Scared of son starting nursery due to covid

[Bongbangbing]

I acknowledge that I've been incredibly lucky and due to this and quite a bit of sacrifice my family has been able to mostly stay at home during COVID. We still go to as many events as we can that are completely outside and did go to some inside things over summer when cases were low. However we haven't been at any indoor events or families houses since Oct last year.

I live with my very elderly mother, I have a son too young to be vaccinated, and I am cev with ongoing extreme shortness of breath.

My son is 3 and due to start the nursery attached to the local school in September. I don't need him to attend (I will be on maternity leave) but I really feel like the social aspect is something he has most missed out on. He's very advanced in every area but I can't provide the experience of socialisation with others his age. He's a great kid and happily wears a mask when we have to go somewhere indoors but I can't expect him to be the only kid at nursery with a mask on. I'm super worried about myself/my mother and the chance of long COVID in general for the whole family. Please don't tell me that we just 'need to learn to live with it', this is something still killing hundreds a day and affecting so many lives with long COVID. I guess I want to hear from people with similar worries to me?

I can't answer your specific question but maybe reassurance, my mat leave ended about a month into the first lockdown. I was able to place my DD in a nursery close to work temporarily as I was a key worker. She attended there all through, until recently when we've changed her to a closer nursery.

Both nurseries have had many many outbreaks of covid, but mainly amongst staff. None of us have picked it up, and from anecdotal feedback any parents of kids that have got it seem to know it's from someone/somewhere else.

I live in a part of Scotland that has consistently high cases. Both DH and I have worked throughout and our roles mean we were on site mixing with people regularly rather than just WFH. None of us have had it.

We have however been constantly low level Ill from all the other bugs that do the rounds at nursery, which I think has contributed to not getting covid! That's unavoidable for kids, they either get it starting nursery or school though unfortunately.

I understand your fears. What about a childminder instead? Smaller group of children, and so presumably a lower chance of covid.

I have blood cancer and have just finished a course of intensive chemotherapy. I’ve been very worried about Covid due to potential delays to treatment as well as the risk to me. Worried to the extent that we kept the DC off school for 2.5 months to get as much of this course of treatment done that we could. This was after discussions with my consultant and the advice she gave.

Once back in school it took 3 weeks for the family to get Covid, so it was the right thing to do to delay! In the same way I agree that there is definitely a risk (but far from a certainty) of your DC bringing it back from nursery. When I caught Covid I was given one of the new treatments (antibodies). Due to the new treatment, getting Covid really wasn’t that bad, certainly not as bad as my fear of getting Covid.

But one of the reasons for trying to delay catching it was to allow some new treatments to be rolled out. So there was a purpose for the delay. If you were to delay your sons nursery start then what then… he’d still have to go to school. What about winter when socialising outside again becomes a problem? it makes it pretty miserable for the whole family to be locked in! (I know, we’ve just done it!). What is your ‘come out of isolation’ plan. As I do think you need one! Only you can say what it is, but you can’t hide forever.

So in your case:
How vulnerable are you, are you on the priority list for the treatments? If you are - results so far are that they’re a game changer. If you aren’t, and I mean this as kindly as I can, it means you’re not in the top at risk group so perhaps examine why you are as nervous as you are.
I appreciate your mum is elderly so it’s worrying but it’s also no longer as dangerous for the elderly when they catch it.

My now 4yo has been fulltime in nursery since they reopened in July 2020, her younger sister was born that month and started fulltime in May last year. We got covid for the first time last week. It was fine.

Honestly, I think at 3yo having lived most of his life under pretty strict restrictions, I would be prioritising nursery now unless you have a doctor stridently telling you not to. I know you don't want to hear that we will have to learn to live with covid, but the reality is that we will and your DC will need to go to school and live his life. Hold off if there's a real reason (like the poster above who had a specific treatment plan in mind) but otherwise I think it's probably time to go for it.

My little one has been going to nursery since Aug last year we haven’t had covid. We also go to soft play, people’s houses, cinemas, swimming and anything else indoors that we fancy and still haven’t had it. You are restricting your child far too much so yes I would send them to nursery, children are missing out on vital socialisation due to their parents fear of covid. It’s going no where so it’s time to start thinking about getting back to normal life, assuming you have been vaccinated so your risk is low even as a CV person. Also I think making a 3 year old wear a mask is unacceptable so I wouldn’t even consider making him do it at nursery!

Please don’t make your 3 year old wear a mask, it’s cruel.

Im trying to be open minded but I really don't see how it's cruel. I ask him do you mind wearing one and he says no and happily wears it. How is that different to any other piece of clothing except that this actually might make a difference to the outcome of his life?
If he didn't want to wear it, or if he was at school and the only one wearing it I think you'd have more of a point.

Haven't ever made him wear a mask. He happily wears it just like his hats. Don't see how that is unacceptable just because it's a mask. What am I missing?
I almost died from an extremely rare side effect of my last vaccination (confirmed by Dr as cause, I'm not remotely anti Vax), and I still get out of breath walking up and down stairs or more than a few metres. It's not like my fear comes from nothing.

I think 'restricting my child far too much' is a bit far. I agree that the socialisation aspect isn't ideal but last summer he did all those things you describe and since Oct he's been to plenty of theme parks/playgrounds/the widest range of outside activities. He's also lucky enough to have had my full time attention at home and we do so much stuff together. It's not like I pull him away from other children outside either, I'm happy for him to socialise outside.

It's weird. It feels like overnight the majority of people have just decided we need to live with it. I get the desire to be that way, I just think I'm more cautious than the average person. Like for me, if we can meet in the garden and I can still see you it's not worth the extra risk just to go inside.

It feels odd to be seen as being strict or restrictive because I don't want the people I care most about to end up with debilitating long COVID or worse. It just feels that at the moment being cautious wins when I weigh up each decision, although clearly I feel differently about the importance of my son going school.

Both me and my sibling nearly died at the end of last year (different events and causes) and I just don't know how I could justify it to my son if something happened. Like we could have been more careful but we chose not to.

I don't mean this as a criticism of what you have said, Im more trying to explain my head space and I really appreciate being able to talk to people with different opinions.

Thanks for replying and Im sorry to hear what a rough time you've had.

This is the reply at the moment that's given me the most to think about, so thanks. I think it's a really good idea to have a 'plan' out.

I wouldn't qualify based on the latest list. I think it's hard not to be scared of getting COVID when I'm already very much struggling with my breathing. The drs think my condition has been made worse by being pregnant so perhaps birth would be a good end point.

I find it really alienating that hundreds of people are dying each day, and that so many are ending up with awful complications of long COVID yet it feels people don't seem to care any more. I think that's what I struggle to understand the most.

It’s been made clear over the last year that Covid isn’t going to go away. The majority have made the decision that living life normally outweighs the risks of catching Covid. Personally I’m giving my toddler DC a normal life with lots of opportunities so she has a good start to life and won’t be behind when she starts school. That’s more important to me than worrying about catching Covid.

It feels like overnight the majority of people have just decided we need to live with it.

it’s not overnight, it’s since people realised there’s no end point to covid and it won’t ever go away, so better to enjoy life whilst we can then stay restricted. I wouldn’t wish a restricted life on my DC so I get on with it and don’t worry about Covid.

I do care. I have followed all the rules throughout.
I also care about my children having normal life experiences.
My 3 year old has been at nursery since Feb 2021. He loves it. My children have been at school every day that they’ve been permitted to be.

I get that. The thing is, my son isn't behind in the slightest. He's really advanced. Even socially which is probably his least advanced skill, I don't think you'd be able to pick him from a group. Plus it's not that unusual for a kid to not go to nursery before 3, is it? I'm really proud of all the opportunities he gets particularly since I'm currently disabled. I kind of don't see the value in taking the risk at the moment.

You need to weigh up the positives and negatives of the situation here.

Have you considered his own immunity to general coughs, colds and viruses with leading such a isolated shielding lifestyle?

I also think you will need to think about how you will deal with it when he inevitably gets a nasty virus from nursery, but at the end of the day it will happen at school anyway too, my DD has had everything from nursery, but She is yet to have covid that I am aware of (we were required to get her pcr tested up until very recently everyone she was poorly).

It is swings and roundabouts as one day you will need to deal with him bringing some sort of cold or virus into your household. I say that in a nice way.

I do feel that covid , lockdowns and a "post covid" world has had a huge negative affect on how some people perceive and react to stuff like this now. Not every cough cold or virus will kill you, but people develop immunity to things as you will have from your vaccinations.

I'm wondering if you are just wanting to hear from people with similar views to yourself? I appreciate that you're looking for reassurance with your very real anxiety and the impact that catching Covid could have on your household.

No one is going to force your child to go to nursery, but one day it will be obligatory for them to go to school. I'm wondering what your plan would be for that if Covid is still in the world (which it likely will be)?

I'm also curious as to how you viewed other respiratory illnesses prior to Covid being a thing. I'm not saying that Covid is just another infection, but surely with your condition, any infections coming into your home could have consequences.

I really hope your household manages to avoid Covid, but I am not sure how long you can hold out from your child having a more mainstream level of interaction with others.

I suppose I just don't see any other route out of this. I don't think covid will ever go away and I suspect we'll be at the mercy of the variants for a while yet.

So, while we have a comparatively mild variant and much more knowledge and treatments than the start of the pandemic, I'm happy to broadly go back to normal.

I'm not an idiot. We've had over 30 PCR tests as a family as we've tested for every hint of a symptom. Our 4 year old has just tested positive the day after the rest of us were released so as a household we're looking at over 20 days isolation for a cold - because we know it's not just a cold for everyone.

Some things I think you should consider (and I know tone is hard to convey in text, so please believe me when I say I'm posting with kind rather than aggressive intentions):

1. If your son were older would you be keeping him off school?

1. Given your family's health, what action would you take during a severe flu season?

1. If nothing changes re covid and Omicron continues to circulate at the current rate, when and what would you need to see in order to go back to something closer to normal?

1. If your job couldn't be done from home (nurse, teacher, shop assistant) what do you think would have happened and what would life look like now?

I think you should have a chat with your GP.

One of the main issues with masking very young children is speech and language development. My DS's nursery said on day 1 that staff would not wear masks because this wasn't in the children's best interest in terms of development and there was never any question of toddlers wearing masks. I have never seen a three year old wearing a mask.

Cloth masks have been shown to be around 7% effective at preventing transmission of previous less infectious covid variants. Surgical masks are meant to be around 9% effective at preventing transmission. There is no real evidence that they protect the wearer, which is presumably what you want. This is even more so the case with toddlers who won't wear them properly and will not have them to eat, drink or for nap times etc. anyway and will be in such close contact with other children and staff at nursery that a mask would really make no difference. Masks do slightly increase carbon dioxide levels in children, particularly if close fitting enough to be effective, and though there is no evidence that they do so to dangerous levels, for something that has essentially no benefit, I don't think that's an acceptable side effect, alongside the detrimental impact on development and the message it is sending to children that they or others are diseased and dangerous.

Children do catch a lot of illnesses when they start nursery. My DS has had maybe 20 cold and respiratory viruses in the last year. Covid was relatively mild compared to some. He's also had norovirus, hand foot and mouth three times and tonsillitis. Chicken pox and scarlett fever and currently going round. I have caught a lot of these including covid (which again wasn't the worst for me). It's difficult - more so for people who are vulnerable I'm sure - but it's also a necessary part of building up an immune system and children have to go through this at some point. The IFR of covid post vaccination is very similar to that of flu now - covid is just more prevalent so I don't think there's really any fundamental difference between covid and all the other things which children can bring home. On the flipside DS gets huge benefit from nursery and I have been so grateful that it has given him some normality given how abnormal a lot of his first two years were.

No not at all. I think it's useful to hear all points of view. Do you think I'm being defensive? If so, that isn't my intention, rather I'm trying to explain where my head is at too.

I want him to go to nursery and school. That's why I'm posting this now so I've got time to process my feelings on it. School/nursery feels like a different importance to just an indoor activity, or him not wearing a mask in a shop (again I have never ever made him or even made a deal out of it). I can't see how I've been super restrictive and prevented him from being as well developed as possible as it feels others have suggested, but then again I've not exactly painted a full picture of what we do get up to.

To be fair, I have never been this ill (struggle to breathe when I walk) which is obviously going to impact how I see any respiratory illness. However it is the more unknown factor of COVID that scares me. My son was at nursery until he was 1 and he brought back everything going! COVID feels different because as far as I know, no other cold/flu type illness (particularly one so easily spreadable) has the range of unpredictable long term side effects. I can't equate it with other things in my mind.

For sure his lack of general immunity is something I think about. Another benefit he will get from going to nursery. My son was at nursery when he was younger and brought back everything, it really is just COVID I have an issue with.

Isn't that what makes COVID different? We don't seem to be able to hold immunity to it in the same way as with other viruses. People can get reinfected in a very short time span.

We were shielding as DH is CEV due to COPD.

We sent DD (then aged 4) back to preschool when it reopened in June 2020 as she was going mad at home with no other children to play with. We were genuinely very concerned about her health and development - she'd regressed so much in speech, toilet habits, so many ways and was becoming more and more distressed. Otherwise we've been very cautious - DH barely left the house for 18 months, we had all shopping delivered, we met few people and always outdoors. DH and I are very careful about wearing masks but DD doesn't want to so doesn't.

We eventually did get Covid via school, but not until Jan 2022(!). DD and DH had it so mildly we didn't even realise until I developed symptoms! By then we'd had three jabs each.

We've basically returned to normal now although wear masks inside places and tend to avoid eating inside where we can. I've resumed travelling to work and DH now goes into shops etc.

Thank you, some good questions and I appreciate the challenge to make me think.

1. Perhaps recently (due to personal health) but in general, no. Thats why I know I'm going to send him to nursery at 3, and I think it's a different thing to just an inside activity for example. Risk Vs reward in my head.

1. Vaccination. Am I wrong in thinking that the flu vaccination is a lot more effective at preventing long term issues from flu than COVID? Genuine question. Also for the rest of my family it is the unexpected long term effects I'm worried about more than the immediate dealing with COVID symptoms if that makes sense.

1. That's definitely a question I've been thinking over recently, and also where my nursery question stemmed from. Ties in with the other poster talking about a plan out so to speak. Still pondering this.

1. In 2020 my profession was one of those. I haven't been back since. However this has been due mostly to pregnancy/health issues.

I'll honestly think about it

I dont think it isnt about caring (although I have to say as awful as each is averaging around 150-200 a day isnt hundreds).

But I think it is an acceptance that it isnt going away - that lockdowns are not going to work (see China) so actually there isnt much we can do. As you say if you dont have immunity either so you can recatch it (although that is similar to cold viruses)

What can you do other than send him though? Because it is the right choice for him and that is all you can do.

So many of us have had children at school throughout this and make that choice every day - because we have seen the impact not going had

I think your last paragraph is one you should examine when you consider what you're waiting for. Do you see the situation changing? Do you never want to restart life?