Please come and talk to me. Just for some general writing chat and support...

[BiglyBadgers]

I am about a third of the way through editing my stupidly long book (this'll teach me for writing epic fantasy) and need some chat!

I really loved the chat and support on the nano thread, but now novel writing month is long gone and I am alone! There must be other people out there bumbling along needing a friend to chat to...surely....I can provide coffee, cake and excellent free WiFi

Hi witch. Glad you made it over! . I'm off to the panto today and thinking of you

You have all convinced me. I am adding WWZ to my reading list. I have an audible credit floating about so might get it on audio book just for fun. I'm currently avoiding reading any fantasy and have been reading lots of crime. Currently reading some Scottish detective thing which has great police procedure, but I'm not absolutely convinced the writer has ever met a real, live woman. His female characters are all

SGB I might need to get some lessons from you as I have realised I am actually incapable of writing a sex scene. Despite the fact I am not at all a prudish person (or at least have never thought of myself as one) I have realised when it comes to writing it down I sort of go all 1950s film noir and can't get past a moody kiss and shared glass of whiskey.

Queen you can absolutely pants if you know the end. I usually have a couple of big scenes of stuff that needs to happen in my head and then just sit down and write hoping all my characters will end up in the correct places at the right time. My current book is the first in a series and all I know for the next book is one scene towards the end when loads of characters are going to die. I'm trying hard not to think about it too much now until I get this editing done and I can get writing.

Morning, may I join too?

Agent seems to have pretty much sold my first novel (we're waiting on offer in writing- it all takes so bloody long) and I'm also currently convinced that I only have one book in me and that from now on I'm just going to disappoint him.

But I have a plan for the year and yesterday I wrote the first chapter of something new and having just re-read it, it's not bad.

Having a thread to pop into at tea-break time and see what everyone's up to would be lovely.

Do join us Burning! It's lovely having people at different stages on the thread. Always plenty of tea about here

What sort of stuff do you write?

The novel that's currently out on submission is historical crime fiction set just after WW1. It's the first in a series but I'm being superstitious about writing the next one until it's sold. I have a outline though so it's not a big deal to get cracking when I need to. The new one is a contemporary thriller about missing people, what it's like to be forced to return to your home town, how easy it is or isn't to disappear - that kind of thing.

Like you said, I can't read the genre I'm writing while I'm actually writing so I have a massive TBR pile of crime.

@BiglyBadgers happy to recommend some erotica authors to read (often good to see what other people do, either because you think, hmm, that's a good way of handling it or eww, FFS, I can do better than that...).

When I was a sulky teen writing dreadful thrillers/sci-fi-ish romances (I was great at Mary-Sue stuff before the concept had a name) I remember reading a piece of writing advice along the lines of describing a character's sex life could provide important information about who that character was. At the time (OK, I was 16 with no real experience) I thought: eww. No. Now I think it's a pretty good point - is the character sexually confident/competent? Does s/he have any kinks? This stuff is all interesting even when you're not specifically writing erotica.

Certain - I hate the word 'pantser' too. It makes me shudder. Some people are planners, some aren't. Neither is better - it just depends what works for you.

With the current book I know roughly what happens and I've planned the first few chapters but I think I'll probably carry on like that, planning a few at a time as I go along. I haven't decided on the end and I can't write the first chapter until I do, so I started with Chapter 2. It doesn't bother me not knowing the end because if it surprises me then hopefully it will surprise the reader too. And a second draft is for smoothing out those details.

That's a really good point about sex being a part of the character SGB. I have read a fair bit of erotica and sex scenes, it's just when it comes to me writing it when I freeze up. I think I just find it a bit personal. Really, I just need to get over it I guess. Maybe I should write some erotic short stories that are not for sharing and slowly build up to adding it into stuff I let other people read.

The term pantser isn't a nice one, but it is helpfully short and people know what you mean when you say it. I read a book called Writing into the Dark about writing without a plan, which I thought was rather a poetic way of putting it, but a bit of a mouthful.

Pantsing is just so very American. Can't we have our own terribly British version?

I've tried it this morning and got a mere 700 words out. It feels far more exhausting to me than preplanned writing and I have no idea how long the story will be. Doesn't it weird you out not knowing how much story is in there?

I like 'winging it', which I think is a rather British term isn't it...could bearing there

No, it doesn't bother me at all Queen. I like not knowing where it's going. As you get moving you get a feel for the shape and size of it. 700 is pretty good for a morning. It is a fallacy that not planning is quicker than planning. I don't think it is, you just do the working out and writing all at the same time rather than separately. You still need to do the same work, if that makes sense.

Bearing = be wrong

My inability to proofread is probably why I have so much editing to do.

Bigly, I know where you're coming from. I'm the reader that skims over sex scenes to get to the story but also write shorts for one handed readers I wasn't going to mention it but I can tell you it's a case of throwing yourself in there and getting over the hump of personal embarrassment. It gets easier the more you do it and people reading it isn't half as bad as you think it will be. There's also a market for shorts on amazon if you self publish. It can be a bit easier to get validation from anonymous royalty payments

Yes, that's what I'm finding exhausting, my brain is doing all the working out on the fly. Which is fine for a short but it has an undercurrent of fear and lostness for something so long. Maybe that will ease off as I get more into it I'm going to continue planning and writing the other one alongside to see what I prefer

Hello CertainHalf, Yes, you could be right about the pre-schooler/new born thing, I hadn't thought about it like that...and perhaps it buys me a bit more time (if I can work through the sleep deprivation bit) but yes, certainly the walking and thinking go hand in hand for me too, feeling a bit more optimistic about it now.

Hi everyone can I join too. I'm in submission hell limbo. Apparently my genre is quite niche though, so a couple of agents have told me anyway, so its difficult to find one as publishers tend to only have one author of this genre wish I'd known that before I wrote my novel.

I am feeling seriously unable to wrote sex scenes too. Which is tough given that there is a mad impulsive lustful affair at the heart of my story.

I can just imagine everyone I know (dd's teachers, old schoolfriends) crowding behind me looking over my shoulder going 'oooooh. Who would have thought Certain was like that?' as I write.

Which is putting me right off.

I really enjoy writing sex scenes but they don't have much of a place in what I'm writing. My first draft had quite a lot of sex scenes in but I took them out because they didn't need to be there. I've written some erotic fiction but never done anything with it. Did those of you who've published erotic fiction self publish?

That's pretty much exactly what happens to me certain! There is flipping tons of sex in my book, its just that the camera pans away around the removal of clothes. I have decided that once I finish my editing I am going to sit myself down, have a strong word and just get on and write some steamy sex.

Can I ask what your niche genre is homtardy. I am just too curious now.

Could you throw me some of your discarded sex maybe everyone?

I think I worry about being clichéd too. But I also think my target audience is probably wimmin aged 30-55 ish and that they will enjoy a bit of a vicarious hot shag.

Gah! I need to get out of my comfort zone in 2018 don't I?

Certain, ime you should be more prepared for finding out everyone you know can't wait to get their hands on filth. That was surprising.

Hom, yes self published on amazon. Those of you who publish, do you know if having self published is a plus or minus for traditional publishers?

I had no idea it was a niche Bigly, i just thought it was a thriller. But I've been told it's a gangland saga, its in the style of Jessie Keane/ Martina Cole etc.

Have you had much success with your self published work Queen?

Oh, I wouldn't have thought that was particularly niche either. Fancy.

I just made the mistake of looking at how you go about submitting work to agents and it seems like an amazing amount of effort. Not to mention the fact that there don't seem to be that many agents that specialise in fantasy. I am even more impressed by those of you who have managed it. Think I will just pretend I never looked and go back to ignoring the possibility completely.

A lot of erotica writers self-publish though it is a myth that they all make lots of money. The ones who sell copies are the ones who self-market, tirelessly (and in many cases the books are pretty grim TBH. Unedited, full of typos and hopelessly generic.) There are also publishers looking for erotica. I will be looking for contributions to anthologies in the near future so I will come back and poke you all.

One tip - if you worry that writing sex feels too personal, have a go at writing a sex scene from the viewpoint of the opposite sex. It doesn't have to be anatomical: some really horny, filthy sex stuff barely mentions genitalia.

In fact the more I think about it the more I think I would really struggle to sell this book. The sort of epic fantasy I am writing is very male dominated. Mine is classic swords and revenge fantasy, but with predominantly female characters (some of whom are bisexual or lesbian). People looking for women's fantasy stuff will think it is too swords and sorcery, whereas the swords and sorcery types will freak out about all the kick arse women in it. Ho hum. At least I'm enjoying myself.

That is a lovely tip SGB. I'm starting to quite look forward to having a go at writing some sauce now