Moving to NI questions

[hedgehoggle]

This is something we've started mooting for various reasons such as housing, quality of life... but had a few practical questions. Hopefully someone will be able to help!

We're considering areas around Belfast and I wondered:

1. How difficult is it to find a primary place? DS would be 5/6 probably, we are Catholic if that makes a difference.
2. How difficult is it to find a nursery place? DD will be around 1/2
3. What's the NHS like? And maternity care? Although maternity care couldn't be much worse than some places by us!

Thanks so much for any answers

And what about the rest of the hospital staff who aren’t consultants? The nurses and the auxiliaries and the porters and the kitchen staff? Or is she only going to talk to the doctors?
my point is- Belfast as a whole is nothing like SOME parts of BT9. (You seem to be oblivious to Sandy row/ tates Avenue/ the village).

I would agree about the reduction of traditional Nationalist/Loyalist sectarianism BUT some of that has been replaced by old fashioned racism.

There still remains a mistrust of outsiders and a large dollop of cinicism for those who left during the Troubles and then came back.

I honestly think that you’re just being difficult for the sake of it now. To be frank you sound quite jealous. Do you realise that you’re not going to be best friends with every single colleague? Of course she’s polite and courteous to everyone, that doesn’t mean that she needs to be ‘included’ in their social circle? I’ve worked in hospitals for 30 years - my closest friends have always been the ones to have similar circumstances to me. In other words, we do the same job and have similar lives. That’s simply how the world and relationships work.

Will post a proper reply in the morning as right now I can’t be bothered arguing any further.

And who do you think they are controlled - the Sally Army??!

I can totally reassure you that my YP do not espouse racism, homophobia, transphobia or any other fucking phobia!! Let it go!!

Why do you think I'm talking about YOUR kids?

DD who has been working in Belfast for 18 months was assured by a Catholic friend that the best traybakes come from the Ballymena bible belt. The more religious the town the better the bake.

More seriously DD is living in a
marginal East/South Belfast area and has not had any problems. When she was buying, a Catholic neighbour kindly invited us in (for a cup of tea and a traybake) and explained that though she had initially been worried about buying there it was fine. Stay away from the Cregagh during peak marching season but otherwise there were no issues. Property is so expensive that inevitably first time buyers are having to look at more marginal areas and housing stock in East Belfast is generally solid. Streets with fleggs seem to be in retreat. DD nods to a few of her neighbours but has no reason to know what religion they are. They mainly seem to be younger people, at work all day and with busy lives. Like London.

Over Christmas we did the van Morrison walking trail through Orangefield and other working class areas in East Belfast and it did not occur to us that we might be unsafe.

That does not mean that religious differences don't matter. Her peers are careful, but then too are people in London who would not want to offend a Muslim colleague. DD had some initial teasing about being English but has made friends from both 'sides', evidenced by the fact she was invited to play both GAA and rugby. (Mercifully Catholic friends were clear that it had to be football not camogie - the latter was too dangerous for someone who did not start aged four.)

It's over 25 years since the ceasefire. Young adults don't remember the troubles and absolutely don't want them to return. Yes there are still huge issues: drugs and unemployment as well as sectarianism. However like in most cities things are fine if you pick the right area. And Belfast has a real buzz: restaurants, bakeries, bars, some great parks, a lovely cinema at the University, etc.

@OzCalling She must be jealous of how much the price of your house has risen in the "popular and cosmopolitan" area, no other explanation for it 😉
Btw, do NI-born people who tell it like it is need to educate themselves too, or only the foreigners?

SOME parts of BT9. (You seem to be oblivious to Sandy row/ tates Avenue/ the village).

Sandy Row's BT12. (Where my DP - who is rather oblivious to these things - rented a flat when first moving here. He assumed the flags were 'something to do with the jubilee'.)

You are right but it backs on to BT9 and two mins walk from the very prestigious and very diverse school referred to (which is culturally diverse but not really economic and still has a strong Protestant culture- religious services and no traditional Irish sports- no issue with this but it isn’t quite the cultural melting pot portrayed).

I don't think it's been replaced by racism - I think that was always there but because people didn't tend to move her to live, there was no-one to hate on.

Bigots gotta bigot!

It's true about the traybakes btw lol!

Belfast has a great buzz now. It's a world away from what it was when I was a student in the 80s.

We were so innocent (foolish!) when I look back. The police would put up white tape if there was a bomb scare to keep people away - my friends and I used to try and circumvent it to get to where we wanted to be! I don't think we ever felt scared or intimidated - and we should have, big-time!

I keep coming back to this thread and trying to verbalise how I feel and not being able to. Thing is, I can’t pretend that some of the negative things on this thread aren’t true – there IS still a big religious influence and it IS homogeneously white and there IS a suspicion of “blow ins” at times… but still, I wouldn’t want to live anywhere else. What’s different for me in NI than it was in England – where I’m from, and where I lived in various different parts for most of my life – is that here, in general, people assume the best about you, and it’s safe to do likewise. Most people are inherently good and helpful and upfront in a way I haven’t found anywhere else. They might be misguided sometimes, or ill-informed, or a bit blinkered – but they mean well. And that’s not to be sniffed at.

It’s not perfect, and I spent the first three or four years desperate to go back to London. But now I’ve found my tribe and I can’t imagine bringing up my daughter anywhere else.

DD felt at home immediately. Indeed before then as she had met a group from NI at university.

Coming to NI now will be different to growing up when sectarian divides were at their height. Those memories of being shunned because you were the wrong religion: not getting a job, insulted etc, won't go away. It is there below the surface but DD has been able to float above it - not her issue. Instead she has had a warm welcome in a place that is vibrant, friendly, safer, cheaper and more straightforward and manageable than London.

I recently met someone who had grown up in NI but left for University. Now close to retirement, she returned and decided to do the tourist thing. She explained to the black cab tour person that though she had lost the accent she was from Belfast. His tour started with "As a Protestant you may not be aware..". She was astonished at how antennae remain finely tuned. This presumably will colour perceptions.

DH has a colleague who similarly left NI at 18 but regularly returns to visit family and who gave us some good recommendations of places to visit and eat. She was surprisingly delighted when he reported back saying we had a great time. She loves NI and hated the false impressions, coloured by news coverage 25+ years old, that so many people in England have about the place.

I was born and bred and have lived most of my life in NI. I did a stint in London in my 20s, and I'm so glad I did, because living away from NI does so much to broaden the mind! Not that I was ever in any sense 'bigoted'! I grew up in a mixed rural community where religion and politics were never an issue. I went to a grammar school where I had friends from both 'communities', and same when I went to uni.

Through my work, I know that the old divides are still very much there in some communities. I've been shocked, in all honesty. I've worked with a colleague with close links to the UDA, and one with close links to the IRA. My sibling shared a flat at uni with a fellow student who was later jailed for IRA membership/activities.

But, life goes on. I honestly do not believe sectarianism dominates life in NI the way it used to.

https://www.facebook.com/share/v/18h6hiZmue/?mibextid=wwXIfr
funny as true 🙈

Wow, this thread got a bit busy and I'm catching up!

Thanks all for views - everything is helpful.

We are actually visiting over Feb half term to have a bit of a scope - staying on Ormeau Rd. I can't remember if i stated, but I am Welsh, husband is English, kids are English. But we would really hope that doesn't make a difference!

I think we are looking at scoping Ormeau - possibly an area around botanical gardens as well I think?

They were the two areas (down the Lisburn Road beyond the Botanic Gardens) DD and I focussed on when she was looking to buy.

Definitely try La Taqueria on Ormeau Road, apparently part owned by a member of Snow Patrol as well as the owner of the Mourne Seafood Bar. Fish tacos are good.

Will you be renting or buying? We found there was better value slightly further north, close to the park but nearer to the boundary with East Belfast and a sense that the area is improving. But if you are renting proximity to schools will be more important. Good luck. We went over for Christmas and had a wonderful time.

Have you got school places sorted?

Botanic gardens is a bit studenty unless you get one of the massive houses on Rugby Road!

need to be careful with this area. Botanic avenue is nothing like how it was 20 years ago- due to the housing shortage in Belfast hotels in this area are now being used as homeless accommodation. Further up around Ravenhill/ Pirrie is lovely but avoid holy lands and below towards city centre.

Parts of Lisburn Road (side nearest Malone Road) and Malone are nicer than Ormeau.
Ravenhill/ Rosetta nice. Around Stormont and parts of Ballyhackamore ok. But pretty much everywhere else in Belfast I wouldn’t be keen on if not from there/ have family.
I personally would go a bit further out to Holywood, Helen’s Bay, Crawfordsburn, Cultra or Hilsborough/ Moira. Good train links from most of these.

Check who the local councillors are- if DUP or SF look carefully.

If you’re considering buying a property do you mind sharing what your budget is? South and east Belfast have some lovely areas however I would say the further up the ormeau road you go heading away from the city centre is a nicer area to live in whilst still having all the amenities only a few minutes walk away. Again East has lovely areas too but anywhere near to busy area with bars, restaurants, cafes are always more expensive.

But pretty much everywhere else in Belfast I wouldn’t be keen on if not from there/ have family.

Balmoral is fine for incomers. And free entertainment, if you're close enough to the King's Hall - we caught the Springsteen tour by opening a window rather than buying a ticket.

The King's Hall is no longer a concert venue. It's now a health and wellbeing park!