Goady anti vaxxers

[venusmay]

Met with a df yesterday who has refused the vaccines and her dh is the same, they are very vocal about it too. I'm fully vaccinated and have said why I believe it's important in the past but I've not gone on about it. It's about personal choice.

We met to exchange gifts yesterday and she is now completely denying that Covid is an issue at all. They don't watch the news and believe now people shouldn't bother even testing for Covid. Her dd is 7 and df then started talking about a joke video that parodied vaxxers. She got out her phone and showed this to her dd and my dds also came over to look. I quickly distracted them and changed the topic but......how weird? How can you deny the existence of Covid years during a pandemic?

I think changing the subject is the only course of action.

And if that doesn't work, then low or no contact until the monomania has passed

Applies to all forms of monomania, not just this

Yes I agree! They haven't had Covid yet and pointed out that the only people they know who've had it are vaccinated. Very smug about this. I've bitten my tongue because I don't like to argue about it but it did annoy me!

Well what basis is left for the friendship really? She is deliberately undermining you to your own children. That she does it while you're there is goady. She repeatedly expresses a belief which she knows is diametrically opposed to yours and in doing so, must realise this makes you feel uncomfortable. Is this a weird attempt to dominate? I don't think you have much left friendship wise.
That would be it for me.

Not a good friend is she. She doesnt respect your opinion and tried to undermine you.

@venusmay

If you look at a list of online harms - racism, bullying, exploitation is there - so is misinformation.

Personally, I’d end a friendship with someone who has harmful views - whether it’s a racist view/bullying/exploiting others or perpetuating misinformation.

The fact that they also tried to share that harmful view with a child is awful.

I can gradually see a cultural shift against anti vaxxers. They are becoming more of a minority - and I think in a few years time their views will be very much upheld as ‘harmful’ - much in the same way as racism/sexism etc is seen as harmful to others.

I don't think it's that she is against vaccinations for Covid-19 that is the issue. The problem I'd have is that she was so flipping rude!

Everyone has had a choice whether or not to get vaccinated but nobody should be trying to influence your DC.

I’m not an anti vaxxer but you’d be naive to think there wasn’t some manipulation going on. There are billions being made off the back of this pandemic as people take advantage.
This is why people believe all sorts of things when there is a lack of transparency.

@Charles11

I’m not an anti vaxxer but you’d be naive to think there wasn’t some manipulation going on. There are billions being made off the back of this pandemic as people take advantage. This is why people believe all sorts of things when there is a lack of transparency.

Well, lemsip make millions every winter presumably but you don't get people saying colds don't exist. People "believe all sorts of things" because they're ignorant. (original sense of the word) Various factions are preying on this ignorance and feeding it with further lies in the way dubious religious groups prey on those they see as easy meat.

Well, lemsip make millions every winter presumably but you don't get people saying colds don't exist.

Brilliant, love the posters who say - well I'm not an anti vaxxer but....

@Charles11

I’m not an anti vaxxer but you’d be naive to think there wasn’t some manipulation going on. There are billions being made off the back of this pandemic as people take advantage. This is why people believe all sorts of things when there is a lack of transparency.

Exactly what manipulation though? I see a lot of this vague ‘think people! Wake up!’ and ‘control’ or ‘fear’ but never any concrete ‘this is exactly what I think’. What manipulation exactly, and why?

@PAFMO

That Lemsip comment should become a classic.

Brilliant.

You only have to look at some of the pandemic contracts.
Billions of contracts were offered to contacts of mps without competitive tender. It’s quite well known.

Billions as in around £9bn in 2020 alone.

@Charles11 no one is denying that our government are untrustworthy and some very big questions need to be answered over their handling of the pandemic.

HOWEVER - that is no reason to go against the global consensus of medical opinion on Covid, which governments (better and worse than our government) - worldwide - are responding to.

@Charles11

You only have to look at some of the pandemic contracts. Billions of contracts were offered to contacts of mps without competitive tender. It’s quite well known.

A corrupt government (which was corrupt before the pandemic) taking advantage of a pandemic to make money (an old tactic, look up disaster capitalism) is not mutually exclusive with the pandemic actually happening.

@Charles11

You only have to look at some of the pandemic contracts. Billions of contracts were offered to contacts of mps without competitive tender. It’s quite well known.

So they invented a global pandemic?

I believe everyone should have the right to choose regarding vaccine. Just anecdotally though, I know a couple who were so anti-vax and believed Covid was all a huge hoax. They then got it and they’ve both now been vaccinated! Presumably this means they also believe the virus exists now. So for many of these people they will change their tune once they get it which at this rate they probably will at some point.

Lol I never said anyone invented it.
I think you’re jumping the gun.
When there is a lack of transparency and corruption, people will fill the gaps themselves and believe in all sorts of things.
I don’t believe in any of the conspiracy theories but so many people do. It’s better to try to understand why they could be doing that rather than tarring them with the stupid brush.

@Exasperatedhousehunter

I would normally be pro choice, but with people like the couple you know around - I’m inclined to think mandatory should be considered IF - and only if - things get critical.

@Charles11 I agree with you there.

I think our government has been so shit, it’s made people question what is good health advice.

It’s SO important to extrapolate our shit government performance v’s what is good health advice/NHS advice and WHO advice.

The fact that they have been so untrustworthy has made the pandemic very confusing for people.

Having said that - there is no way I’d have wanted Corbyn in power during the pandemic - who was our other potential candidate.

@Beadebaser exactly. At the heart of it all is confusion and the lack of trust in the government to do what’s best for its citizens.

[quote Beadebaser]@Exasperatedhousehunter

I would normally be pro choice, but with people like the couple you know around - I’m inclined to think mandatory should be considered IF - and only if - things get critical.[/quote]
Mandatory vaccination would only entrench anti-vaxx attitudes and isolate them pushing them to further contact with other extreme views. It reinforces the "conspiracy"

Changing the subject is the best approach. Isolating encourages like to gravitate to like, and it's a pretty pointless subject to try and challenge them on. They don't want a balanced discussion, they want to proselytise.

This is different to people who are generally favourable to vaccines with specific concerns making them hesitant.

@Charles11

I’m not an anti vaxxer but you’d be naive to think there wasn’t some manipulation going on. There are billions being made off the back of this pandemic as people take advantage.

Catch yourself on. Next you'll be saying nytol created insomnia 🙄

I think we all need to ignore anti vaxxers.

If we want to end the global pandemic we need to focus our energies on facilitating vaccine roll out to developing countries where very few people have been able to access it. It is these countries which will gestate new variants. We have already seen that with Omicron. So write to your MPs, FCDO etc about this.

We can also continue efforts to encourage and make it easier for disorganised, fearful, generally disconnected people in UK to take a vaccine. Most unvaccinated people in UK have just not got round to it because they are not sure.

Hating anti vaxxers might be emotionally more satisfying, but it is a waste of time and effort. They are not going to change.

@BogRollBOGOF

I’m no expert, but from what I’ve read mandatory does - overall - result in vaccine uptake. And I guess this would be the best scenario if things get very critical.

My gut feeling - and again I’m no expert - is that it won’t happen unless things get really, really bad.

And I don’t think things will get really, really bad.

I’m against mandatory vaccination in normal times, and in a non-emergency situation. But pro in a very critical situation.