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‘Flexible use of support staff in keeping lessons face to face’

261 replies

Skinnyfrappewithmilk · 03/01/2022 09:08

One of the points made by the education sec for return to school this week.

Are they planning on paying a decent wage for support staff then?! I’m a TA and having to claim UC as my wage is so poor, quite frankly it’s an insult.
I’m so angry reading that…our pay and conditions are already awful, I can’t quite believe the cheek of it.

OP posts:
clarepetal · 03/01/2022 14:32

@Frazzled2207

I’m not a teacher but I think it’s horrendous.

No TA should have to step up unless they are appropriately paid

Thankyou. I'm a TA and will be furious if am expected to do this, I'm not paid enough.
rrhuth · 03/01/2022 14:35

@Blubells

Instead, 2022 will be a transition year to reflect that we are in a pandemic recovery period and students’ education has been disrupted. In 2022 we will aim, therefore, to reflect a midway point between 2021 and 2019. In 2023 we aim to return to results that are in line with those in pre-pandemic years.
Is this the 'pandemic recovery period' given we have a new variant, potential need for 4th jab, overwhelmed NHS and widespread staff absences Shock ?
Headingnorthwoste · 03/01/2022 14:38

Totally agree with stopping Ofsted inspections and redeploying inspectors (although aren’t many already teachers? My sister is an inspector and head of dept).

Please remember that teaching assistants are fairly new in education. It’s only really since new labour in 1997 that schools acquired TAs. Before then, parent helpers popped in to do group reading / help with trips etc. Perhaps the 1:1 TAs weren’t needed back then as more SEND CYP went to special schools?

I’m not saying TAs don’t do an important and essential job, I fully value them, but the education system in this country did function without them in the 1990s. I personally didn’t suffer from never having a TA in any of my primary and secondary classes... I remember a parent listening to me read once in a while. Otherwise it was just one teacher in charge of 30+ pupils. Myself and peers turned out ok! We were in a challenging area where we had runners and social problems, but the staff seemed to manage. Rose tinted glasses maybe!

UncomfortableSilence · 03/01/2022 14:42

@MrsHamlet

I'm excited to see the school business manager have a go. He could do a bit of maths. The IT support staff could have a go at computer science.
I don't mind teaching a few lessons on managing budgets Grin

Unfortunately I will be the only member of our finance team of 4 going back tomorrow as everyone else is isolating so I will be trying to cover 3 roles along side my own. Obviously the DfE haven't realised that all the support staff who also will potentially be off will need their roles covered too?

MrsHamlet · 03/01/2022 14:43

@UncomfortableSilence our SBM has apoplexy if he has to deal with one child 🤣

I think "haven't realised" should be the DfE tagline..

mumsneedwine · 03/01/2022 14:44

@Headingnorthwoste TAs have improved the educational opportunities for children with SEN so so much. In the old days these students were pretty much ignored. Now they have a chance of success. TAs are awesome.

Headingnorthwoste · 03/01/2022 14:44

Just to add, I agree that TAs are not paid enough and we need much more funding going into schools. But that’s a longer term issue.

liveforsummer · 03/01/2022 14:46

I’m not saying TAs don’t do an important and essential job, I fully value them, but the education system in this country did function without them in the 1990s. I personally didn’t suffer from never having a TA in any of my primary and secondary classes... I remember a parent listening to me read once in a while. Otherwise it was just one teacher in charge of 30+ pupils. Myself and peers turned out ok! We were in a challenging area where we had runners and social problems, but the staff seemed to manage. Rose tinted glasses maybe!

Rise tinted glasses yea, but also most of the dc TA's are dealing with, like you say will have been in special schools. That or excluded long ago.

Headingnorthwoste · 03/01/2022 14:48

@mumsneedwine totally see that. We didn’t have any CYP with complex SEND at my mainstream schools though (80s/90s), the kids who had SEND when I was at school wouldn’t have qualified for an ECHP or 1:1 support. I think the numbers of CYP with ECHPs is much lower than SEN statements. I know in our county special schools have closed and more complex send going to mainstream schools.

liveforsummer · 03/01/2022 14:49

Our BM actually isn't bad. When there she'll cover the lunch hall, playground and you can leave an errant child with her if SLT are all busy (with other errant dc) however she works from home most days now so not much help regularly

SummerBluez · 03/01/2022 14:51

I work in a secondary school as PA to the Principal. I will not be being used as a stand in teacher, there's no way.

ldontWanna · 03/01/2022 14:51

[quote mumsneedwine]@Headingnorthwoste TAs have improved the educational opportunities for children with SEN so so much. In the old days these students were pretty much ignored. Now they have a chance of success. TAs are awesome. [/quote]
No matter how awesome we are we're not magical. If I'm in front of the class delivering a lesson, then marking however many books, preparing for the next one I can't also do my 1:1 work, deliver the long list of interventions and group work , deal with the emotional/social side of things etc.

That's the really hilarious thing. We're always told how much we're needed, moved about to make sure a teacher isn't on their own etc, but when I had to do it I had to do it on my own with no support. While also being questioned why x and y didn't happen. I was barely holding on just trying to make things ok.

liveforsummer · 03/01/2022 14:53

We also deal with a lot of medical issues for dc that also, I imagine, wouldn't have previously been able to attend mainstream school. Schools may well have functioned fine without TA's in the past but they certainly couldn't now

UncomfortableSilence · 03/01/2022 15:00

[quote MrsHamlet]@UncomfortableSilence our SBM has apoplexy if he has to deal with one child 🤣

I think "haven't realised" should be the DfE tagline..[/quote]
Grin I actually love being with the kids, lots of our lovely sixth formers regularly pop in and out ( pre Covid ) for help with their charity fundraising. So I wouldn't be averse, anything to keep the kids in school however they're deluded if they think this will work.

DanglingMod · 03/01/2022 15:02

It would be actually criminal if children with health, care and toileting needs as well as those who self-harm, with allergies and are flight risks do not get their allocated 1:1 TAs. Parents must complain and staff should whistle-blow to ensure parents know.

Viciouslybashed · 03/01/2022 15:04

Oh I am so not looking forward to the shit show we are all going back to. Can't wait to see the kids of course but this has the potential to be extremely bonkers and not in a fun way. I am tired just thinking about it.

Sherrystrull · 03/01/2022 15:04

@shortterm

*If the government were honest that this is basically what we are offering I think most parents would feel the same.

But instead it's exams as normal, ofsted as normal and all this whilst having the caretaker with 3 different subject gcse classes in the hall.

The government are completely gaslighting the country again and when kids don't do as well in exams etc they'll blame the teachers - again*

Yes, big difference between infant and junior school pupils with many years left of schooling to catch up having some extra play time and more relaxed learning.

Less acceptable for GCSE and A level students who have been told the marking/grading will be harder than ever this year (to make up for the past 2 years of 'grade inflation') and that exams won't be cancelled nor content removed and that universities will be giving out fewer offers and having even increased the grades required at higher end universities.

But let's send everyone INTO school for their LFT tomorrow/Wednesday morning, not knowing if they have Covid or not, so they can be tested IN school and those who are positive get the opportunity for mass transmission.

It would obviously be better to test AT HOME before bringing the Covid-positive pupils into school. But no, all parents are lying cheats and so all the kids have to be exposed to the Covid-positive cases so someone is able to verify/validate/witness their negative test.

This is really stupid way to start the term and I can't believe schools are agreeing to this. It will kick-start transmission and lead to even more teacher and pupil absences right from the get-go.

Just trust that the majority of families will test at home and the minority who would not have done will still be sending their children in for your witnessed LFTs anyway. So there will be no reduction in transmission

Year 2 and Year 6 children will have to sit their sats in the summer and will be expected to achieve the same grades as a normal year.
bobisbored · 03/01/2022 15:04

I am a TA. My teacher had covid just before Christmas. I covered her absence. My role wasn't covered so I effectively did both my job and hers for the time she was isolating. For no extra money. It's ridiculous.

Viciouslybashed · 03/01/2022 15:05

@DanglingMod

It would be actually criminal if children with health, care and toileting needs as well as those who self-harm, with allergies and are flight risks do not get their allocated 1:1 TAs. Parents must complain and staff should whistle-blow to ensure parents know.
You aren't wrong but most schools only have one to one tas to cover. I know you know that but not sure the govt give a fuck.
Sandynorm · 03/01/2022 15:07

@liveforsummer

Fwiw I did do lots of cover during closures but it was a case of supervising pre set work for a much smaller group (albeit all in the vulnerable or asn category so not still without challenges). At the time though no one was pretending it was any more than glorified childcare. I didn't mind that but full classes on top of my current duties - no thanks
'Preset work' still means the qualified teaching staff planning, preparing and differentiating the tasks.

I agree that supervision of whole classes is outside the normal remit of support staff (who are not employed as cover supervisors), but covering a lesson with the whole class in the room still does not include the planning, subject specific pedagogy and marking that teachers are skilled in, and doesn't equate to 'doing the teacher's job' that some seem to think this is being asked of support staff and should be paid for beyond the wage paid for covering.

It's baby sitting, or crowd control, not high quality face-to-face education.

Viciouslybashed · 03/01/2022 15:08

Are tas expected to plan too as surely if the teacher is too sick to work they should not be expected to plan.

chocolateisavegetable · 03/01/2022 15:11

"Haven't realised" ... that support staff also get Covid. Just had an update on WhatsApp - only one out of 3 TAs will be in tomorrow (to cover 4 1:1 children, so not sure how she's also going to cover a class).

liveforsummer · 03/01/2022 15:12

'Preset work' still means the qualified teaching staff planning, preparing and differentiating the tasks.

I know that, at no point did I suggest otherwise. I was ok with this situation minding a small group and teachers working from home giving pre planned work. What I'm not ok with is rocking up to find my teacher has been wiped out with covid and having to sort out a class of 30 plus mind my 1:1 and do medical duties. Some of which are not even in my class

liveforsummer · 03/01/2022 15:13

@chocolateisavegetable

"Haven't realised" ... that support staff also get Covid. Just had an update on WhatsApp - only one out of 3 TAs will be in tomorrow (to cover 4 1:1 children, so not sure how she's also going to cover a class).
We had that the last week of term. One TA left for the entire infant department (7 classes 6 kids that need constant 1:1 many more who should have them)
EtInTerraPax · 03/01/2022 15:18

@Blubells

Instead, 2022 will be a transition year to reflect that we are in a pandemic recovery period and students’ education has been disrupted. In 2022 we will aim, therefore, to reflect a midway point between 2021 and 2019. In 2023 we aim to return to results that are in line with those in pre-pandemic years.
This post proves you are a government stooge. Pathetic.