Why are we still wearing masks?

[Couldntrememberthewordbasket]

I’m not in the U.K.

Where I am, we still have to wear masks in the supermarket/petrol stations etc..we’ve never not had to,
The U.K. don’t, right?
Why are we still having to do this? I can’t see it ending, will be so very odd going shopping without masks

@Lockdownbear

We don't really have any restrictions

No we don't have any restrictions.
Nightclubs are shut.
Not suppose to meet with more than 3 households.
Schools aren't allowed to mix classes, hold parties or assemblies.
Parents aren't allowed inside the school or nursery buildings.
Nursing homes still have restricted visiting.
Shops are back to operating one way systems And social distancing.
Kids are in masks all day.
Libraries have closed.

But naw we don't have restrictions.

I've been clear in previous posts that I'm referring to England (but apologies, I made the mistake of forgetting some people are new to these discussions on here).

a time traveller from 2019 were to arrive they'd be gobsmacked.

They would indeed. 100s killed every week and many more disabled. Much of it preventable with simple mitigations in place in other countries (masks, vaccine passes, HEPA filters/corsi-rosenthal boxes).

There is very little evidence that masks are making any difference.

Not true. FFP2 or 3 masks (N95s) worn properly (including not on the chin or under the nose) do make a difference.

Scotland's figures were lower than England. The devolved nations tried to do the right thing but they're hampered by limited powers. Didn't help matters, for example, when loads of Scots and Welsh people went over the border on NYE to bring back SARS-COV-2 infections as a January present for Scotland and Wales.

They would indeed. 100s killed every week and many more disabled. Much of it preventable with simple mitigations in place in other countries (masks, vaccine passes, HEPA filters/corsi-rosenthal boxes)

Leaving aside for a moment the issue of evidence for any of these things preventing 'much' of the deaths and morbidity from Omicron, I note you don't acknowledge the point about isolation rules being a clear and significant restriction.

That day was a long time ago

In East Asia, maybe. Hopefully.

Don't know what the crossed fingers are for.

Wishing for an end to the avoidable situation of 100s a week being killed, and many more newly disabled with Long Covid.

note you don't acknowledge the point about isolation rules being a clear and significant restriction.

I guess it's subjective. I call temporary short-term quarantine, when potentially carrying a new (possibly not completely natural) disease that kills and disables many, a basic common sense mitigation.

The pandemic is real. SARS-COV-2 is real, as is the sometimes very serious long-term effects of Long Covid.

Whenever there's a serious threat to life and health (fire, flood, deadly disease) temporary measures/mitigations are put in place.

Now, banning the freedom of smokers to exercise the government's beloved personal responsibility and individual risk assessment, eg. to smoke in public indoor spaces? That is a restriction.

Covid rates per nation.
Following each other very closely.
Let's not forget we covid isn't going to disappear people actually need to build immunity to it, we cannot vaccinate people every 6 mths.

Not true. FFP2 or 3 masks (N95s) worn properly (including not on the chin or under the nose) do make a difference.

But those aren't worn by the majority of people?

We owe it to our young people to take simple mitigations. Masks, vaccine passes, good ventilation (HEPA filters and corsi-rosenthal boxes).

www.camdennewjournal.co.uk/article/long-covid-help-me-get-my-life-back

@Blubells

Not true. FFP2 or 3 masks (N95s) worn properly (including not on the chin or under the nose) do make a difference.

But those aren't worn by the majority of people?

Yes the messaging needs to change.

@Tealightsandd

note you don't acknowledge the point about isolation rules being a clear and significant restriction.

I guess it's subjective. I call temporary short-term quarantine, when potentially carrying a new (possibly not completely natural) disease that kills and disables many, a basic common sense mitigation.

The pandemic is real. SARS-COV-2 is real, as is the sometimes very serious long-term effects of Long Covid.

Whenever there's a serious threat to life and health (fire, flood, deadly disease) temporary measures/mitigations are put in place.

Now, banning the freedom of smokers to exercise the government's beloved personal responsibility and individual risk assessment, eg. to smoke in public indoor spaces? That is a restriction.

It isn't subjective. You saying why you think it's necessary is an entirely different point to whether it's a restriction. What you are actually arguing is that it's a legitimate restriction.

There isn't any sensible definition of the concept of restrictions that could possibly exclude criminal sanctions for not isolating that potentially affect millions of people.

[quote Tealightsandd]We owe it to our young people to take simple mitigations. Masks, vaccine passes, good ventilation (HEPA filters and corsi-rosenthal boxes).

www.camdennewjournal.co.uk/article/long-covid-help-me-get-my-life-back[/quote]
Vaccine passes? In what way do they help?

@Tealightsandd

Hopefully the messaging, for England at least, will be changing to masks are personal choice again soon. Plan B restrictions come to an end on the 26th, unless extended.

Not true. FFP2 or 3 masks (N95s) worn properly (including not on the chin or under the nose) do make a difference.

But that's not what's being worn by the majority, as you well know.

actually need to build immunity to it, we cannot vaccinate people every 6 mths.

You cannot know at this still early stage, if it's possible to 'build immunity' to it, and certainly not how long that might take (years? decades?).

Further down the line we'll have better knowledge and understanding, more of the rest of the world vaccinated (morally the right thing to do, but also reduced risk of dangerous variants). And wider availability of the new treatments. The antivirals and the monoclonal antibodies like sotrovimab.

Meanwhile, dead people can't build immunity, and others like the poor young man in the article above have been left long-term disabled.

Vaccines help build immunity. No, we can't keep boosting all the time, but we can (as the experts including the WHO say), eventually use a multi variant aimed vaccine (which is what they're working on).

In the meantime, because we're not there yet, we take simple and easy mitigations. Which obviously aren't 100% effective but work to mitigate eg. reduce unnecessary risks.

That is, if we want to keep the economy running successfully (and without mass body pile ups) and get back as much normality as is possible during the extraordinary circumstances of a pandemic.

@TheKeatingFive

Not true. FFP2 or 3 masks (N95s) worn properly (including not on the chin or under the nose) do make a difference.

But that's not what's being worn by the majority, as you well know.

Indeed. Hence the need to change the messaging re how to wear masks, etc.

I'm in ROI where we have vaccine passports, a mask mandate and an 8pm curfew for all hospitality/entertainment venues.

And right now we have the highest (or very close) covid rates in the world.

So let's engage with reality a little here.

Those who want to do the FF masks should go for it.

Soon the mandate will drop and people can choose what to do.

Indeed. Hence the need to change the messaging re how to wear masks, etc.

I totally agree so long as it shifts to a personal choice.

[quote 2X4B523P]@Tealightsandd

Hopefully the messaging, for England at least, will be changing to masks are personal choice again soon. Plan B restrictions come to an end on the 26th, unless extended.[/quote]
Sadly yes you're probably right that this is what will happen.

But, why don't you want simple mitigations like masks?

Do you want 100s of often avoidable deaths a week, and many more long-term Long Covid disabled?

Long Covid disability is a ticking time bomb future scandal.

@TheKeatingFive

Indeed. Hence the need to change the messaging re how to wear masks, etc.

I totally agree so long as it shifts to a personal choice.

Well that didn't happen with smoking (which unlike SARS-CoV-2 actually boosts the economy), nor seat belts, speeding limits, and drink driving but...

@MarshaBradyo

Those who want to do the FF masks should go for it.

Soon the mandate will drop and people can choose what to do.

What will happen (in England) and what should happen are two completely different things.

Yes you are right that sadly the bodies will continue to pile up or become disabled here. Less so in other more moral and sensible countries.

History will judge.

Well that didn't happen with smoking (which unlike SARS-CoV-2 actually boosts the economy), nor seat belts, speeding limits, and drink driving but...

As I said in my earlier post, I don't think any of those involve a similar level of imposition on the general population. It's is literally no impingement at all on people's lives to wear a seatbelt.

@Tealightsandd

No I don’t want people to die but there has to be a balance. Many people don’t have any issue with masks but others do, people who struggle whilst not fitting the definition of being exempt. Just for one example, people who are deaf or hard of hearing and who need to lip read. If their accompanied by someone then that someone is exempt but that doesn’t help for all the other people they come into contact with on a day to day basis.

Well that didn't happen with smoking (which unlike SARS-CoV-2 actually boosts the economy), nor seat belts, speeding limits, and drink driving but...

It already has for masks, we’ve had a range of responses, so why you think it won’t revert is odd.

Plan b will end pretty soon.

Bad luck if you are holding onto seat belt law but it will change.