni42 · 03/10/2021 23:22

@MrsBertBibby how do I find a good lawyer that will try to be fair for the both of us?

We did a mediation session, that cost £400 for 90 mins of talking about the child arrangements (she was typing her notes during the session, but wasn’t a very fast typist…) but I’m not sure that this is the way to continue. Dh said in meditation that he wanted the children and I to remain in the marital home - but then, the next day, he is telling me we need to sell the house and buy 2 homes. Which (as above) I don’t think we can afford.

OP posts:
MrsBertBibby · 03/10/2021 23:23

Whereabouts are you? If uou're London/surrey/sussex/Kent I can probably suggest someone.

Original poster
Igiorni42 · 03/10/2021 23:27

He is also saying he is going to quit his job, as he can’t deal with the impact on his mental health of his work as well as our marriage problems. We are both struggling with our mental health due to the marriage problems - I’m on medication just to cope day to day.

If he quit work, where would I stand?

OP posts:
Original poster
Igiorni42 · 03/10/2021 23:28

@MrsBertBibby I’m in W sussex.

OP posts:
DustyOwl · 03/10/2021 23:29

Please don't think about being fair to him, as it sounds like he's not being fair to you. He does not value you or the work you've done at home, so he could go to work himself.

My MIL tried to be fair, her XH was not. She is now struggling on a tiny pension, while he lives a very comfortable life indeed. Think carefully and ignore his accusations of "fleecing" him.

MrsBertBibby · 03/10/2021 23:31

OK, I'll DM you some suggestions tomorrow OP.

RandomMess · 03/10/2021 23:36

Hmmm if he quits work and draws down his pension early as a monthly income it's no longer a marital asset.

Sounds like he is way ahead of you on the finances tbh!!

Realistically yes you may have to sell the house to buy 2 cheaper ones, not the end of the world.

If he quits work he won't be paying much child maintenance via CMS but as soon as he starts working again then you can claim it.

Sounds like you need to get a smaller property mortgage free to be able to cope on your low income and any maintenance you receive will be an added bonus.

If he agrees that the DC reside with you then he could conceivably get a 2 bed place and the DS share the one or two nights per week they stay over with him or stay on different nights depending on what they want?

Original poster
Igiorni42 · 03/10/2021 23:46

@FVFrog you’re right, we’ll all be financially worse off if dh and I separate. Dh is insisting he doesn’t want to separate, so I have to make the decision. It’s my responsibility.

But what a decision - not separating means living in this awful, absolute hellish non communicative limbo until the kids leave home. Such an unhealthy example to set :(

So I have to make the choice to separate. But that means that it’s my fault we are separating. So I’m ‘fleecing’ him as well as being the cause of the separation, in his eyes :(

@MooseBeTimeForSummer he did protect his 90k, in that it was the deposit for our first home. My 15k was in an isa as an emergency fund, so his 90k has grown massively with the house market compared to 15k in an isa 🤣

@RandomMess yes, I’ve been claiming child benefit, and then doing dh’s tax returns to pay it back, for as long as it’s been necessary. So, at least I’ve got my NI contributions covered. Although my sen ds is at mainstream secondary, I’d probably not be able to hold down a full time job. I wouldn’t like to leave him for more than 30mins of so at home alone in the hols. He needs taking and picking up from school. He often is difficult in the mornings, meaning I’d not get into a 9am start on time. I get called during school hours to collect him if he can’t cope. I have to attend send meetings during school hours.

But my dh thinks I’m using all of this as ‘an excuse’…

OP posts:
Original poster
Igiorni42 · 03/10/2021 23:49

@RandomMess can he do that? Quit and also draw down his pension early? He is 48.

OP posts:
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