5-11 vaccination

[LoudSnoringDog]

Is this age group highly likely to get the vaccine? I can see online that vulnerable children in this age group will but it's not clear as far as I can see re healthy children?

[quote unim]Anyone who thinks that children do not get seriously ill with Omicron needs to take a look at the latest figures from the goverment data on hospitalisations.

889 children have been hospitalised with Covid in the last week in England. Up from 778 children the week before. You can compare this on the graph to previous figures.

There is also quite a lot of good data on the risk Long Covid in children - including in those who get Covid mildly initially - and increasingly solid data on Long Covid risks across the population.

twitter.com/Antonio_Caramia/status/1480626665311059971[/quote]
but vaccination is not going to help with the current omicron wave is it? the only thing that would reduce the rates at present would be going back into a very severe lockdown (and we have previously had the head of the royal college of paediatrics highlighting that lockdowns present more risk to children's health than Covid itself). I do get that the hospitalization figures look scary (and would highlight like other posters have said that incidental findings of covid in children admitted for non-covid reasons will be high whilst omicron levels are high) but the actual paediatric bed occupancy hasn't gone up though? I think it is right to highlight the impact of long covid and other health impacts of the virus(only a fool would say that covid has no impact on children whatsoever and hence why I understand that access to vaccines for children is considered very important to some people) but again the hospitalisation data is highest in the under 5's, none of whom are currently eligible to be vaccinated anyway.

I hope so, so that my 10 year old can visit his CEV adult brother.

@Pluckyduck @Nappyvalley15

If you look at page 9 of the report, which focuses on new admissions among children, you will see a breakdown of whether admissions are FOR Covid or WITH Covid.

The report quite rightly points out that this is a complex topic as admission for another reason, but with Covid, may have been exacerbated by Covid.

The figures also make it clear that by any standards a large number of these children are being admitted FOR Covid:

"Per Tables 4-5, about 60% of admissions statewide were indicated with the reason “for COVID-19”; this has not changed since the Omicron-associated increase in cases and hospitalization began. This is consistent with adult trends, and those recorded months earlier."

health.ny.gov/press/releases/2022/docs/pediatric_covid-19_hospitalization_report.pdf

@s1h2o3na Yes, you are quite right, it wouldn't have an immediate result. It's a shame they didn't do it last year like most other countries! But if they act now, children can be fully vaccinated before the next winter.

It's just a shame that case numbers have been allowed to get so astronomically high while children remained unprotected. And that there is no risk mitigation in schools. It's almost like they want children to get it, which is unethical given what we know about the risks to children.

If kids could be vaccinated today, there would be protection in 2 weeks and yes, that probably would help with the current wave given schools have only just reopened and children are just starting their Omicron wave, we'll be several weeks from peak I think. But it would probably also save the health of a hundreds if not thousands of children who would otherwise be very ill, in hospital, have a traumatic life experience and possibly long term consequences.

Bit of a shame that the mass (lack of) 'herd immunity' from all those kids off sick with Delta from Sept-December isn't stopping the Omicron wave. Not like it wasn't predicted though.

The data from the US on the protection vaccination offers to kids seems pretty clear to me (the breakdown of kids hospitalised who are unvaccinated vs vaccinated).

The lack of risk mitigation in schools is of course part of the problem, but schools have been off for at least 2 weeks over Christmas. Normally rates in children go down during school holidays but that doesn't seem to have happened this time (I think attributable to Omicron), so goodness only knows what's going to happen by mid-Jan when they've all been mixing in schools for two weeks or more.

And the data is on 0-5 year olds and 5 year olds have a safe vaccine available in most other countries.

I'd very much like to get my 5 year old vaccinated but am being forced into a position of sending her into a high risk environment without any protection. I'm not ok with that.

You can't draw a straight line comparison between our children and those in New York. We took a different approach which means many of our children were probably exposed to wild covid last year.

"It's just a shame that case numbers have been allowed to get so astronomically high while children remained unprotected. And that there is no risk mitigation in schools. It's almost like they want children to get it, which is unethical given what we know about the risks to children."

This. Also, many primary kids have younger siblings, pregnant mums etc.

@theemperorhasnoclothes

If kids could be vaccinated today, there would be protection in 2 weeks and yes, that probably would help with the current wave given schools have only just reopened and children are just starting their Omicron wave, we'll be several weeks from peak I think. But it would probably also save the health of a hundreds if not thousands of children who would otherwise be very ill, in hospital, have a traumatic life experience and possibly long term consequences.

Bit of a shame that the mass (lack of) 'herd immunity' from all those kids off sick with Delta from Sept-December isn't stopping the Omicron wave. Not like it wasn't predicted though.

The data from the US on the protection vaccination offers to kids seems pretty clear to me (the breakdown of kids hospitalised who are unvaccinated vs vaccinated).

The lack of risk mitigation in schools is of course part of the problem, but schools have been off for at least 2 weeks over Christmas. Normally rates in children go down during school holidays but that doesn't seem to have happened this time (I think attributable to Omicron), so goodness only knows what's going to happen by mid-Jan when they've all been mixing in schools for two weeks or more.

"""The data from the US on the protection vaccination offers to kids seems pretty clear to me (the breakdown of kids hospitalised who are unvaccinated vs vaccinated).""""

yes but what percentage of kids do you think are vaccinated in the USA? this is where stats really have to be number crunched by people who have far more knowledge than me ....according to the date linked before its not simply thinking its 4% vaccinated versus 91% not vaccinated, you have to calculate the percentages of 4% vaxxed admissions in relation to the 16 % of kids in NY who are fully vaxxed compared to the 91% of unvaxxed admissions in relation to the 84% of children who aren't fully vaxxed. Do you see what I mean? In addition, half of those admitted with symptoms in that report had co-morbidities. Those who will be at the forefront of choosing to get their kids vaccinated will be the parents of those kids who have comorbidities that put them at additional risk of covid, and who would be strongly advised by medics to vaccinate...so to truly get a picture of the risk to otherwise healthy children you need to exclude this group from the stats. Again this isn't to underestimate the issue of children being admitted and becoming very unwell with covid but its to highlight that its not always a straightforward situation and why we don't have much choice about relying on the scientific guidance that we get.
The other comment I have is they've been fairly clear when encouraging people to get their boosters is that 1 or 2 doses is fairly unlikely to stop omicron infection so even if all kids were suddenly given 1 jab now would this have any impact on the numbers of children getting it? they have also said that the omicron peak is fairly likely to be quickly up then down as its just so transmissable.
The pfizer booster that is being tailored specifically to omicron is available from around march so the story may yet be different in the next 6 months or so .

*@theemperorhasnoclothes
*
But it would probably also save the health of a hundreds if not thousands of children who would otherwise be very ill, in hospital, have a traumatic life experience and possibly long term consequences.

This is very extreme and dramatic and very unlikely!

I am really not seeing many very sick traumatised children admitted where I work, and I very much doubt I will.

[quote rambleonplease]*@theemperorhasnoclothes
*
But it would probably also save the health of a hundreds if not thousands of children who would otherwise be very ill, in hospital, have a traumatic life experience and possibly long term consequences.

This is very extreme and dramatic and very unlikely!

I am really not seeing many very sick traumatised children admitted where I work, and I very much doubt I will. [/quote]
For unvaccinated children, we are looking at about c1.0% of them with post-infection health problems (morbidity).

10 million children = 100,000 with longer term health problems

So the numbers she quoted are correct.

Well for me I don't see the point of DS having a vaccine. We've all just had Covid, he was unwell for 2 days like every other virus he's had. We are vaccinated and still caught / transmitted Covid - I think the vaccines are helpful in preventing hospitalisations but not necessarily to prevent transmission.

I'm genuinely curious about parents' thoughts regarding travel. I'm. It keen on vaccines for children either but I fear that many countries will require children (certainly 12 plus) to be double jabbed. Unless these restrictions will soon be removed?

I'm. It keen on

Sorry I'm not keen on

I'd absolutely like my children to have the vaccination.

If we lived somewhere like New Zealand or Hong Kong, where transmission was low, I probably wouldn't as it is a new vaccine. However with case rates as high as they've been in the UK, and with the peace of mind that comes with knowing how many children in the US and Europe have also been vaccinated without serious side effects, I'd say it would be worth it to avoid the risks of Covid.

Also of course we have now seen how those who had Delta have still caught Omicron anyway and herd immunity doesn't seem to be the panacea it was touted as - the full vaccination course is more robust than relying on natural immunity from infection.

I'm concerned by how many people we know who are suffering from long Covid even if they had the initial infection mildly.

I'm absolutely not a 'vaccinate at all costs' parent - there are actually a couple of vaccines that I've chosen not to give the kids out of the usual selection.

But their chances of catching Covid at school and nursery are so high, and there are risks involved that can be avoided with vaccination.

@Lalalablahblahblah

My 7 year old is now isolating after testing positive with covid for the 2nd time in just over a month. Tested + Dec 7th, finished isolating 17th Dec. Just tested + again today. So that's another week of school lost. They have to either start vaccinating kids or cancel isolation for them. It's bloody ridiculous otherwise. He's not getting any work set during isolation either because his teacher is currently ill with covid. Half his class are out sick today.

Don’t you wait before testing again? I really can’t remember tbh

I hope he’s ok, does he have symptoms?

I can't see it now but think someone here said that to enter the USA an 11 Yr old would need to be vaccinated. Not true. CDC website states under 18s are exempt from Vax requirements, they do need a test 24 hours before as everyone does. And some cities do limit indoor dining and activities to only those who are vaxxed.

Also only around 20 per cent of US kids are actually vaccinated, that's not a huge number, so I can't see the US limiting children travelling in who haven't been vaxxed either. It would be terrible for their summer tourism.