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Britain Is In Steep Decline But Govt Is Busy Distracting Us With Ideologies

80 replies

Maggispice · 12/12/2024 14:43

"Britain is going through a period of major decline. Ipsos poll conducted earlier this year found that “68% of people in Britain say the country is in decline. [This] marks a sharp increase since 2021 when only 48% agreed that the country was in decline.”
Why do British people feel this way? Let’s look at the facts.
Politicians tell us the economy is growing. And who could disagree? In 2023, Britain’s economy grew by a whopping 0.1%! This magnificent result was achieved despite the economy shrinking by 0.3% in the last quarter of 2023 and 0.1% in the quarter before. When I was studying economics at university, we were taught that two consecutive quarters of “negative growth” was called a “recession”. Today, we call that “building an innovative economy”.
But are these figures an accurate reflection of British living standards? Not even close. Forget the fact that heroin consumption and prostitution contribute more to our GDP than volunteer work. Let’s look at GDP per capita, i.e. how much economic activity we produce per person. This is where the reality of British decline really comes to the fore:

What you can see from this graph is that GDP per capita fell sharply during the Great Financial Crisis of 2007-2008 and has still not recovered. What is more, this graph is not adjusted for inflation which, as we all know, has been a massive problem for years. Put simply, on average, British people are poorer today than they were in 2007.
And this is no accident. Because our politicians are judged on whether they have delivered GDP growth, they don’t actually care about whether you and I are richer or poorer. This is why the country experienced unprecedented immigration levels under the Blair/Brown Labour Government, and then even higher levels under the Cameron/May/Johnson/Truss/Sunak Conservative Governments. The easiest way to deliver GDP growth is to increase the number of people in the country. The way they have done this (importing low skilled, low wage workers) makes us poorer, but in a way that politicians can’t be blamed for.
Economic growth in Britain is not just anaemic, it’s an accounting trick. Think of it like this: You are a family with two children. Both parents earn the average British salary of £35,000 a year. Your household’s “GDP” is £70,000. Then your in-laws move in with you and chip in another £10,000 a year. Your GDP has grown by £10,000, but your GDP per capita has fallen from £17,500 (70,000/4) to £13,333 (80,000/6). Your household now makes more money, but each person is poorer. That’s Britain in a nutshell.
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Money isn’t everything, of course, but the lack of it makes everything worse. The crumbling infrastructure, the release of dangerous criminals from prison because of overcrowding, the failure to catch criminals or even investigate crimes, growing NHS waiting lists and even the anger that spills out during riots is a product, in large part, of a stagnating economy.
The housing crisis means that across the country the average age of a first-time buyer is now almost 34. In London, where all the good jobs are, that is now nearly 37. In other words, even for people who can afford their own home, the point at which they are likely to buy one is now so late in life they may struggle to have children for purely biological reasons. While housing is not the only cause, it is clearly a contributing factor to the halving of Britain’s Total Fertility Rate in just 60 years. In 1964, British women had 2.93 children on average. Today we are well below replacement at 1.59.
Falling fertility rates are a common phenomenon across the Western world and beyond, one that has cultural, economic and spiritual dimensions. But the fact remains that a society not having enough children to replace its population is doomed to face both decline and the uncontrolled mass immigration we’re seeing today.
A nation can endure and bounce back from periods of stagnation and even decline, provided there is a sense of common purpose and a willingness to be honest about the problems it faces. In Britain, we have neither.
The nation - and the common purpose that came with it - is rapidly becoming a thing of the past, to be replaced with the much-celebrated “communities” we keep hearing so much about. Instead of seeing ourselves as British first and everything else second, we are now Asian, Black, White, Jewish, Muslim, Christian and LGBTQI+ first and little else second.
As for honesty, we shun, ostracise and increasingly set what is left of our police on people who express widely-held views about illegal immigration, the threat of Islamist terrorism, and the failure of multiculturalism—especially if they come from the working class, whose crass ways and ugly sentiments offend the sensibilities of the chattering classes.
I could go on but you get the point. And if you’re reading this in the UK, you live the point.
I see no urgency. When I listen to people of all political persuasions who run this country, they’re all doing their best to pretend that what is happening is normal. A problem to be managed. I assumed this was the face they were putting on for public consumption but, alas, behind closed doors they’re exactly the same.
This is one of the very best qualities of the British psyche: to remain steadfast and calm, no matter the circumstances. The world over, people admire the British when they hear the story of Antarctic explorer Lawrence Oates, who left his tent and walked into a blizzard to certain death because the gangrene and frostbite from which he was suffering were compromising his three companions' chances of survival, doing so with the words “I am just going outside and may be some time".
My point is, the British are a remarkably unexcitable people. As a result, we avoid an awful lot of trouble of the kind that comes with the impulsivity and quickness to action that we see both on the Continent and across the Atlantic. But this is only a strength if you are steadfast and calm while taking action. And that’s the problem: no one really knows what to do.
People say that if Britain was attacked, we’d struggle to get people to enlist to defend it. I think that’s nonsense. If our country went through what the people of Ukraine experienced in February 2022 or what Israel suffered on October 7, I have no doubt there would be millions of young men around this country who would volunteer to serve and millions of others who would support the war effort.
But we’re not in a war. There is no enemy to fight. There is just a creeping, unstoppable malaise. And so we don’t know what to do. Even now, with the wave of enthusiasm that swept through the United States, our equivalent coalition of the anti-woke centre and centre-right is cautiously positive and imperceptibly optimistic."

The above was written by Konstantin Kisin.
What do you think about this and how can we get the country producing again?
Using immigration to prop up the numbers is fool hardy. Most of the low skill immigrant visas tend to have on average 3 dependents. In some countries care visas are being sold for upwards of £15,000 as it cos with visas for all dependents. So to a family of 4 children who want a British education it's a no brainer or if you have a dependent who needs long term medical attention. So many families take out loans to pay unscrupulous agents to get them a certificate of sponsorship with a care home so they can bring their family of 6 in some cases. Housing, schools and GPs are feeling the brunt. These cost money so even if the govt started a huge program of training more carers and supplementing their wage it will still cost less than the cost of education, GPs, pressure on infrastructure etc and be better for the country economically, socially and more in the long run.
Shouldn't we all write out MPs so they can go back to the drawing board and build the country?

OP posts:
Maggispice · 18/12/2024 22:31

lljkk · 18/12/2024 09:20

Tinternet says that "care visas" to enter UK are for people who will be employed in caring professions, must have sponsors , & the visas cost no more than £551. Someone is getting major scammed if they paid £20,000. They probably come from wealthy family & received a much better education than UK average if they can blow £20k like that.

Also can't bring dependents.

xH's company sponsored a skilled computer programmer to emigrate to UK from Turkey. The chap soon quit to work for other companies... he didn't bring dependents & was shocked at how expensive everything was.

What I'm referring to is the illegal payment for COS (Certificate of Sponsorship) by which one then gets the visa to bring as many of one's dependents as one wishes. It isn't wealthy families who do this. Wealthy family use the student visa route, non wealthy families do too. Service jobs, care jobs are not appealing.
So someone sets us a care home, claim they need 15 additional care workers, send word to certain "content" makers etc, agents then find 15 people willing to pay what ever to get the COS to enable them get visas for the whole family. Even those who can't afford it take out loans which they pay off when they arrive and start working. The problem is that many of these paid for COSs have no jobs, so people are now getting stranded and even asking the government to provide housing, allowance etc for them. Everyone who pays for a job knows that it is fishy and should bear the consequences of their actions but this burden will be borne by tax payers. As Thomas Sowell says, the people who pass these laws pay no consequences when they fail.

I won't post links to main forum where they're advertised but here is a link on a report about a young man who made over £1 million selling COS. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c97w1x2deyvo

https://news.sky.com/story/people-left-destitute-after-coming-to-the-uk-on-skilled-worker-visas-only-to-find-theres-no-job-12945498 food banks are being overwhelmed by these recent migrants.
https://www.facebook.com/groups/1231454034168258/posts/1483563125624013/ this poster advertising COS is being called a thief because they view his pricing as suspiciously low.

https://news.sky.com/story/i-felt-scared-but-couldnt-do-anything-the-fake-families-being-smuggled-into-the-uk-12886913 paid £50,000 The fact is Brits are being brainwashed to detest their country but an uncountable amount of billions of people in numerous countries will sell all their possessions to gain entry in to the UK.

https://www.tiktok.com/@dr_lawrence_amoah/video/7270577222317100321

OP posts:
Maggispice · 18/12/2024 22:41

BraveToaster · 18/12/2024 12:02

@Radishknot @TiramisuThief Completely agree. I think rising house prices have been a good distraction and fooled many people into thinking they are better off than they actually are. My husband is from the north and the number of times I've heard his friends and family say "my house earned more than me this year". Rising cost of living and stagnant wages is not something to be happy about.

I do think politicians are using ideology to distract people but it is coming mostly from the right. An example is the US election where Harris said nothing about trans people in her policies or speeches yet Trump spent lots of money on ads telling people that this was a core element of her platform. You see it in this very thread with people talking about how much the government is spending on "illegal" immigrants. It is LEGAL to seek asylum. It is part of an international convention for handling refugees and not something the UK or any country can simply withdraw from. Sure there may be some people who are not refugees trying to abuse the system but you need to process them first to find out. The solution is to speed up the processing so that we can identify these people more quickly and cheaply.

Corporations are in on the distraction as well. My FIL was recently talking about the NI tax increase. While there is an argument for how this impacts small businesses we should not be siding with Tesco over this. They don't HAVE TO pay less, hire fewer, raise grocery prices, but they choose to do so because they don't want to impact their already substantial profits. You should be angry at Tesco for caring so little about its employees and customers, not at Labour. You should be voting for policies that protect consumers and workers, address price gouging, monopolies, etc not falling for Tesco's manipulations and voting for a party that let corporations take advantage of all of us.

I do think there are hard choices to be made and politicians could do a better job at articulating their policies though. Idk if it's a tendency in the UK to not be direct or what. To give an example on a small scale, where I live people complain that there is not enough public transport and traffic is bad. But when the government wants to build a tram, they complain that it will impact the road. I wish someone would plainly say "you can keep things as they are and accept the traffic or you can put up with temporary roadworks to have a better public transport network and hopefully less traffic in the future. Which would you prefer?" Moaning about everything isn't an option. Going back to 70 years ago when there was less traffic (because fewer people could afford cars) isn't an option. A perfect option doesn't exist. But let's have an honest conversation about the pros and cons and make a decision that sets us up well for the future.

If only we could openly have honest conversations but alas! It's no longer allowed by mainstream media and owners of popular social media; backed by certain political parties.

“There are no solutions. There are only trade-offs.”
― Thomas Sowell, A Conflict of Visions: Ideological Origins of Political Struggles

If people in the media cannot decide whether they are in the business of reporting news or manufacturing propaganda, it is all the more important that the public understand that difference, and choose their news sources accordingly.
Thomas Sowell

OP posts:
EasternStandard · 19/12/2024 07:22

I haven't really read the writing but generally if Starmer and co continue with their current direction they'll struggle

4.5 years is a long time. We might end up with more s three way split

Balancedcitizen101 · 21/12/2024 21:27

This is a mostly right wing rant. Economics and made up concepts of growth are meaningless and lead to ongoing inequality and environmental destruction. If we cared about quality of life and equality rather than making billionaires richer then maybe life would be worth living. As for the 'glorious past', this is usually a far right slogan designed to get people to vote for policies from the middle ages. If you want an actually better world that is better for normal people - not just Elon Musk and Jeff Bezos as per the endless growth diarrhoea we are force fed constantly then try more ethical local shopping, donating, volunteering, equality focussed interventionist party voting and supporting your community. There was no glorious past. So just try to make the future better for normal people who aren't billionaires or far right media moguls who run the world.

TooBigForMyBoots · 22/12/2024 00:25

Who would you like to see in government for the next 4 years @Maggispice?

Who do you think would be better at it?

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